Best country to retire to

Jane43

Ironically 60% of over 65s voted for Brexit. Turkey's voting for Christmas.

This baffles me, not because of really old people voting for the return of the Empire,
but 65+ is the age when we were buying property in mostly France, but also Spain and Portugal and indeed further afield, holidaying on the Continent, disciples of Terence Conran, Elizabeth David, then Julia Childs, why would we knowingly jeopardise and curtail freedom and ease of travel, residency, our respected British passports?

I wouldn’t want to live anywhere I couldn’t speak the language like a native - I’m far too fond of talking! I don’t yearn for a hot country, so I’m quite content to stay in England. I live in the north west, though, and I would much rather live in the south. I lived in this area as a child, then went to London, but came back by accident, because of my job. Then I got married, the children were settled at school, and now all my friends are here. If it weren’t for my friends I’d like to go back to the London area, although I’d have to live in a rabbit hutch, house prices being what they are. All my family drifted south years ago.

Urmstongran

Fleurpepper

oh yes, thank goodness for that, before ****!

We now both have dual nationality, which makes things so much easier, and both speak the language well.

And yes, thank goodness we chose to live in the mountains and not in a hot coastal region. And few expats- so no expat bubble. A few compatriots but all settled here for some time and all fully integrated and able to communicate well with all, and mostly with local friends.

Unfailingly you come across as smug.

You look down on so many folk. Ex-pats are often very nice people! Okay so they’ve not learnt the language of their retirement country but that’s not always the criteria I’d look for in a kind, friendly person.

It's about respect, basic respect. Anyone who goes to live in someone else's country should learn to communicate at basic level. Nothing smug about it.

Older people find if they move abroad to a place where they don't know the language it is a disappointment. Trying to learn a language when you're older is much more difficult as memory is not so strong, So they are reduced to living in English-speaking ghettos despite good intentions.

Spanish has sixteen tenses! Going beyond that evening class gets tough.

FrankandEarnest

Jane43

Ironically 60% of over 65s voted for Brexit. Turkey's voting for Christmas.

This baffles me, not because of really old people voting for the return of the Empire,
but 65+ is the age when we were buying property in mostly France, but also Spain and Portugal and indeed further afield, holidaying on the Continent, disciples of Terence Conran, Elizabeth David, then Julia Childs, why would we knowingly jeopardise and curtail freedom and ease of travel, residency, our respected British passports?

Possibly because the Red Wall working class never got the money together to do what you were able to do anyway? Nothing to do with harking back to ‘the Empire’. Just deciding that the rules from Brussels on High (and Strasbourg too just to keep the gravy train going) wasn’t what they had a vested interest in. The middle classes with their children/grandchildren on gap years and Erasmus places never ‘got’ this. No wonder they couldn’t understand it.

‘It takes one to know one’ comes to mind. I understand the mindset of Old Trafford citizens. You on the other hand, do not. No offence.

Have lived all over England, but returned to South Coast pre-retirement with a view to staying put. I missed the sea.
NZ is a wonderful place with such friendly people - perhaps if I'd discovered it when I was younger, my pre-retirement move would have been nearer 15,000 miles than the 150!
Btw my siblings haven't strayed far from our childhood area, though some of my nieces and nephews have enjoyed living hundreds of miles away from their origins.

Ex-pats are often very nice people! Okay so they’ve not learnt the language of their retirement country but that’s not always the criteria I’d look for in a kind, friendly person

So you don’t think, Urmstongran that immigrants should learn the language of their new country, as a key part of assimilating?

So they are reduced to living in English-speaking ghettos despite good intentions

I don’t think it’s being ‘reduced to’ anything! Often it’s through choice. Ex-pats are immigrants to whatever country they chose. ‘Birds of a feather stick together’.

Same in the UK. Many immigrants over here like to live close by people who speak the same language as them, eat similar foods, enjoy eating out in restaurants that serve dishes they are familiar with - and some (horrors!) over here don’t speak English. Doesn’t make them not nice people (or unwelcome). We ought to be flattered no?

