What, if anything, is the point?

There are lots of sentient beings, the trouble with us is opposable thumbs, upright gait and big brain. We are trouble basically!

There's got to be something on the other side, otherwise there would be no point to life. I have lots of faith that something better awaits us.

Alexa

Smileless wrote:

"Not everyone agrees that Christianity has been hi-jacked by the politically Right Wing Alexa what you've posted is a point of view, not fact."
The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate;
God made them, high or lowly,
And ordered their estate.

This theme was preached regularly in churches where, at one time, attendance was necessary to remain in the good graces of the landlord. The class division was underwritten by the notion that life is as it is and rewards belong to the afterlife.

The mainstream churches have modernised and that verse is nowadays omitted from hymn books, rightly so as the rest of the hymn is lovely. However to believe the poor and downtrodden are rewarded in the afterlife is always a handy rationalisation for right-wingers.

Although there are faith groups that look after the least well off in society, I'm afraid the C of E is still majorly "the Tory Party at prayer" Alexa. I always felt that Mrs T still believed in the theory the hymn espouses although obviously, we couldn't know.

The Queen's introductory style is By the Grace of God, Queen Elizabeth II and, to give her her due, she seems to try to live up to it. However, I have often read things on forums like this and this one that makes you believe that some think that "By the Grace of God, you sleep in a doorway" when we talk about the dispossessed.

Perhaps we are here to learn to think for ourselves.

But then we come on to the fact that we are sentient beings so it would be nice to think that we could leave some small corner of the world a better place - so maybe that's what it's all about.

We've got a long way to go to reverse the damage we have done.

We need to be having 2.1 children to replace ourselves but we are only averaging 1.6.
Perhaps that is a good start?

Alexa

Calendar Girl relied to me:
"I think that’s rather unfair. Just because there is a belief in something after death does not mean no effort is made to try and improve the existence we have."

Nevertheless this unfairness is how Christianity has been hi-jacked by the politically Right Wing who do not want to spend a lot of money on improving this terrestrial life for the poor and downtrodden.

I'm afraid I agree about organised faith, you only have to think of the slave songs to know the diet of a "better place", fed to those who have been the worst treated among us.

As animals, we are here to reproduce but we are not doing a great job. We need to be having 2.1 children to replace ourselves but we are only averaging 1.6. It is worse in some other rich countries, although maybe it's not actually worse but nature ensuring the future of the world - if not of us.

But then we come on to the fact that we are sentient beings so it would be nice to think that we could leave some small corner of the world a better place - so maybe that's what it's all about.

I like the Dalai Lama quote, of course he's right but how many are able and do live to that maxim.
I think there are just too many people on the earth now and we're wrecking it and for those who care, we know too much about things we can do nothing about.

For instance, this morning I read a story on the site Live Science about a blue whale being attacked and eaten by a pack of 50 orcas. Apparently this is unusual, although orcas will attack and kill seals, dolphins etc. The article and the comments made clear that this is about over fishing and climate change and the effects on numbers of fish and aquatic animals.

Whales and other cetaceans are regularly being found with their stomachs full of plastic and are found far away from their regular feeding areas looking for food.

I've been feeling upset all day and helpless. What's the point? Good question. Humans are too clever for their own good, we are no longer improving our quality of life or of other species, we are doing great damage.

Peasblossom

To go back to the OP

“The purpose of life is to be happy”.

“Be kind whenever possible.
It is always possible.”

His holiness, the Dalai Lama.

Thank you Peasblossom

It's sadly often a case of 'damned if they do and damned if they don't' isn't it Callistemon

I'm sure they are used to it, Smileless!
There are always those who know what should be done but fail to realise what others are doing and why - for love and compassion for their fellow human beings.

Oh no - they are buying their own place in Heaven!!

www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/seealso/2011/06/daily_view_should_religious_le.html
Ten years ago but interesting.

2014:
More than 500 clergy signed a letter as part of the End Hunger Fast campaign.

The Church in Wales said the letter, backed by more than 40 bishops, marked the biggest ever intervention by faith leaders on the issue of UK food poverty in modern times.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-27039548

2018:
www.anglicannews.org/news/2018/09/archbishop-justin-welby-urges-government-to-put-food-banks-out-of-business.aspx

2020:
www.churchtimes.co.uk/articles/2020/30-october/news/uk/uk-religious-leaders-urge-boris-johnson-to-set-up-a-cross-party-commission-on-child-poverty

This year:
theguideliverpool.com/bishop-of-liverpool-back-right-to-food-campaign/

Etc.

