Dog walker attacked in park

I have to say that I personally can feel intimidated by groups of youngsters. Whilst travelling on the train to London recently there were several young teens in my carriage making a lot of noise, swearing and pushing and shoving each other, then they started moving up and down the carriage throwing themselves on empty seats and kicking the doors at the end, I wanted to get up and move to another carriage but didn’t want to have to push past them.
They may still be children but they are big enough to cause damage.

I just read this inoffensive and gentle man had made several complaints to the police about anti-social behaviour. How sad that nothing was done. One man is dead and five other young lives ruined.

Patsy70

Smileless2012

Having nothing to do all day doesn't contribute to such an act of violence. Raising children is the responsibility of their parents, not the government.

Exactly this!

Yes.

If kids are playing violent games like Grand Theft Auto from the age of three or something perhaps their parents think it's funny. I hope they are going to lock up and question these kids and find out what has influenced them- then charge the parents for what the kids have done if they are underage and put the kids somewhere to be "re educated", like a detention centre.

They cannot surely let killers off, even if they are kids.

paddyann54

Could it be the constant blaming of immigrants for everything that’s wrong in the UK? Why not teach the young that the mess in their country is down to goverment causing division,homelessness and much more .Oh and maybe stop blaming people with a different colour for all our ills

Governments are elected by voters who are the ordinary people in the country. It is not governments causing division and homelessness. It is those electing them and it applies to governments of all persuasions, those the individual supports and those they are opposed to. No party or nationality can crawl out from under and say 'not me'.

The kind of children we are dealing with here are not ones to whom we can teach the young that the mess in their country is down to goverment causing division,homelessness and much more These children are probably not at school. or are frequent absconders, they will be close to illiterate, and often excluded.

The ills that lead to crimes like this are far more profound than a few politically correct sermons from a teacher in a Life Skills class. It is the life styles and choices of the mothers of these children that we need to change, it might even mean their fathers being in their lives.

Yes, the parents themselves are also damaged and uncivilised in the literal meaning of not being part of society. We need to find a way of working with these people to change their lives. they ahve developed an under culture that they know how to exploit the advantages of being part of civilised(in the literal meaning) society, but as they can see no way of ever being part of they have developed their own nihilistic culture that means they can hurt and outrage the likes of us, but that is all.

paddyann54

Could it be the constant blaming of immigrants for everything that’s wrong in the UK? Why not teach the young that the mess in their country is down to goverment causing division,homelessness and much more .Oh and maybe stop blaming people with a different colour for all our ills

I doubt these youngsters are homeless although they could be, of course.

This is down to poor parenting and a lack of any morals or values being taught by these parents, combined with a lack of will by government to tackle these dreadful online sites which children can access.
Do the parents even care what their children are looking at online or care what they are doing when they go out?

...and my personal view is that the 'media' (TV, movies, games, internet) have all made a huge contribution. No-one ever thought it necessary to protect children from all this. Their brains are not fully developed and cannot process all this screen violence in the same way an adult can.

Chestnut you are so right.
X-Box and PlayStation games have an age certificate, but from my experience talking to my minded children their parents don't take any notice.

I looked after a ten year old boy earlier this year, a very nice child, and perfectly pleasant parents.
His sole topic of conversation was the current level of whatever fighting game he was playing. I looked up two of them and they were both 18 certificates.
He just shrugged when I pointed it out to him.

In the end I had to say I didn't want to hear any more about these games. He said he understood, because I had younger children present who shouldn't be hearing these things.
I pointed out that he shouldn't be playing them in the first place!

I don't allow the children to bring any gadgets or mobile phones to my house and I supervise and restrict what they're allowed to watch on television.
It's an uphill battle some days 🙄

Five children have been arrested 3 girls and 2 boys. As they are children we will probably hear no more details about why they murdered him.

So tragic for the family of the man killed, and their shock at the age of those who killed him must be overwhelming.
When children are the perpetrators I believe the parents must also be questionned, in some cases they may have no part in it and be as shocked as everyone else, but if the parents are racist or violent they should be arrested for manslaughter.

I probably taught some of those parents. Some of them were very disturbed.

Smileless2012

Having nothing to do all day doesn't contribute to such an act of violence. Raising children is the responsibility of their parents, not the government.

Exactly this!

Good point, paddyann.

Could it be the constant blaming of immigrants for everything that’s wrong in the UK? Why not teach the young that the mess in their country is down to goverment causing division,homelessness and much more .Oh and maybe stop blaming people with a different colour for all our ills

Thank you sodapop.
My views too Vintagejazz. When it comes to vulnerable babies who may be suitable for adoption it seems the emphasis is on the Mum and not the baby!! A child then spends time in the cafe of various foster carers and his/ her parent. By the time adoption is a strong possibility the child is carrying a load of baggage!!!! Some adoptions break down - no prizes for guessing why!!!!