Yet if ‘Brits Abroad’ get discussed by some on here, they are ridiculed for enjoying their ‘all day breakfasts’! And why shouldn’t they do so? Some like to live in warmer climes for reasons other than culture, language, flora and fauna. Who are WE to sneer at their lifestyle choices?

So much for diversity eh? When it suits of course ...

We have friends and family in several countries, so basing elsewhere wouldn’t make sense, NZ it’s nice for a holiday but I’d get bored there, it’s a long way from everywhere. Not EU to live, but easy to visit, if I was working and wanted to emigrate it would Australia, so make life as comfortable in good old blighty.

Touché hey!

I love where I live now and want to stay here. Boring perhaps but I love my house, have lots of friends whom I hope will outlive me as they are a lot younger, can do the things I really enjoy and just really like it here! I've lived here over 20 years now and am almost a local tbh I don't want to have to start all over again. My sis has lived in Spain for nearly 40 years and I have no desire to live there, it's too darn hot but she's totally settled there, speaks Spanish better than English (which I find hilarious!) She doesn't want to come back to the UK. I can't help but think that it's all about timing and for me once in your 60's or 70's it's probably too late to make a big change.

so much for diversity, eh? When it suits of course
The funny part of that, is, they can’t see how bigoted they are 😂

Urmstongran

FrankandEarnest

Jane43

Ironically 60% of over 65s voted for Brexit. Turkey's voting for Christmas.

This baffles me, not because of really old people voting for the return of the Empire,
but 65+ is the age when we were buying property in mostly France, but also Spain and Portugal and indeed further afield, holidaying on the Continent, disciples of Terence Conran, Elizabeth David, then Julia Childs, why would we knowingly jeopardise and curtail freedom and ease of travel, residency, our respected British passports?

Possibly because the Red Wall working class never got the money together to do what you were able to do anyway? Nothing to do with harking back to ‘the Empire’. Just deciding that the rules from Brussels on High (and Strasbourg too just to keep the gravy train going) wasn’t what they had a vested interest in. The middle classes with their children/grandchildren on gap years and Erasmus places never ‘got’ this. No wonder they couldn’t understand it.

‘It takes one to know one’ comes to mind. I understand the mindset of Old Trafford citizens. You on the other hand, do not. No offence.

I am not in the least offended by your response,
nor your impenetrable obfuscations.

Fleurpepper

Urmstongran

Fleurpepper

oh yes, thank goodness for that, before ****!

We now both have dual nationality, which makes things so much easier, and both speak the language well.

And yes, thank goodness we chose to live in the mountains and not in a hot coastal region. And few expats- so no expat bubble. A few compatriots but all settled here for some time and all fully integrated and able to communicate well with all, and mostly with local friends.

Unfailingly you come across as smug.

You look down on so many folk. Ex-pats are often very nice people! Okay so they’ve not learnt the language of their retirement country but that’s not always the criteria I’d look for in a kind, friendly person.

It's about respect, basic respect. Anyone who goes to live in someone else's country should learn to communicate at basic level. Nothing smug about it.

So what about the millions who have come to live in the UK and make no attempt whatsoever to learn English?

Like Nadiya Hussain’s (the winner of Bake Off one year) mother who has spent all her life here and cannot speak any English. What about all the 9 and 10 year olds who have to accompany their mothers to the Doctors to translate for them because they speak no English?

Works both ways!

So you don’t think, Urmstongran that immigrants should learn the language of their new country, as a key part of assimilating?

You’re joking, right Siope?
Have you seen any UK NHS leaflets recently? Or local council literature here in the UK? in so many languages from Urdu to Chinese? We bend over backwards here to be friendly and welcoming to immigrants.

The NHS provide translators if necessary for out patient appointments. I was sat next to one yesterday at the Christie hospital. She was with a non English speaking couple.

Unlike in Spain. If you don’t speak Spanish at the hospital there, you take a friend who does. Or as the patient you pay for your own translator. And their literature is all in Spanish. Not Urdu. Or English!

