This won't work

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8311337/Bosses-battle-furloughed-workers-DONT-want-return-work.html

...and I do understand that the employer holds the cards...in more ways than one.

I was always taught to look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves.
As an analogy to small and large businesses it kind of missed the mark but HMRC themselves admit that they don't go for the jugular too much, as far as the multi-nationals are concerned, due to the fact that it would hurt their reputations if they were to be hauled before the courts.
To compromise, HMRC agrees an amount which is less than the true tax due.
It's a trade off, something not afforded the man on the street.
It's my opinion that big companies and bigger multinationals should pay their whack but I do understand why HMRC act in the manner cited above.
On a teeny tiny scale, it's a bit like sweeteners for being a member of a club or someone who brings business into a company or loyalty cards...

Ah now GabriellaG54 that is entirely different to your original post! and that discussion would be worth a thread of its own.

I do know how payments are made and the procedures that follow, however, if employers have not and do not instigate distancing and sanitising measures (although not mentioned in the article) it would seem that employees should have the right not to return.

It was in the 'unmentionable-on-here rag who interviewed a company boss.

GabriellaG54 it isn’t possible for employees to ‘decline’ to return to work when their employers recall them. Where did you get this duff information from?

Once the employer stops the furlough claim the employee receives nothing . It is paid through the company payroll not direct to the employee and is not in the employees control.

If they refuse to return to work then the disciplinary procedure would start resulting in dismissal.

I think you need to understand the price we pay here in Wales for our free prescriptions and free parking in all hospitals for all and sundry ......we wait three years for a hip operation! Ask anyone in pain for that length of time which they would prefer!

I am so sorry about your son's friend, Paddyanne. There has been so much loss with this awful virus - it is tragic.

The Twitter post you mention is apparently from a spoof account, however. It has been all over Facebook and has been shown to be a 'joke'.

Sorry to hear of the death of your sons friend Paddanne, was it from the same family where a mum died? Its just awful. You are so lucky in Scotland with the stance that Nicola is taking I just wish I could emigrate.
Funny enough I had a message from sister about Scotland and Wales, moaning about the fact they get free prescriptions, University etc. I suggested she contacted her Tory MP and ask why we couldn't have the same. Much respect for Scotland and Wales.............

I'm very sorry to hear that, paddyanne.

according to a twitter post the whole of Scotland is peopled with lazy c---- who're sitting on their fat a---- eating fried mars bars and scrounging English money....
WRONG!! On all counts Scots DO pay tax ,the amount we pay in will certainly pay Furlough payments and more.

Much more important is the lives we'll save by keeping lockdown until its reasonably safe to lift restrictions .Too late for my friends son who died aged just 34 from CV yesterday.

Grannyjay said "You took a beating on this thread GabriellaG54, well done you held your own. Some would have crawled into a corner on this one."

This is one of the good things about GabriellaG54's posts.
She doesn't start clutching her pearls or moaning about being bullied if people don't agree with her. I don't agree with the implication in the op, and I am not afraid to disagree with GabriellaG54 because I know she will take disagreement in her stride.

I was asking for an explanation as to how the government would pay all unemployed individuals, as obviously discrimination would rear it's head if divisions were made between all the different reasons for people being unemployed.

No you weren't. Your opening post makes very specific reference to those on the furlough scheme. The otherwise unemployed do not get anything like 80% of their income.

My point is about discrimination between groups of people unemployed for different reasons - a point that you countered by suggesting that those who are unemployed for reasons unconnected with the virus may have been sacked or deliberately left their employment. Please don't twist things.

I think \GG you need to question why large companies and the multi rich are able to claim and why some large companies don't pay their share of tax. Why go for the little people who are just trying to make ends meet and keep a roof over their heads. And I might say its rather boastful to say I listen to the news more than most. Proof please.

Oh I read it apparently it's someone who has been told by others that they have workers who want to stay furloughed. Mmm ever heard of chinese whispers.
Many office workers cannot go back because their office is not big enought to socially distance, cafes etc remain closed. Small businesses can't socially distance sometimes because of space or the tasks involved. If you are older or have health conditions you probably wouldn't want to go back and why should you put your life at risk?
This post is simply benefit scroungers under another name. There's no proper evidence.

