Schools in danger of ratings downgraded if not having Christian daily worship

Schools can opt out of this. Parents can opt their child out too.

Baggs

It's a ridiculous requirement. It is not the job of schools to encourage prayer or religious worship; that's the job of parents and churches.

Schools can teach about religions. That's all that should be required of them.

If I knew a school's rating had been downgraded because of not fulfilling the worship requirement it'd probably influence me in its favour, if I was going to be influenced in the first place.

This is how I feel, as well.

But I’ve always been contrary like that.

I think this is alarming. That the government should take steps to reinforce an archaic law when almost half of those in the U.K. state that they have no religion, is plainly ridiculous.

What does Collective worship. Wholly or mainly of broadly Christian character mean? Worship implies reverence for a divine being which excludes non-religious pupils, teachers, Buddhists and Jains for starters.

I feel sorry for teachers having to interpret this out of date law.

Teaching children about religion/s is a totally different thing.

Alegrias1 very many thanks for giving this link. Yes, it is new - and, for me, very frightening.

I still remember the lovely old hymns we used to sing at school and in times of stress they come back to me. At the time I didn’t appreciate them at all but they must have sunk in because I can remember the words to many of them.

www.tes.com/news/schools-may-be-investigated-over-daily-collective-worship-duty

In response to a parliamentary question by Sir John Hayes MP. Its very new.

Chardy

RE lessons and collective 'worship' is still a legal requirement to the best of my knowledge for all schools. Few secondary schools have space to get everyone together except latterly in a sports hall (maybe Christmas and end of school year in July), but it takes 10-15 minutes to get them all in, and almost the same to get them out again. In my 40 years I don't remember singing hymns. I have worked in schools where form tutors were expected to do a reading, or in a faith school, a prayer.

I agree Chardy and this is what I have found in schools over many years.
It’s nothing new or different and I wonder why the OP should think so and where the information comes from.

Indoctrination works best if you start it when the person is young and works even better if it comes from an authoritative source that the child would trust.

At school assembly, we had readings from the King James Bible. The wonderful language was then common in everyday
speech. I fell in love with it, and later became an English teacher to adults. The newer translation is a great loss; so few
people can speak their own language nowadays.

It's a ridiculous requirement. It is not the job of schools to encourage prayer or religious worship; that's the job of parents and churches.

Schools can teach about religions. That's all that should be required of them.

If I knew a school's rating had been downgraded because of not fulfilling the worship requirement it'd probably influence me in its favour, if I was going to be influenced in the first place.

Callistemon

nanna8

They have gone the opposite way here. No religion at all in state schools which is one of the reasons so many go to the private sector in Australia.

Could lack of discipline in the state sector be another factor in Australia?

No I don’t think so. Discipline isn’t a huge problem, at least here in Victoria. Nothing like the UK in that respect. It may be a problem in some of the outback areas , mainly in respect of lack of attendance by indigenous pupils but not in the way you mean.

RE lessons and collective 'worship' is still a legal requirement to the best of my knowledge for all schools. Few secondary schools have space to get everyone together except latterly in a sports hall (maybe Christmas and end of school year in July), but it takes 10-15 minutes to get them all in, and almost the same to get them out again. In my 40 years I don't remember singing hymns. I have worked in schools where form tutors were expected to do a reading, or in a faith school, a prayer.

I don’t think schools should be penalised for not providing daily worship, but I think it is very important that children are taught about religion, though not necessarily to believe in it. Without a knowledge of Christianity in particular it’s impossible to understand much of English literature, history or indeed much of classical music.

I’m not a believer and never really was, but I got infinite pleasure from our school assemblies, the hymns, psalms (sung to Anglican chant) and even the prayers. I appreciated the music and the tranquil start to the day.

At my school - and I’m talking about 60+ years ago - the Jewish and Catholic girls didn’t attend Prayers (as we called assemblies), but filed in for the Notices. There were very few of them, perhaps half a dozen, and I think they must have felt self-conscious.

