Karen is my Name

Yes it's true, people did refer to others by lets say Jock or Taffy , Mick or whatever,and they probably they shouldn't, but it wasn't their real names,forcing them to change them.

My sister is called Karen and wait until I tell her all about this as we both had not a clue her name was being used this way, although knowing her attitude she will just think they are all a bunch of idiots. Aren't some folk so insulting, I despair at times.

coastalgran

There are loads of names that have been attached to certain personality types etc. During WWII anyone from Scotland in a regiment was called Jock regardless of their actual name. Having blonde hair has its associations with intellect that is why I love the film Legally Blonde. Some women are referred to as being a bit of a Barbie after the doll, inferring that they are not too bright and love clothes and makeup. Sometimes a film will feature a name and that becomes a problem. Referring to a woman as a bit of a Jessica at the time of Jessica Rabbit from Who Shot Roger Rabbit had its clear meaning. Men come in for the same criticism and name problems. Stick with your name and be proud of it.

I get the use of nick-names and lighthearted use of the names you quoted. The Karen meme is something completely different.

Follow the link in my original post to get an idea of what is going on.

Pammie1

@Oriel Because most people named Karen are middle aged to elderly the name is used to effectively silence older white women. I don't know why this should be the case but it is.

If you have a look at YouTube you’ll see why it’s the case. The white women - and not all of them older - in most of the YouTube posts are expressing absolutely vile racist opinions and behaviour - see my original post upthread. I don’t hold with using a particular women’s name to call this kind of behaviour out, but I don’t think ‘Karen’ is being used to silence different opinions or to squash free speech in the examples I’m talking about, because as I say, it’s mostly overtly racist behaviour.

You don't think its racist to abuse and be offensive to white women??

You mentioned the racism in the States earlier - have you not seen YouTube videos of BLM and ANTIFA agitators dressed in black and carrying automatic weapons threatening people into holding their arm up in black power salute? People sitting outside restaurants being shouted at whilst being pinned to their chairs by a mob?

There are many videos showing the unrest in the States here are two picked at random...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSnTTND0UcM
www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-iCAgWvcYI

There are racists and bad people everywhere. That doesn't excuse calling them by anything other than they are.

Where exactly are all these older white racist women?

There are loads of names that have been attached to certain personality types etc. During WWII anyone from Scotland in a regiment was called Jock regardless of their actual name. Having blonde hair has its associations with intellect that is why I love the film Legally Blonde. Some women are referred to as being a bit of a Barbie after the doll, inferring that they are not too bright and love clothes and makeup. Sometimes a film will feature a name and that becomes a problem. Referring to a woman as a bit of a Jessica at the time of Jessica Rabbit from Who Shot Roger Rabbit had its clear meaning. Men come in for the same criticism and name problems. Stick with your name and be proud of it.

Mawbe, we U.S. citizens are very familiar with (and fond of) Hyacinth! Keeping Up Appearances has been running on American TV for many years.

My cousins lovely caring wife is called Karen. Until reading this thread I had no idea that this perfectly pleasant innocuous name is being used as an insult to the point people are changing their name. Mrs Bucket is one thing, but peoples christian names is quite another, and is frankly horrible.

SueDonim
I do understand that, I deal with the public every day, and some of the names I come across are really unfortunate.

No that's its origin its absolutely not how it's being used now.

@Oriel Because most people named Karen are middle aged to elderly the name is used to effectively silence older white women. I don't know why this should be the case but it is.

If you have a look at YouTube you’ll see why it’s the case. The white women - and not all of them older - in most of the YouTube posts are expressing absolutely vile racist opinions and behaviour - see my original post upthread. I don’t hold with using a particular women’s name to call this kind of behaviour out, but I don’t think ‘Karen’ is being used to silence different opinions or to squash free speech in the examples I’m talking about, because as I say, it’s mostly overtly racist behaviour.

I literally had no idea that Karen was used as an insult! Pity, it’s a really nice name….

I’m sorry you felt you had to change your name, Oriel. The use of names such as Karen as a term of abuse is misogynistic.

A friend has had to change her family’s surname due to continual abuse, because it’s a term now commonly used for a male sexual organ. Her children were mercilessly teased (for which I’d say bullied) about their name and also the name was frequently flagged up as having sexual content and thus rejected on online websites.

In the end, the family decided that changing their name officially was the best solution, though they adopted a new name only when all other paths had been explored and they did it with great sadness.

@Sara1954

Yes, I agree, children can be cruel but the teacher we are talking about was being abused by teenagers and staff.

It has been going on since 2011 tictacnana. It started in the States but has migrated to other countries. If you follow the link in my original post it will give you an idea of what is happening.

Because most people named Karen are middle aged to elderly the name is used to effectively silence older white women. I don't know why this should be the case but it is.

At a time when so many people are offended by so much it beggars belief that it is judged OK to abuse a section of society with impunity.

But that's absolutely not what it's used for in the UK now, as I say I have seen it used against any woman who holds a different opinion, particularly feminists who hold views on surrogacy, prostitution etc, it's just more misogyny on the internet.