Urmstongran says ''Same in the UK. Many immigrants over here like to live close by people who speak the same language as them, eat similar foods, enjoy eating out in restaurants that serve dishes they are familiar with - and some (horrors!) over here don’t speak English. Doesn’t make them not nice people (or unwelcome)''

Those who don't learn the language get very heavily criticised, and unwelcome too. You know that very well. Most immigrants in the UK do speak the language very well, but also speak their own language or languages in some cases, in their home and with friends.

No-one needs to be grammatically perfect, or know all those fancy tenses- it is all about trying hard to become efficient communicators- out of respect. Take OH- he was retired when he moved here- and the only subject he failed at school was O'Level French- as a scientist. But he made huge efforts to learn- no fancy grammar, and with his wonderful accent. Out of respect- and is truly respected for it. He makes humongous and often hilarious mistakes- but he gets on with it.

Many expats do the same- sadly very large numbers never bother, and years, decades even later- still don't bother. The expect the market trader, butcher, plumber and carpenter to speak English, and just shout louder and louder when not understood. And no, they are not respected for the arrogance.

Primrose53 I work in health care and children can’t be used as translators. They have to be adults. In fact most health trusts insist on staff members translating rather than family members.

I think it depends where in France you live Fleurpepper not all expats are like that that, as you said there are few near you.
British, Dutch, Australian, or whatever nationality, many do make an effort. I also know of some villages where there is still life, hence employment, throughout the year, because of expats, so they are welcomed, with their foibles.

Quite Tenko. In the UK - which is probably why we provide translators. Not so though in Spain!

Urmstongran

^So you don’t think, Urmstongran that immigrants should learn the language of their new country, as a key part of assimilating?^

You’re joking, right Siope?
Have you seen any UK NHS leaflets recently? Or local council literature here in the UK? in so many languages from Urdu to Chinese? We bend over backwards here to be friendly and welcoming to immigrants.

The NHS provide translators if necessary for out patient appointments. I was sat next to one yesterday at the Christie hospital. She was with a non English speaking couple.

Unlike in Spain. If you don’t speak Spanish at the hospital there, you take a friend who does. Or as the patient you pay for your own translator. And their literature is all in Spanish. Not Urdu. Or English!

That seems a lengthy way of not answering a simple question.

I’ll try again: Do you, or do you not, think immigrants should learn the language of their new country?

If British people living in Spain, or anywhere else, and don’t want to learn to be fluent in that language, or find it hard to learn, then so what? There are many older people living here in the UK from various countries around the world who can’t speak much or any English.
If they enjoy living in a hot country and a different lifestyle then that’s enough in itself.
I wouldn’t want to live anywhere else other than England, lovely countryside, weather that suits me and such a rich history and friendly people.Add to that all my family and friends are here.😃

FrankandEarnest

Jane43

Ironically 60% of over 65s voted for Brexit. Turkey's voting for Christmas.

This baffles me, not because of really old people voting for the return of the Empire,
but 65+ is the age when we were buying property in mostly France, but also Spain and Portugal and indeed further afield, holidaying on the Continent, disciples of Terence Conran, Elizabeth David, then Julia Childs, why would we knowingly jeopardise and curtail freedom and ease of travel, residency, our respected British passports?

How do we really know?

qpol.qub.ac.uk/brexonometrics-uk-referendum/

Things are getting better though. In France, the Netherlands and Portugal, I’ve heard English people really making an effort to say even a few words in the language of the country, even if they’ve only been learning with programs like Babel or Memrise.

Tenko

Primrose53 I work in health care and children can’t be used as translators. They have to be adults. In fact most health trusts insist on staff members translating rather than family members.

I am clearly out of touch then. I remember sitting in waiting rooms with mothers and their kids who helped them understand what the GP was saying.

So they are reduced to living in English-speaking ghettos despite good intentions

reduced????
ghettos????

Rather strong language, StillNotGinger 😲

You make them sound thoroughly despised and unwanted.