To be or not to be a grandmother.

M0nica

I find it disconcerting how if you say that your grandchildren are not the be all and end all of your life, you are immediately seen as cold, selfish and uncaring.

So true MOnica

I really wish asking about the state of someone’s uterus wouldn’t be a topic of casual conversation. There are so many people who choose not to have children, who want them but experience infertility, failed adoptions and miscarriages, that asking could cause someone pain.

A simple, “How have you been?” works. If someone wants to talk about children or grandchildren, they will. Otherwise, it’s really nobody’s business, unless you’re taking medical history.

I use children or grandchildren as a bit of extra background. Once you've done the "How are you?" "What have you been doing all these years?" The children or grandchildren questions fit in with the are you still playing tennis/ bridge or whatever. or the did you carry one with your dressmaking/gardening/ writing or whatever. Questions about grandchildren wouldn't be the first thing to come to my mind.

I think their comment was crass LRavenscroft.
Some people have no social filter.

I found this thread interesting because before today I had naively assumed that almost everyone using a site called Gransnet would in fact be a gran - silly me.

But as we have all learned this week in is incredibly difficult to come up with an opening query when trying to start a conversation.

"Where are you from?" is out of bounds and now it seems "Do you have grandchildren?"is too.
"What do you do?" has long been seen as disrespectful to stay at home mums, the unemployed and the retired, and "What does your husband do?" is wrong on so many levels.

We could of course try, "Who did you vote for in the last election?" That would at least have the advantage of giving you a chance to walk away if you didn't like the answer.

Perhaps "Do you believe in an omniscient, omnipresent God? might get the conversation off to a roaring start.

Please don't judge people too harshly for trying. Social chit chat is becoming a mindfield.

"minefield". Though maybe the mistake was Freudian.

M0nica

I find it disconcerting how if you say that your grandchildren are not the be all and end all of your life, you are immediately seen as cold, selfish and uncaring.

Yes I have found that to be true MOnica.
It can be irritating.

I agree with you, grannyrose. It is just a casual conversation lubricant. Sometimes you come across someone you haven’t seen for years and why not ask if they have grandchildren? If they don’t have any, fine but if they do you have something in common you can chat about. No more,no less. I sometimes ask if they have ‘greats’ and not many do but so what ?

Don’t you think it’s a bit weird not to begin with something about “them rather than a question about people that might not exist anyway?

It’s kind of like the person you’ve just met hasn’t got anything interesting about her if you launch straight into wanting to know about other people.

Goodness me, what's wrong to just say, "nice to see you/bump into you. How are things going?"

Social chit chat is becoming a minefield Yes GrannyRose15.
All those things you mentioned have their dangers. I used to think “Hasn’t the weather been lovely, wet, cold etc, until I was lectured about “ the dangers of the sun/we really need the rain/ etc. I’ve only found “Isn’t the fog awful” to be safe topic.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

M0nica

I find it disconcerting how if you say that your grandchildren are not the be all and end all of your life, you are immediately seen as cold, selfish and uncaring.

Interesting isn't it.
My working life is looking after other people's children.
Nine of them currently, all school age, three I've had since they were babies, one since he was only three months old.
I'm used to supporting the parents, which is what I hope I do for my grandchildren.

As another Gransnetter with no GCs I too find it very irritating when people ask if my ACs are married and/or how many GCs I have.

It may just be a part of casual conversation or a conversation lubricant but it is also insensitive to many people who would dearly love to have GCs but their ACs can't or have decided not to have children.

I never ask other people whose circumstances I don't know if they have GCs and if asked myself, I would either change the subject or say I am in a rush to get to an appointment.

I agree with Granny Rose15 that we shouldn't judge people harshly for trying to make social chit chat. Haven't we all made social faux pas over the years? I certainly have. I had oral surgery this morning. While the dental assistant took my blood pressure and covered me with a warm blanket, she was making friendly conversation about Christmas and asked if I have grandkids. I do and I celebrate Christmas. What if I didn't have grandkids or was Muslim or other religion? Should I be bent out of shape?
Before Covid shutdown, I was visiting two women friends I've known since our kids were toddlers. One is into genealogy and was talking about where she and relatives were born. I asked my other friend where she was born and she snapped back, "Not here!". It really stunned me since I thought were close friends. I had forgotten that she had been born in Durango, Mexico, and she and her husband used to joke that she was the " Durango kid". I didn't mention that and didn't say anything because I was taken aback by her tone of voice.
We were all in my car and I was driving so I don't think she noticed. I don't remember the conversation after that but it just carried on between them normally.