They are trying and will continue to protest so but, in the meantime, offer practical help to those in need.

Not knowing that religious leaders do campaign does not mean it isn't happening.

Peasblossom .

Well if they are suziewoozie the only person they are deceiving is themselves. God knows what is in our hearts regardless of any outward appearances we may adopt.

It's sadly often a case of 'damned if they do and damned if they don't' isn't it Callistemon.

To go back to the OP

“The purpose of life is to be happy”.

“Be kind whenever possible.
It is always possible.”

His holiness, the Dalai Lama.

Not because they are fundamentally good, kind people then?
Only because there is something in it for them?

I’d like to see more religions and their leaders campaigning more for a better benefit system for starters.

It is rarely reported when they do so and then they risk being criticised by many for entering the political arena!

I can’t help but feel that some religious people ‘do good’ in this life to help guarantee reward in the next. As well as helping to run food banks , I’d like to see more religions and their leaders campaigning more for a better benefit system for starters.

And helping to organise a food bank.

Another food bank is run by an alternative Christian church and others all over the country - Christians, Muslims, Hindus and those of other faiths are busy helping to feed those who are struggling at the moment.

It must be very depressing to have such a cynical view of life and must constantly drag you down.

Alexa

The main trouble about the Vicar's hope in life after death is that it is an excuse for not bothering to make this world a better world.

Most modern vicars I have come across are nothing like your cynical view of them Alexa.

Ours has been running himself ragged shopping for those unable to get out themselves during lockdown as well as conducting a lot more funeral services and comforting the bereaved.

Witzend

A review written after it was first published, obviously - I’m not quite that old!

Haha. Aren’t you?
Thank you all. I’ve cleared my head a bit now. Some interesting points been made, and I will re-read it all carefully.
The point to my day is to do some dusting, and make a cake for my daughter’s 43rd birthday. Maybe that’s it, one day at a time. Also taking advice from the doctors, as in, first do no harm. Then see what good you can do.

I wouldn't know if believing "the poor and downtrodden are rewarded in the afterlife is always a handy rationalisation for right wingers" as I don't personally subscribe to that view Alexa.

A review written after it was first published, obviously - I’m not quite that old!

Alexa, I once read a review of Jane Eyre, just after it was first published, where the author was thoroughly castigated for writing something so irreligious - it was extremely wrong of Jane Eyre to seek to rise above the station in life, in which it had pleased God to place her. (!)
The critic was some upper-crusty female.

Thank goodness such ideas, so very convenient for the Victorian well off, are a thing of the past.

Smileless wrote:

"Not everyone agrees that Christianity has been hi-jacked by the politically Right Wing Alexa what you've posted is a point of view, not fact."
The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate;
God made them, high or lowly,
And ordered their estate.

This theme was preached regularly in churches where, at one time, attendance was necessary to remain in the good graces of the landlord. The class division was underwritten by the notion that life is as it is and rewards belong to the afterlife.

The mainstream churches have modernised and that verse is nowadays omitted from hymn books, rightly so as the rest of the hymn is lovely. However to believe the poor and downtrodden are rewarded in the afterlife is always a handy rationalisation for right-wingers.

Philosophers have grappled with this one for millennia. Isn't the point of life life itself and haven't you actually answered your own question for you.
Callistemon is essentially right, life exists because the physics and the chemistry was just right for it to evolve. It has therefore evolved.
It does. It is. You are.

Peasblossom

Just part of the circle of life.

This, ^ I think. We are a part of nature. We’re not very important, in the scheme of things, in fact, we’re a curse on the world in many way, with the way we’re ruining planet earth.

Making each day count is enough for me, although I admit, I fail at that more often than not.

Smileless2012

Not everyone agrees that Christianity has been hi-jacked by the politically Right Wing Alexa what you've posted is a point of view, not fact.

Well said, Smileless.

This could be true in the USA but not here.
However, it has always been true of the USA, that is nothing new.

I think you can give a point to your life by joining in with a cause greater than yourself, which you believe will improve the world for those coming afterwards. Since my children grew up, the busy-ness of looking after them, running 'Mum's taxi', and earning enough to keep the mortgage going, has been replaced by what I see as a very self-centred life. I have various ailments which restrict my activities, and all I seem to do is order repeat prescriptions and sort out things round the house.

I do have a Christian faith, but because of my illness, I'm not able to get out and do very much, either in terms of attending services and activities or in volunteering to help others, which is a large part of faith for a lot of people. So I have also wondered what the point is.