Train fares, should they be subsidised?

People complain about HS2. A lot.

Think I am a bit confused by this thread.

For me andd people living rural, it is miles of car journey before even getting to a train station.

I don't know the statistics but thought most advanced countries subsidise rail travel as it's seen as vital infrastructure, encourages mobility, connects regions etc., and so beneficial to overall productivity.

Off peak day returns Whitchurch to Shrewsbury or Crewe are about £10.
Why not look at services on the mainline that don't involve changes.

Here is a direct line map. No idea if there is a second line at Whitchurch or not.

Re the original question, yes trains should be subsidised more. I believe they already are.

I haven’t read the whole thread so what I am adding may not be original.
Yes
Not only should it be possible to travel by train for less than the cost of flying, I should be actively encouraged as a general principle.
Time - Money
You should be able to save on one at the expense of the other if you so choose.
I also think the threatened withdrawal of ticket offices is relevant here. When I took my GS (13) to London last week I found that by not taking advantage of my Senior Railcard (1/3 off a £20 fare) I could take him for £1 . Nowhere did the machine offer this helpful advice. But it should not need complicated fare systems to enable savings - such as buying tickets for long journeys in stages, which is I understand a recognised way of saving if you can navigate the system. Remember when we used to save Persil vouchers towards train fares? Or Awaydays for Pensioners which used spare capacity during off peak times and benefited families (grannies especially) all over the country. Nobody gives a thought to that now.
Furthermore, if the money which has already been spent and is committed to that vast white elephant HS2 had been spent on a decent dedicated freight railway system, thus freeing up the passenger lines, in the way the German system does, we would all benefit with fewer juggernauts on our motorways, possibly better road surfaces, less pollution and a railway system which is fit for purpose. (And don’t get me started on station parking, cost or availability!)

Public transport is subsidised to a certain extent. Some rural and local bus services would not be viable without subsidies. Older people have free bus passes in England. There are many different dicounted tickets for trains, especially during school holidays. There are older people discounts ,two together, family travel. Split ticketing can also give savings. However, if you are not familiar with train travel these options can be very confusing and unfortunately there is a movement now to close all ticket offices. Older Londeners get free travel, school age children get discounted or free travel. The costs of running and upkeep of cars are high. I think if more people would use public transport more frequently then lower prices could be a consideration.

Public transport should be improved and subsidised. It costs more to go by train to Edinburgh or London from Manchester than it does to fly

I'm inclined to agree with your comments regarding Net Zero OP, fares aren't cheap and rail travel isn't terribly viable with all the strikes at the moment, so yes cheaper fares and reliable service would get more people off the road I'm sure. I always thought the French trains were pretty good and cheaper when I was there, don't know if that is still the case. They are shockingly expensive here, my son lives 50 miles out from London and goes into the office twice a week, he pays about £80 or so for a one day commute into London, he actually welcomes going into the office though so kind of accepts that working from home several days a week offsets other expenses he would have if he were doing it 5 days a week. He and girlfriend both had annual season tickets by way of interest free loan from their company pre Covid, but of course now, like many their working week is split between office and home that isn't a viable option. The rail companies don't seem to have come up with anything more attractive to offer commuters who no longer do the standard week that was. I haven't been up to town since Covid and we moved further away during that time so no longer eligible for the Over 60 Travel Pass which we had for our London trips, dread to think what we'd have to pay now

I think that all public transport should be subsidised. So many lives are limited by an inability to get around easily and affordably, yet if buses and trains were cheaper, cleaner, safer and more reliable more people would use them, and the roads would be less congested. Obviously this would result in cleaner air, and other effects would be that loneliness would be reduced and high streets might get a boost.

I don’t drive, and am very aware of how difficult it is to get to nearby towns on public transport. Here there is a regular (but expensive) bus to the city centre, but to get to other local towns you have to go into the city and out again, which takes ages and costs a fortune. People don’t bother, on the whole.

In my hometown there are many new estates on the outskirts (in common with many other areas), and many are more than a walk away from the facilities in the centre. People drive in, clogging the car parks and increasing pollution. A decent bus service would mean that residents of the estates could more easily get to things like toddler groups, evening classes, activities and so on, which would make them more viable and improve everyone’s lives.

My husband is happy to drive me, but it must be very difficult for those without transport to get to medical appointments etc, as facilities are so centralised these days. Those who don’t qualify for free hospital transport have to wait around for buses and spend a lot on fares. When people are sick they could do without it, and it also means making all sorts of complicated arrangements to cover other responsibilities while they are doing so.

They are just a few examples, but a proper public transport system that joins up facilities and makes it possible for people to get involved in their communities would be such an asset to the country, and if everything must come down to cost, it would also save money on mental health and improve local economies.

Ps....assuming you are an 'older person's! ....I'm 58 and have an 8 year old GD so you could well be same

I've just done a quick trsinline search and its coming up less than half of your quote ...you don't pay for under 5s ....and 8f you have an older person's railcard it would be cheaper still

A lot of people travelling by train are high-earning commuters, as I was. My train fares were very expensive but why should others subsidise them?