Oriel
I think that teachers have probably been subjected to children laughing at their names forever, I would imagine that for most it would be water off a ducks back.
I have sympathy for anyone who is feeling threatened or bullied, all I can say is, that I personally would never consider changing my name.
I did have an unusual maiden name, and had to put up with boys making up rhymes about me, did I like it? No not particularly, but there will always be unkind and cruel people, so best just to ignore them.
I bet the people spreading this horrible Karen stuff, would find it hilarious that people are actually changing their names.

TwoWolves and Oriel...
I missed the point entirely here as I thought, "yes, lots of people called Karen on Gransnet".

I only heard about this YESTERDAY ! How silly. The only person I ever knew who had the name Karen was, as it happens, a really nasty woman but that was because she was horrible and NOT because of her name . What will they think of next ?!!

TwoWolves

Oriel It wasn't meant to be an insult to either you or the name - I had it in quotes. And the people I was referring to were the people who snitched on other people for not following the rules - the 'outraged', the 'sanctimonious', the 'hypocritical' and the 'morally superior'.

If I'm right there were quite a few 'Karens' on here earlier in the year.

I don't suppose that you were intending to insult me or my name... It's OK as I have now changed my name... however...

My point is that you didn't refer to those people by their own names or by their hypocrisy, superiority, etc you called them Karens.

Why call them Karen?

I don’t agree with the name “Karen” being used in this insulting way, but I do understand some of the sentiment behind it, having viewed on YouTube some of the disgusting attitudes of older white women, mainly from the USA. These women are in most cases, openly racist.

One example I can think of is a woman directing a tirade of foul mouthed abuse at a black man who had turned up in a car with a white companion and had let himself into the house next door to her with a key. It was clearly a very upper class, and presumably predominantly white, neighbourhood and she followed him round, demanding to know what he was doing there and insinuating that he had stolen the car he was driving. He turned out to be an estate agent doing a viewing of the house, which was up for sale. What ensued was horrible to watch - she was calling the police on her mobile phone even as he was attempting to explain to her that he was on legitimate business. The police turned up and both he, his companion and the car were searched before a call to the estate agency verified his identity.

I’m not trying to justify the tagging of these women as ‘Karens’ because I agree, whatever name is used, it is insulting. I think a lot of the ‘woke’ point of view and the language used is insulting to white people and is ultimately divisive. I’m sure we could find a better and more inclusive way to resolve our differences and tackle racism, but there are literally hundreds of similar incidences being reported and are there for all to see, so I can understand where it’s coming from.

Sara1954

No Oriel, I did follow your link, and yes it was a bit weird to find my name used in such disgusting ways. But I don’t think I would take it seriously, I know I’m not that person, my friends and family know I’m not that person. It would be much weirder for me to change my name, it’s my name, it’s who I am.

OK, glad to see that you took the time to look at the empathy generator. At the time I answered your post you said you couldn't be bothered.

I'm somewhat confused at your conclusion though...

I can't understand why, when you saw the disgusting ways that the name Karen is used, you say you wouldn't take it seriously.

Obviously the friends and family of Karens know they're no that person but nevertheless it causes hurt and division. Do you not feel any sympathy for their situation?

You posted earlier that you think a teacher named Karen who felt compelled to change her job and her name because of the meme should have thicker skin.

The fact that someone actually changed their job as well as their name purely because of the abuse and harassment she was getting must surely give an indication of the effect it has.

Not everyone will change their name of course and it's apparent that people move in different circles, read different things. The fact that some people have never even heard of the meme is evidence of this but I would have thought most people would be horrified that some women are being affected so badly.

Oriel It wasn't meant to be an insult to either you or the name - I had it in quotes. And the people I was referring to were the people who snitched on other people for not following the rules - the 'outraged', the 'sanctimonious', the 'hypocritical' and the 'morally superior'.

MaggsMcG

"nanna8" you are totally wrong it started in US and the ridiculous copy cats in UK who think everything US is better, have taken it even further. Its an insult to all middle aged white women who dare to express an opinion someone else doesn't agree with.
There are lots of middle aged women of other races, what are they called if they express an opinion. I'd like to know?

Originally, it was used for the kind of woman who used her perceived self-importance to try and get her own way. For example, they would demand to speak to the manager when dealing with a low-ranking employee. These women were mainly white. In time, it has become a generalised form of abuse, but it's not to do with "daring" to express an opinion. It's to do with lacking tolerance and getting one's own way by pettiness and knowing the letter of the law rather than the spirit.

This is how it started:

www.vox.com/2020/2/5/21079162/karen-name-insult-meme-manager

I can see that if you have lived with a name you hate, you may want to change it, and if it makes you feel good, why not?
But to change a perfectly nice name, because of all this stupid nonsense seems a bit extreme
I know Oriel, you feel really strongly about it, but it’s a lovely name, seems a shame to give in to the bullies.

TwoWolves

I always understood a 'Karen' to be the kind of woman who reported other people not following the covid rules. In fact, wasn't there a pizza chain that offered free pizzas to 'Karens' but it proved not to be popular so they had to ditch it.

If I'm right there were quite a few 'Karens' on here earlier in the year.

This proves the point.

You say there were quite a few 'Karens' on Gransnet. I assume this means they were being offensive in some way?

That being the case why not call them either by their 'offence' or by their own name. Why use what was my name?