Probably lots of reasons but there does seem to be a lot of chaotic families out there; parents having children with multiple partners, moving new partners into the family home at alarming speed, blending and unbending families, absent fathers etc etc.
Also, while I'm certainly not advocating the days when children were put up for adoption for spurious reasons, I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way. Young vulnerable girls, barely able to look after themselves, being allowed to leave maternity hospitals as sole carer for tiny babies; parents addicted to drugs being 'entitled ' to keep their new baby, who then spends most of his childhood in and out of care. There are some people who are just not capable of being good parents and shoukd not be allowed to keep their babies or to refuse to have them adopted while they spend years 'sorting themselves out' and the child spends years being dragged between his biological parent and a series of Foster carers.
There has to be a proper middle ground.

It's a combination of things:
1/ poor parenting with no moral guidance or boundaries.
2/ graphic violence seen on TV, in games, movies and the internet.
3/ fear of society in general, knife crime, drugs etc.
Put the three together and you have children with no morals who experience violence in the media and maybe on the street. They are going to be corrupted by the age of 10.

When I was a child we only saw what we came across in our everyday life. Children saw nothing bad on TV or in movies. We were innocent. By the 1980s videos brought horror and violence into the home, bad parents allowed their children to see video nasties. By the 1990s things were creeping ever onward and then along came the internet. So now 25 years later we have total breakdown of society, and my personal view is that the 'media' (TV, movies, games, internet) have all made a huge contribution. No-one ever thought it necessary to protect children from all this. Their brains are not fully developed and cannot process all this screen violence in the same way an adult can. So here we have it, children committing murder and it won't be the last time.

Shelflife, Sodapop there are many responsible and careful parents out there. In fact that would describe most parents, as loving and caring, but there is a small and growing underclass of feral children, once found only in very big cities, but now found, thanks to social media, everywhere. Children who mainly live wih their mothers and mutiple different partners, who have limited contact with their fathers. Their mothers have little interest in them and they are left running the streets like stray dogs. When they reach the age where they become parents they will just replicate the same story.

I know what I would do in an ideal world where money was no object. In the meanwhile we must do far more to try and draw these children into some kind of home based care system that can supply the necessary structure to their lives that their parents ar incapable of providing. Reinstating Surestart and reopening youth activity centres would be a start.

Boz

The victim is an Asian man who has lived here for 40 years.

I hope that doesn't lead to more rioting in Leicester.

The example of the mother going on holiday to Ibiza while her son was due to appear in court is the reason why some children are like this.
These parents of dangerous children should have heavy fines for neglect.
And pity the teachers who are faced with these sort of children each day.

Shinamae You are so right!

M0nica

The parents of these children are like the mother, yesterday, who went on holiday in Ibiza when her 12 year old son was appearing in court on 2 very serious violence offences. They have children and then abrogate all responsibility for bringing them up, leaving them to run feral like cats.

We are going back to the 19th century when feral abandoned children roamed the street fighting fo survival and ending up being recruited for thieves kitchen, like thats so well prtrayed in Oliver Twist, where Fagin takes in abandoned boys and trains them to be pickpockets and thieves.

Now it’s county lines….🤦‍♀️

Absolutely agree Shelflife not enough time spent teaching and showing by example the core values of life. Respect, tolerance, kindness etc. Not the total responsibility of schools, parents must take more care of their children

The parents of these children are like the mother, yesterday, who went on holiday in Ibiza when her 12 year old son was appearing in court on 2 very serious violence offences. They have children and then abrogate all responsibility for bringing them up, leaving them to run feral like cats.

We are going back to the 19th century when feral abandoned children roamed the street fighting fo survival and ending up being recruited for thieves kitchen, like thats so well prtrayed in Oliver Twist, where Fagin takes in abandoned boys and trains them to be pickpockets and thieves.

It's a very frightening issue and beggers belief. What in Gods name is happening to our children!? Children are running riot and have no fear of the consequences, no fear of punishment and definitely no respect for the lives of others. I have no idea whether its the material they are watching online
or parents not teaching their children the difference between right and wrong. I do feel very strongly that we expose children to too much information and society treats them as little adults - they are not adults they are children with developing brains that are incapable of processing adult information! I recognize that times have changed but teachers are now responsible for teaching sex education and all that entails! I am not against sex education but just how far does that go , what are they learning in the classroom? I know a teacher who was asked to explain wet dreams to primary school children. What do GNetters think ?

It strikes me there are a lot of angry children out there, with little respect for age - little respect full stop. Frightening really.

00opsidia

Allira

People keep blaming immigrants but the CCTV of the last few London crimes I've seen has been white people, unmistakable.

Not all black or Asian people are immigrants 🤔
Some are born here, some have been here for generations.
Some immigrants are white.

Oops that's true. I was against people saying it's always coloured people because the skin was white and it's not fair to blame drker skinned people for the crimes of paler skinned people. I definitely get your point about imigrants being from European countries and agree. I didn't word that at all well.

🙂

You did say people not you yourself and that is in fact true, eople do, judging by the recent riots.