Ramblingrose22: I can understand how you are bothered by the grandchildren question and try not to ask it. Our daughter went through a very hard and sad time for a few years trying to get pregnant and her sadness broke my heart. She was finally able to have children although she was starting to think about adoption.

Yes it was an odd question a simple how are you/long time no see would suffice. When you don't have children it is hard to be asked if you have grandchildren because the other person automatically assumes that you must have children. If you don't they find you odd but have no idea if you desperately wanted them or chose not to have them. No one should be defined by whether they are a Mother or not but about how they are as a person.

Yes, weird, and out of order, really. As Judy54 says above, no one should be defined by it.

To some extent, and for some not, having children or not can be a choice (and not at all for many, sadly for them if that is what they wanted)- but grandchildren?

My children are all in their 30s and none of them are interested in having children, which doesn't bother me one bit. People occasionally ask if I have any grandchildren yet but I don't take offence. It's a perfectly natural question.

I do not think the question is the problem. It is when it is asked that matters. To be the first thing someone says when you meet them after a long time is weird. To exchange family details as a catch-up conversation develops seems fine, but it is the fact that it was the first question is what makes it so odd and why the OP started the thread.

M0nica

I do not think the question is the problem. It is when it is asked that matters. To be the first thing someone says when you meet them after a long time is weird. To exchange family details as a catch-up conversation develops seems fine, but it is the fact that it was the first question is what makes it so odd and why the OP started the thread.

Absolutely. I wouldn't have minded if it had been in conversation with someone I had just met with a simple 'no' for an answer but seeing I hadn't seen her for 25 years it just seemed rather 'in my face', as in this is what defines you now. I think you are right M0nica it is about context, time, and how it is said.

I met someone I hadn't seen for years in the supermarket recently. We had a quick chat and covered all the usual questions........ How are you? "Have you seen so and so lately?" I was so eager for her to ask if I had grandchildren yet but she didn't. I waited a long time to become a grandmother and wanted so much to talk about them! So it seems starting a conversation nowadays is a minefield. And I am happy to be defined by my children and grandchildren....... they are all amazing and far and away the best thing I ever created

DanniRae

I met someone I hadn't seen for years in the supermarket recently. We had a quick chat and covered all the usual questions........ How are you? "Have you seen so and so lately?" I was so eager for her to ask if I had grandchildren yet but she didn't. I waited a long time to become a grandmother and wanted so much to talk about them! So it seems starting a conversation nowadays is a minefield. And I am happy to be defined by my children and grandchildren....... they are all amazing and far and away the best thing I ever created

How refreshing. Really don't see the issue here. Some people seem to take offence at the slightest thing.

When my own children were younger, one of the most annoying terms of address to me was to call me 'So and So's Mum'. I was always very insistent that people addressed me by my name.

My first child was born five years after we married, and we had been trying from six months after the wedding. It was heartbreaking when people kept asking me 'when are you going to have a baby?'

I would NEVER ever do that to anyone else.

As for g.children - I was not that keen on having these. I adored my adult children, found it difficult to lose status with them to become second in their lives when they got together with partners, so was not enthusiastic about moving even further down the line with their children.

Four of them did go along and have children. I have never been one of those people who think that being a g.parent is the greatest thing ever. My great joy was in having my own children - nothing can ever displace that. As my g.children make my children happy - then my bubble of love extends over them. I join my AC in the celebration of g.chldren achievements, etc. but all my AC know that when I visit I visit THEM, not their children.

Fortunately, my family tend to have children quite late, so I may be still around when the first GG children arrive, but probably not and this is not something I am looking forward to.

Some of my friends have g.children, others do not. Conversations are not about them, it is about us. I rarely mention mine when I am with any of them, and NEVER pass round baby pictures to anyone.

After having had four miscarriages it was very painful when people insisted on asking when I was going to have children. But I do realise such questions are not intended to be hurtful, and I don't think the OP's friends meant any harm by asking - it is just one of those questions that people ask.