Using your intelligence in a bus queue situation

It's like a less harmful version of the trolley dilemma

Seems to be a bit of a character test

I don't think it's mean.

What if she had lived nearer to the first stop than to the one where the other women were getting on? Should she have walked to their stop and let them on first because they got there before she got to hers? People getting on early in a bus's journey have a better chance of getting a seat than those who get on later - it's as simple as that.

The British are known for their queuing behaviour and outrage at people 'pushing in', but I don't think that those rules apply in this case.

It seems a mean thing to do , clever but mean. I believe in
Karma. Kindness is supposed to be rewarded 3 times so the mean mother may loose out in the long run.

NorthFace Bus travel isn’t a competitive sport. It requires common courtesy to other travellers. It shouldn't be about survival of the fittest or smartest to get one over on fellow travellers.

When was the last time you travelled on a bus? This all sounds like someone who is theorising on this situation but has never actually travelled by bus in a busy town. When you want to get home you do whatever it takes to get on the bus. That applies to wheelchair users too. The bus opens its doors and takes however many people it can. When there is no more room then the doors will have to shut. End of story. No good worrying about who can or can't get on. It happens hundreds of times every day in every town so your theories about what people should or shouldn't do are pointless.

but she didn't push in front, she just used her initiative and was prepared to walk the distance.

Because three into two doesn't go.

It’s relevant whataboutery because we are talking about passengers for whom bus seating is VERY limited. Only one wheelchair OR two buggy spaces on a typical single decker bus which can carry 60 or up to 120 people unencumbered people sitting and standing.

This is not the same as regular commuters choosing to go to a train station one stop furthest away from where they live to have a better chance of getting a seat on regularly crowded trains. They weigh up the extra fares and time involved having to get to the station earlier against (maybe) having to stand for an hour. It is quite possible that there will be seats for every one who gets on at both stations. When train are running late it’s common to have one train arrived packed and one right behind it almost empty.

Secondary school children here do it too. There is a massive scrum around 3:30pm at the stop nearest the school especially with boys pushing and shoving one another as they do. I see quieter students waiting at the stop before. I suspect they all manage to get on the buses whichever stop they wait at but it’s a chance for some to find a quiet corner before the hordes storm the bus.

This is different. This was a case of one woman wanting one of only TWO possible spaces for herself and her small child knowing that she was third in a queue. It was the only reason she walked to the earlier stop because she had no chance of getting on if she waited at the first stop. By walking to the earlier stop she knew that any space she got would be at the expense of another mother who had been waiting longer.

I can see I am in the minority here thinking that she was selfish and wrong. Quite frankly I’m tired of people who push in front of others whatever means they use to do it whether by wiliness, money or sheer force.

dogsmother

Common sense move to me. Who is to say someone else isn’t going to get off anyhow at the stop two were waiting at?

This, exactly.

Bringing disabled people in wheelchairs into the equation is just whataboutery. There is no evidence that either of the mums with children in wheelchairs was incapable of going to the previous bus stop. They could have used their own initiative to get ahead of anyone else just as the third mum did, but they didn't.
Anyone at all can opt to walk back a stop so as to be more likely to get a seat. It is a good strategy, but there is no guarantee that it will work, there could be queues at previous stops that will fill up all the seats, including the ones at the buggy/wheelchair places, and it is always possible that an empty bus will go past when they are halfway between stops.
Some people

Common sense move to me. Who is to say someone else isn’t going to get off anyhow at the stop two were waiting at?

It is a feeling of entitlement by the other mothers that gets me, why should they be let on And not the mum who went to the other stop? Just because she used her initiative and to be publicly called those names and the police called is really too bad. I might have miffed it it happened to me but I wouldn't name call the other person.

Essentially it's no different from waiting for a bus only to find it completely full already and having to walk as a result. Who hasn't that happened to?

No criminal offence has been committed

The story claims that one of the Mad Mums tried to shove Canny Mum off the bus. I'd call that potentially criminal and, clearly, the driver or someone else on the bus felt the same.

If I'd been the one left at the bus-stop I'd have walked on a few stops instead of hanging around at the original bus-stop.

And, as cabbie said, there was no guarantee Canny Mum would have been able to board the bus at the previous stop anyway.

