Another walker killed by cows…..is there a solution?

Somebody pointed out that farmers don’t pick up after their own dogs. How is that so.

Yes I referred to cow abortion earlier.

I bet you didn’t know this as I didn’t and I’m the wife of a farm manager, (although we don’t have cattle) as seen in a Facebook post from a farmer in Cumbria:
Sadly we have lost two calves in the past few weeks due to abortion. They have both been confirmed to be Neospora. This is a parasite that’s picked up from dog poo!! It’s amazing how many people have no idea about it. Not only have we lost two calves but the mothers also will now have to be culled. This is truly heartbreaking for us and many other farmers who have had the same problem. Please please pick up your dog poo and bin it.
I’d appreciate it if you can share this to make people aware of the damage it can do.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neospora_caninum

Katie59

MaizieD

Katie59

My brother has a large meadow with a footpath crossing, cattle and horses regularly graze it, he has fenced the footpath off because he is fed up with walkers that are too stupid to obey the rules.

I don't get this, Katie59. What 'rules' are these walkers too stupid to follow?

As far as I'm aware there is a legal requirement to stay on the footpath, but apart from that, what else is there?

Correct, but they ignore the rules and roam where they want and let dogs run free.

The reality is farmers have to do all they can to avoid anyone getting injured. If it does happen the HSE will prosecute and the jury will always find for the victim.

I own land, I have a footpath over one of my paddocks and I maintain the stile so it is safe, and we cut a path through so it is clear where the path runs. I do this because it is my legal responsibility. I use footpaths on a regular basis and I just wish other landowners did too. I used to keep horses in that field and had a sign which asked walkers to keep their dogs on a lead, if they didn't and one of my horses kicked it, I would feel sorry for the dog and it's owner but as I had a fence along the footpath, then that would be their responsibility not mine. Actually, all my horses have been used to dogs so I doubt they would have kicked out unless the dog was trying to worry them! You will always get stupid people but the law is very clear when it comes to footpaths (just try moving one!) The general public has access so it is in the interests of the owner to make it safe.

In a lot of cases, it depends what you class as a field. One of my favourite routes takes a designated footpath along the edge of open moorland onto one of the Peak District’s gritstone edges. We walked this path for years without seeing cattle until one weekend we suddenly seemed to be in among highland cattle who were docile enough, but also several young bullocks of a non highland breed, one of which straddled the path we were walking on. I moved off the path and gave him a wide berth, but he came up behind me and with a nudge, knocked me clean off my feet. I got up and DH came and tried to shoo him away but he wouldn’t be shooed until DH waved his rucksack at him. No fences, no walls, designated and well worn right of way. There should at least have been signage.

I have been walking in the Peak District since I was a child and cattle roaming on moorland never used to be an issue. One of the large National Trust moorland estates regularly run quite large herds, but there are signs all over the place warning you of the dangers, especially if cows have calves in tow, and asking you to avoid them or approach them with care and what to do if you have a dog with you.

As for right to roam, I have been told many times by foreign visitors that we are lucky in this country to have access to so many places to walk freely. There has been something of a crusade recently to encourage people who might not otherwise use the countryside for leisure to do so. Yes, education is needed, but it works both ways.

Katie59 'Correct, but they ignore the rules and roam where they want and let dogs run free.'

that is not fair. Many of us a) understand the countryside and b) respect it and love it.

Reminds me of that other thread running, about exageration and tarring all with same brush.

I bet that in Scotland, and in other countries witgh right to roam- there are a lot less issues.

www.gov.uk/guidance/open-access-land-management-rights-and-responsibilities#what-people-can-do-on-your-land

Here is the law in England and Wales. All those with issues, I suggest you lobby your MP for change!!
Please remember the countryside is only how it is because those that own it create the kind of environment where the public might wish to visit. The countryside is a place of work, of business, and ultimately not for the absolute convenience of those at leisure.

There was a Bill passed by Parliament many years ago called "The right to roam.", which gave access to city people or "Stupid" as you choose to call them the right to use the countryside. When people walk on designated footpaths this is what they are doing.

Scotland has the Right to Roam plus a few other areas, even then it does not apply everywhere

MaizieD

Katie59

My brother has a large meadow with a footpath crossing, cattle and horses regularly graze it, he has fenced the footpath off because he is fed up with walkers that are too stupid to obey the rules.

I don't get this, Katie59. What 'rules' are these walkers too stupid to follow?

As far as I'm aware there is a legal requirement to stay on the footpath, but apart from that, what else is there?

Correct, but they ignore the rules and roam where they want and let dogs run free.

The reality is farmers have to do all they can to avoid anyone getting injured. If it does happen the HSE will prosecute and the jury will always find for the victim.

Katie59

My brother has a large meadow with a footpath crossing, cattle and horses regularly graze it, he has fenced the footpath off because he is fed up with walkers that are too stupid to obey the rules.

I can assure you I can read and have been into further education.
I find your comment about calling people stupid extremely offensive. When we walked into a bull there were no farmer's signs or Historical Houses signs warning of there was,near the end of the track a bull.
There was a Bill passed by Parliament many years ago called "The right to roam.", which gave access to city people or "Stupid" as you choose to call them the right to use the countryside. When people walk on designated footpaths this is what they are doing.

