Are you intending to see your family this Christmas come what may, or if there are restrictions will you abide by them ?

No family Christmas dinner for us and we are all in agreement about it. We are hoping that we can have some sort of picnic outside at some point, but that is weather dependent and tier dependent so we will wait and see.

I have a friend of many years, who, like me, lives alone. She has been isolating through no choice of her own, so I plan to self- isolate for two weeks before Christmas so that her son can bring her to me for Christmas. If allowed, my sister, who lives nearby, will meet us in a restaurant on Christmas Day and spend Boxing Day with us in my home.

My daughter will not come near because she looks after her grandchildren, who are at school. She is scared of passing something on to me. She is quite convinced, from hearing others’ opinions, that, whatever the rules, families will spend Christmas together and cause a spike in January.

We have to adjust our expectations from time to time. When Covid began, I thought it'd be over by the summer, then the winter. Next, with the prospect of vaccination, I thought maybe by Christmas or the spring.

I watched Andrew Marr this morning, with Ugur Sahin - and he thinks by this time next year we'll have defeated it! Such a long time to live a different life but I'll wait it out.

Our immediate, extended and in law families are luckily in agreement. We won't mix if the R rate remains high. Christmas will be different this year but we will make the best of what we can.

Me too MOnica I’ll be daeing as I’m telt within the guidelines and keeping everyone safe. We’ll meet up soon I’ve no doubt.

There’s my dh back in from hanging the washing out he’s blooming freezing ( what’s he like?) my mans a real gem my ds is still in bed -thought she came to help out only when it suits oh well beggars can’t be choosers as they say. Have a nice day everyone be kind to yourself and others less fortunate.

We will be doing nothing to endanger anyone else so no mixing but may go for a drive in the country for a walk if it's not raining.
That may be breaking rules.

Glad to hear you’re mood has lifted maddy. I think it will be a beacon of hope for many grans here.
We all need something to look forward to as it’s been a hard year.

Thank you for kind words cornergran, I’m feeling better this afternoon. I hope you’re feeling okay too. We do have the good news of a virus today, so that gives us hope. For me, I need to see light at the end of a tunnel, the vaccine is a light.

Do not know where the last two words came from. I am thinking deeply about them!

Is there anyone who thinks the pandemic is effectively over? I also suspect that even if everybody abides by the rules all the time the pandemic will still be with us for some time. The main purpose of the rules is to spread the load on the hopsitals, not reduce the pandemic.

Viruses find ways of spreading and they mutate - we already have a mutated version with mink as the vector species in Denmark and looking at the effect it is having on the economy and on national debt, there has to be a trade off between the infection and complete economic collapse.

I think

I agree with Ilovechheese - my DDs have lost their Dad this year. In no way would I do anything at all related to them that might result in my death or serious illness - and especially anything that might make them wonder if their actions were to blame.

If I get it from going shopping or whatever, that is down to me. If I get it from contact with them, they might be left feeling it was down to them.

To those who think the pandemic is "effectively over" I would say: it could be TRULY over if people would abide by the rules all the time - Christmas or no Christmas.

I feel the same today maddyone, just going with it for now. Please don’t give yourself a hard time, we’re coping with something unthinkable a year ago, bound to be down times. Sending a hug.

Thank you Hetty for kind words, I’m just having a bad day today. We’ve been flung back into lockdown (from a Tier One area so we had relative freedom) and it’s just affected my mood and made me feel low and teary. Others have it worse , their families live abroad.

I've just consulted google. There are several reputable news outlets posting articles that say car insurances may be invalid if drivers use them during lock down for non essential journeys. The articles were all posted within the last 24 hours.

I would expect my insurance company to contact me if for any reason they were suspending coverage of my insurance for any reason.

It is what my travel insurance provider did. It wrote to us and told us when COVID was covered by the insurance and when it was not.

There has been nothing on the personal finance pages of the newspapers.

During the first lockdown the insurance companies described this rumour, that went round then as well as an 'urban myth' www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/1267461/car-insurance-uk-invalidate-policy-agreement-coronavirus-lockdown

maddyone, it won't be forever - we just have to wait it out.

And I don’t want to!

The whole thing is depressing, and with the mutation of the virus in minks, found in Denmark, I wonder if we’ll ever be able to free of it. I was pinning my hopes on a vaccine, but it’s been said that this mutation may make the vaccine less effective. Never mind Christmas, I feel as if we might be living like this forever.

I'm hoping we may return to the rule of six people maximum getting together as that's my usual number on Christmas Day.

It would surely be madness to allow big parties this year. Whilst everyone would like to see their closest family, no-one needs to have a big party.

If the rules are as they are now, then no I will not be seeing my family. I would like to meet them separately to exchange presents and maybe have a flask of soup on a walk, I do my best to abide by the rules, as if we all broke them then this farce will never be over.

I'm sure you're right B9exchange and none of those things seem either unreasonable or outside the guidance.
I read yesterday of a woman who drove 300 miles from England to Wales to check on her horse at livery there. She wa fined £1000.
A man who drove from England to pick up a puppy in Scotland was also fined though that was first lock down so about 100. The motorway police departments monitor the borders - so be aware of this.

Attending a church for private prayer is deemed acceptable. Also carrying out volunteer work is allowed, and travel for support purposes as part of your linked household. I would doubt the police would have much time to check all those out.

Sorry, I should have added that the article advised readers to check with their individual insurance companies

The Manchester Evening News has an article today warning that if you drive during lockdown, other than for essential purposes, your insurance could be invalid. This point of view was supported by Nic whoever, the celeb lawyer who helped various celebs beat driving bans. Essential includes, shopping for food, supporting a vulnerable person, collecting medical supplies and attending medical appointments.
Just saying.

I saw veterans complete with medals this morning proudly walking together to the local war memorial to pay respects to comrades-in-arms. I think this is what M0nica means, and is absolutely right, in that these veterans had made a considered judgement and decided to flout the 'rules'. As the Queen flouted the advice she had been given not to visit the memorial to the unknown soldier. How many more years will some of those elderly veterans be able to remember their comrades? They came together despite the fact we were in a Tier 3 area before lockdown (although we could clearly see on the UK govt website that the R rate was falling fast locally before we were even put into Tier 3, so yes it seems the figures were contrived). Numbers of infections, even with debatable positive tests, were also falling before we went into lockdown (again ONS figures). We all have a personal viewpoint based on age, circumstances etc, and perhaps we grans have more reason than others to be fearful for elderly people. But we didn't stop the country and do untold damage to young people's lives because of SARS, MERS, Spanish flu, HIV or the large number of killer diseases in our childhood. I asked a Norwegian friend how things were going on in Norway. 'No different' she said, 'we carried on as normal. Numbers of deaths are small'. As did Sweden. On their govt. websites their infection numbers are lower than ours. Personally, I agree with M0nica's approach, although I understand why others are fearsome of this disease and hope the govt's measures will work. Unfortunately, there will be 2 of us in my house this Christmas (whatever the govt dictat) as others of our family have long had different plans.