If I had been the one that couldn’t board the bus I would have tutted under my breath and remembered to do the same next time.

There was no guarantee that she would get on the bus by going to the earlier stop as there might already have been two pushchairs or a wheelchair.
I think it was canny, not queue jumping.
I think the other two knew this person already and did not like her anyway.
Appalling behaviour and language.

To be honest, they did well to realise she was sitting on the bus!

They don't, Baggs. I just threw the hypothetical example in as so many responses are applauding initative when it really isn't initative at all in any creative sense - just one women trying to get in front of another.

Imagine it as a comedy sketch. Two mums with buggies are at a bus stop. Mum 3 come along and decides she must have one of the two limited spaces on the bus. So she walks to the stop before. Mums 1 and 2 realise what she's doing, run after and overtake her and get to the bus stop before her. So Mum 3 sets off to the stop before that one ... with Mums 1 and 2 in hot pursuit ...

What lengths would a person go to to get an advantage?

No criminal offence has been committed and she didn't queue jump because she didn't queue. She just engaged in one-upmanship because she thought her need to get home soonest trumped the needs of the person who was already waiting who then had to wait another 30 minutes. There was no guarantee any of them would get a place but what she did what done deliberately to give her an advantage - to be one-up.

Also, the driver might have worried the situation could escalate.

Canny mum was manhandled!!

Am I the only one who is amazed that the Police turned up for this incident? What was the crime committed? 😡

Interesting scenario, northface. But how could the wheelchair users know each other's capabilities?

An interesting philosophical question.

What if this had involved two wheelchair users? Say wheelchair user A had been waiting at the stop. Wheelchair users B arrives and knows the bus has space for only one chair so goes to the earlier stop. Would this change our perspective? What if user A’s mobility, even with a wheelchair, was poorer than user B’s so that even getting to that bus stop required a huge effort? What if A’s condition made them more susceptible to cold that user B and they would suffer if made to wait for another 30 minutes?

I don’t think one can apply the same criteria for encumbered and unencumbered users. Space for encumbered travellers is limited. Being able to get on the bus is not guaranteed. They know this. I think the mum should have waited her turn. She did what she did knowing that if she was able to get on, one of the two who had been waiting longer would not be able to get on. Bus travel isn’t a competitive sport. It requires common courtesy to other travellers. It shouldn't be about survival of the fittest or smartest to get one over on fellow travellers. I don’t condone the language but I can understand why her actions caused annoyance.

This makes me think of what happens in supermarkets when there’s a queue of people at a checkout. Another opens up and the people from the back of the queue dash to the new checkout even when they know the people in front have been waiting longer.

Or getting priority medical care if you have money. It all amounts to the same thing. Some people thinking their time and their comfort is more important than the next person's.

Buggies tend to be quite large nowadays, don't they? Even when I was using a double buggy, it took up less space than most modern ones. Remember those early MacLarens?

Canny woman. Others just resentful and silly. Fancy causing such a stink that police had to be called! And with small children in tow. Shocking!

I'm also surprised that the other mums knew of the canny woman's strategy, unless they tended to be using the same bus quite often. Perhaps, though, they've learned something.

When people behave in extreme ways I always wonder what underlying difficulties they are facing that brings about such behaviour.

I think this extreme behaviour on the bus is the manifestation of how stressed everyone is with the current state of decline in our countries and the underlying existential fears that are arising out of that.
I think if I had a young child right now I might be worried in all sorts of ways..enough food, heat, shelter, what if my child is ill? etc.
And as such I might do and say things for self preservation that in better times I might not.

As a regular bus passenger, I often walk back a stop to ensure I get on the bus. How is this queue jumping? if you had barged to the front of the bus then that would have been wrong but walking back a stop ? not wrong.
Bus drivers will generally only allow a few prams etc on the bus as in law the pushchairs have no legal right. The space is actually reserved for wheelchair users. Some drivers will ask the person to fold up the pushchair, thus allowing more on but many parents refuse to oblige. That was why the case went to court in the first place about who had priority - the wheelchair or the pushchair. The former won.
The real victims here are the children who had to witness the event and listen to vile language. I remember waiting in a hospital many years ago when a toddler began walking away - the "mother" ( I use that term very loosely) shouted " F**ing Keanu, get your arse back here" . We then wonder why children grown up with hangups.