My son-in-law has been furloughed as his firm have no work coming in and he is looking after 3 and 6 year old sons while daughter works over 40 hours a week as a nurse. He has had NO MONEY at all since the end of March and they have a mortgage to pay. No idea when the furlough 80% is likely to arrive. Yes there must be some idlers but that's the same in pre Covid days.

Any comments on the fact that it is employers who are in control of who gets furlough pay,and when, GG54?

You took a beating on this thread GabriellaG54, well done you held your own. Some would have crawled into a corner on this one.

I live alone so no-one to pass anything on to.

I had the virus between Dec 3rd (when symptoms first showed) and Mid March when the cough finally left and I started to feel better.
111 told me in 3 calls over that time, not to go to my GP but sleep and plenty of drinks.
They said it was winter virus.

No. I am not working Eloethan
I stopped when I was 68 although I was eligible for state pension at 60.

By the way, I've just read that you can now employ your cleaner (if you have one) to do your house. Ain't that grande? Not if you're shielding or have symptoms, obviously but it seems a tad wrong when you can have a stranger (who does not have to wear gloves or mask) come into your home, but you son/daughter etc can't.
That is because the cleaner is working, that's the difference.
Their employer, if they work for an agency, may require them to wear gloves ? and plastic overshoes for their own safety and householders are requested to leave all inner doors ? open so they don't have to have the handles repeatedly cleaned whilst she is working. Also the 2 metre rule still applies.
Is that a reason to be joyful?
We'll no doubt read what others who miss their cleaners, have to say ?? ??

Employers claim the furlough allowance, and pass it on to staff.

So if an employer does not claim it, the member of staff does not get it.

As soon as an employer has made suitable arrangements for an employee to re-start work, they should notify the employee and the Government of this so that furlough money is stopped for that person and paid employment restarts.

I know of many people - and not just older people - on this site and others, and within the circle of people I know, who are absolutely terrified of leaving their homes - even to go for a walk in the open air.

We have been instructed continuously for several weeks to STAY HOME - a message many people felt so seriously about that they spent an inordinate amount of time worrying about their neighbours' activities, disinfecting their shopping, etc, etc. The advice to stay home seemed, for many people, to override the other message that people could leave their homes for the purpose of exercise, provided the prescribed distance was observed. Ambiguity of message, in my opinion, causes mistrust and fear, and creates feelings of confusion and helplessness. It is no wonder that many people are very anxious - for themselves and their families - about leaving the supposed safety of their homes.

Are you actually still working Gabriella? If you were working in a factory, a shop, a library, a warehouse or any other enclosed space is it possible you might be afraid of working in close proximity to other people, possibly catching the virus and taking it home to other members of your family? There have been so many mixed messages (eg 2 metres distance is vital/maybe 1 metre would be sufficient) and confusing instructions (eg leaving the home is dangerous/you can go out for exercise), etc, etc, it has led to feelings of uncertainty and mistrust.

I expect there will be some people who try it on, but I think the vast majority of people recognise we have to get back to "normal" if jobs are to be saved. I would imagine most people are really worried that they may not have a job to go back to but are torn between wanting to get back and being afraid to - particularly when they are told to try and avoid public transport (which for many people is totally impractical).

The government isn't paying this money out of the goodness of its heart. The whole virus emergency has been handled very badly - and this seems to be the opinion of most of the worldwide press - and the government needs to try and preserve at least some of the economy in order to try and stave off a terrible depression and rising public unrest.

I never was one for the hard route geekesse
No plaudits to be had for putting yourself through unnecessary torture.
Empathy is draining as it requires putting oneself in another person's shoes, so to speak, but not only that, it requires the ability to actually feel the feelings of the other person, unlike sympathy which is easier to project.
I see no value to either party if I were to feel as dispirited as the individual nor could I truly feel their feelings if I were in a better situation. It would be wrong and a lie to say I understood how they felt.
I do what I can action-wise as words are easier than actions.