We live beside a SSSI that currently has calves in, the farmer has also rented a field behind us, next to a steam railway line and a river, that has 250 sheep in. There are loads of fields nearby for dog walkers, but no, they must break down the fences in the farmers fields and trespass. Leaving dog mess, dog bags, rubbish everywhere. Every day the sheep get out onto the housing estate because of the ignorant public prioritising dog walking over the interests and safety of the animals. The farmer repairs fencing every single day because of it. The sheep are a local talking point (usually fun, due to their exploits), that won’t continue if they run into a road and cause an accident. This is entirely down to entitled people. The kids that go into the SSSI drive me mad, it’s so dangerous and it’s an SSSI for a reason.

25Avalon

If you do walk your dog in grass fields where cows may be grazed at a later date make sure to pick up after your dog. Dog faeces can cause pregnant cows to abort. Not everyone realises this. I didn’t until a farmer friend “told me off” for letting my dog off in a stubbled field as his prize cows were in the grass field next door. I apologised profusely as I was not on a footpath. Makes you understand why farmers can get uptight.

Yes, and take all litter with you. That is a given.

I am surrounded by farms- and each farm has several dogs. They are free to roam, and I can assure you, they are the only dogs no-one picks up after.

My OH walks with the ramblers, but I don’t because they have to occasionally walk through fields with cattle as we live in a very rural area. They do not allow dogs on their walks, and have never had problems with cattle. Not many farmers in our area graze cattle with calves where public footpaths cross.

tickingbird

I can’t believe people are blaming these poor people. If there’s a public footpath it’s exactly that. Farmers are being fined for having cows on public footpaths. They should be fenced off or no public footpaths allowed through land with livestock. As for horses they can get nasty. I’ve been chased by a horse before whilst cutting across a field - thankfully much younger and managed to get over a wall!

I should add I used to ride regularly so do know horses.

That’s not entirely true. Here’s the actual legislation.
www.dailypost.co.uk/news/local-news/what-cattle-farmers-should-know-8964531

I have no reason at all to think that farmers fill their fields with cattle to deter walkers. In the main they are happy for people to enjoy the countryside, but they are running a business and clearly that has to come first for them.

It is indeed a pain for ramblers who are trying to organise a walk, just as it is that there is so little riverside access in the UK (something I mind a lot!). But in the main the countryside is owned by individuals who make their living from it.

I can’t believe people are blaming these poor people. If there’s a public footpath it’s exactly that. Farmers are being fined for having cows on public footpaths. They should be fenced off or no public footpaths allowed through land with livestock. As for horses they can get nasty. I’ve been chased by a horse before whilst cutting across a field - thankfully much younger and managed to get over a wall!

I should add I used to ride regularly so do know horses.

fancythat

So, if a farmer does not want people to use a public footpath, all he has to do is to put cattle there year round, and no public.

Farming doesnt work like that.

No, it certainly doesn't. We can recce a walk for the Ramblers one week , no cattle to be seen. Next week, there's a field full of cattle. Usually in a field where there is no alternative way round because of thick hedges, barbed wire fences and no accessible gates (which would technically be trespassing, anyway). It's chance the cattle or abort the walk..

I am surrounded by fields of livestock. I never walk through fields that are in use - just never.

People who are claiming to be knowledgeable about the country can’t be if they claim that farmers keep their cows in the same field all year to prevent walkers

Quite!

So, if a farmer does not want people to use a public footpath, all he has to do is to put cattle there year round, and no public.

Farming doesnt work like that.

If you do walk your dog in grass fields where cows may be grazed at a later date make sure to pick up after your dog. Dog faeces can cause pregnant cows to abort. Not everyone realises this. I didn’t until a farmer friend “told me off” for letting my dog off in a stubbled field as his prize cows were in the grass field next door. I apologised profusely as I was not on a footpath. Makes you understand why farmers can get uptight.

Katie59

My brother has a large meadow with a footpath crossing, cattle and horses regularly graze it, he has fenced the footpath off because he is fed up with walkers that are too stupid to obey the rules.

I don't get this, Katie59. What 'rules' are these walkers too stupid to follow?

As far as I'm aware there is a legal requirement to stay on the footpath, but apart from that, what else is there?

People who are claiming to be knowledgeable about the country can’t be if they claim that farmers keep their cows in the same field all year to prevent walkers. In fact the fields used by cows are rotated with fallow periods, or if they have sheep, between the two. In the winter cows are kept inside, and let out only periodically if the weather is good.
The key is for walkers to use their brains, but so many don’t. They let their dogs off lead, walk right next to animals instead of keeping their distance, leave gates open, drop litter - in fact have no common sense. If there are cows with calves in a field I wouldn’t go through that field that day. I’m all for maintaining footpaths, but maybe they should come with a health warning that says only use them if you first engage your brain and realise that you aren’t more important than the animals.

25Avalon

So what does Scottish law say then Blondiescott? Aren’t some laws common to all UK countries? I’d be interested to know.

Here in Scotland, we have 'the right to roam'. Attached are a few links which explain more about that:
www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/environment/4084820/right-to-roam-scottish-access-myths-busted/
www.gov.scot/policies/landscape-and-outdoor-access/public-access-to-land/
travelness.com/right-to-roam-in-scotland#:~:text=The%20%E2%80%98right%20to%20roam%E2%80%99%20%28or%20%E2%80%98freedom%20to%20roam%E2%80%99%29,open%20to%20anyone%20who%20wants%20to%20explore%20it.

25Avalon

A public footpath is a public footpath, that people should be able to use. When we were chased by cows we were on a public footpath and had no idea the farmer had just put cows in there the day before. We didn’t see them until we were half way across the field. This is what seemed to have happened with this couple. The husband was killed and the wife has been left disabled. The problem is not just with the public. The farmer put his cows in there and most bear some responsibility.

But members of the public are responsible too. It’s the farmers land, and livelihood, so what are they supposed to do ?