In the long ago days when I first started teaching and we had a 'proper' morning assembly which was Christian there was a Jehovah's Witness child in the school who the mother insisted could not attend assembly or hymn practice. We assured her she could stay in the library area. Unfortunately the library area was just outside the Hall, where the child read a book and learned all the hymns. She could often be heard singing along.

Seriously though schools have coped with this for years, especially those with high numbers of Muslim children. If a school was downgraded because it wasn't Christian enough I think the parents of those children would complain.

When I was a school governor, I spoke to OFSTED inspectors several times and perused their reports every time they visited. I don't recall that they ever commented on the provision or non-provision of 'daily collective acts of worship'. It was never mentioned as a matter of concern.

Callistemon. It’s section 70 of the School Standards and Framework Act of 1998. I haven’t seen anything in the news recently. The act can be read online on the Gov Uk website. It doesn’t seem to have been updated recently.

Collective worship “broadly Christian in content” was laid down in the 1944 Education Act and has presumably not been repealed. Schools have always had their own interpretations of it, and I am reminded that when DH was leading the inspection of a leading Northern boys’ grammar school he asked a member of the team to report on the subject. “Oh just the usual - a a hymn, a prayer and a bollocking” was the report.

Franbern do you have a link please, as I can't find anything online.

Is this just in England as education is devolved?

Sorry Ellianne but you've just done what I wrote about.

Yes dear, that's fine, but we're doing our best and I'm sure your way is good too.

Maybe I'm just oversensitive.

nanna8

They have gone the opposite way here. No religion at all in state schools which is one of the reasons so many go to the private sector in Australia.

Could lack of discipline in the state sector be another factor in Australia?

That's fine Alegrias. As an educator one does ones best for the particular children in one's charge. What works for some may not for others

We shouldn't be ticking boxes. I've ranted about this before, so sorry in advance...

There is no place for any kind of religious teaching in schools. I can just about abide the "learning about other religions" tale but daily communal worship is a step too far, irrespective of what religion it is.

The "room for all" approach also gets my back up. Room for all and if you don't believe in our fairy tales we'll smile nicely and pat you on the head patronisingly.

I should probably go and get a coffee now.

I remember at my comprehensive in North London anyone who was Jewish, Muslim etc. didn't attend assembly but went off into a different room. Thankfully we have come a long way since those days.
When I was Head we had all manner of race, religion on the school roll but everyone conformed to a common, non religious, ethos. Everyone attended an all inclusive weekly assembly. We were lucky enough to have a chaplain who was called upon on special occasions - Easter, Christmas, Harvest etc. - but we balanced this with talks from other religious leaders and visits to various places of worship. There is room for all and I had no problem with giving up some valuable time to learn about others' faiths. Daily worship formed part of the PSE curriculum along with collective "thanks" before lunch in the dining room. A bit contrived, but it ticked the boxes.

Ellianne surely ALL religions claim to foster good feelings and help to others. What they actually do is, in so many cases, totally different.
It will be interesting to see when the results of the recent Census are published how many more people put themselves down as having no religion believes. Was the largest growth group in the census held ten year ago.

Humanitarism genuinely fosters the need for helping others 'We have one life - and need to use it well'.

Most schools buildings these days do not have a large enough area for a daily getting together of all pupils, and - in any case, for the foreseeable future this would totally inadvisable even in those schools that do have that area.

They also are saying that schools should fly the Union Flag - next thing will be a daily act of raising the flat and swearing allegiance to that and the royal family!!!

I am really very horrified as to how this sort of things is being imposed on our educational system.

While I’m not at all religious, I have very fond memories of singing so many lovely hymns in morning assembly.

Singing is beneficial as well as enjoyable (for most). I don’t suppose many of the lovely old hymn tunes are copyrighted (is that a word?) so maybe it’d be nice if someone imaginative and with a gift for language, could write more general words to them, suitable for anyone to sing.