Winter fuel allowance result

Now here’s a problem.
My grandmother came to live with us for the last years of her life, so she freed up her house for a larger family. (That wasn’t why she did it, but by today’s reckoning she did the correct thing and we didn’t get carer’s allowance so we saved the government some money.)
She sold her house and shared the money amongst us. If she had died within the next few years, we’d have been taxed on that money.
If she’d stayed there and the money had been shared after her death, the amount would have been taxed.
I suspect in Mazzie66’s case, the housing offered might not have been where the occupant would have chosen, the money raised would have been heavily taxed or would have quickly vanished if she’d moved to a sheltered facility. E.g. McCarthy homes swallow money like a black hole.
Then she’d have been left with little to provide care funding if she needed to move into a home.
Subsidising single occupancy does sound wrong, but it’s not always as simple as it sounds.

biglouis

Seniors who say "well we do not deserve X, Y or Z just because we survived are doing themselves and their contemporaries a great injustice. I know the extent of what I have contributed so society and am still contributing running a small business at 80. And I do not under value my contribution or achievements compared with that of some other groups upon whom my taxes are presently lavished.

To those who say they will "manage" with sweaters, blankets and hot drinks I ask why SHOULD you have to manage if you dont choose to?

Are we going back to Dickensian Britain? This is 2024 not 1824.

I agree.

MissAdventure

I can well believe it, and whilst I fully agree with people having choice, I also wonder where that choice ends, when it is ultimately impractical, costly to implement, and paid for, in a roundabout way, by others.

I think the choice should come with choosing the new accommodation and location of it.

Whilst I fully accept that these properties are people’s homes, they are highly subsided, and in reality no families should be overcrowded/in temp accommodation whilst elderly single people still live in 3/4 bedroom houses.

I can well believe it, and whilst I fully agree with people having choice, I also wonder where that choice ends, when it is ultimately impractical, costly to implement, and paid for, in a roundabout way, by others.

Rekarie and MissAdventure
Something for you to think about. At approaching 40, my younger son decided to change career, follow in my footsteps and qualify as an Occupational Therapist. He now works in the Housing Department of the local authority. We often chat about all things OT related and only yesterday, strangely enough, he was telling me that this week he had been to assess a 78 year old lady now living alone in a four bedroom parlour type local authority property. She was having difficulty in managing the stairs and was requesting the installation of a stair lift and a wet room. As he is required to do, he asked whether she would consider moving explaining that practical help would be provided with the moving process and that she would have priority for a one bedroom bungalow as she would be freeing up a large family property which are as rare as hens teeth,.The answer was a resounding no, out of the question.

My son is also working with a family with three children, two of them disabled, desperately in need of rehousing for whom that four bedroom house would be ideal for adaptation.

The final decision here lies with the lead OT but the most likely outcome will be that the resident remains in her current property in receipt of housing benefit with adaptations requested installed at zero cost to her. The LA will also meet the cost of returning the property to its original condition when it eventually becomes vacant so that it’s appropriate for family living. The family with the disabled children will continue on the waiting list.

This case is nothing exceptional and much of the shortage in family accommodation is caused by elderly single residents living in grossly under occupied properties. Nor is it true to say that they are not subsidised to do so.

No rules with regard to confidentiality are breached during our conversations.

Buttonjugs

I agree with Keir on this. If people are living in big houses but cash poor I believe there are companies who will buy your house and let you stay in it for life. Those who claim pension credit will still get it. If your state pension is too high for pension credit then you do not need WFA. It’s the same as families who earn too much to qualify for Universal Credit - except that people on UC, the VERY poorest in society, do NOT get a WFA. How is that fair? I have a friend who does get PC, she’s not badly off and even gives money to her adult daughter now and again. So I don’t understand how someone who doesn’t qualify for PC can be so poor they need help with winter fuel.

Maybe some pensioners are privately renting still?

Housing can make a huge difference to people’s budget, I know they’ll probably be getting housing benefit but there is a limit, local housing allowance

Ann29

I think they should of cancelled the £10 at Christmas and taken the winter fuel allowance away from anyone who pays the higher rate of tax. .The date of the announcement was interesting a day when all the news was about Southport. Also no time to adjust our budgets to cover the fuel bills

Agree too.

Zannygranny

Eighty years old , no pension , and still working . Up yours Starmer.

No pension? You mean you haven’t claimed it yet or are not entitled to one?

The one Labour MP who voted against and the others that abstained are to face ‘action’ as reported on the BBC. How unfair is that! It should have been an open vote. Starmer must have been afraid the vote would go against him

Nightowl thanks for that, hmmm yes urgent appointments, maybe, I shall remember that when the next local elections comes and give it sone deep thought .

people getting the old state pension will get £350..( I think that's the figure) while the new state pension will go up to £461 both up 4%..

mokryna

Am I on the old or new pension. Born in Feb 50 could have retired at 60 in 2010 but did not claim until 2020 when I was 70? I of cause do not receive the full pension as I did not work enough years in the UK so it is difficult to work out

Those born before April 1953 are on old pension
www.gov.uk/state-pension

biglouis

Glad to see so many MPs abstained. Two Tier has lost a lot of face over this,

Absolutely right. I'm glad to see that my 4 nearest Labour MPs abstained (not that that I voted for them) and another voted against. Will the boss fella hang them out to dry?

Ann29

I think they should of cancelled the £10 at Christmas and taken the winter fuel allowance away from anyone who pays the higher rate of tax. .The date of the announcement was interesting a day when all the news was about Southport. Also no time to adjust our budgets to cover the fuel bills

Agree!

I think they should of cancelled the £10 at Christmas and taken the winter fuel allowance away from anyone who pays the higher rate of tax. .The date of the announcement was interesting a day when all the news was about Southport. Also no time to adjust our budgets to cover the fuel bills

I agree with Keir on this. If people are living in big houses but cash poor I believe there are companies who will buy your house and let you stay in it for life. Those who claim pension credit will still get it. If your state pension is too high for pension credit then you do not need WFA. It’s the same as families who earn too much to qualify for Universal Credit - except that people on UC, the VERY poorest in society, do NOT get a WFA. How is that fair? I have a friend who does get PC, she’s not badly off and even gives money to her adult daughter now and again. So I don’t understand how someone who doesn’t qualify for PC can be so poor they need help with winter fuel.

gentleshores

Sorry that link didn't unfurl. Ros Altmann posted today

"Today is the last opportunity for Parliament to protect the poorest pensioners who are at risk this winter. My Fatal Motion in the House of Lords to cancel the Winter Fuel Payments Statutory Instrument will be debated later today."

Starmer won’t give in. He has to project himself as the hard man, and pensioners are an easier target than doctors, train drivers etc. (I’m not saying they don't deserve their pay rises, but look at the actions they can take, against the actions pensioners can take.)

Sorry, that link is a piece by Ros Altmann as well who says she will be pushing it to a vote in the House of Lords.

omega1

We should remember that the tories introduced the two tier pension system. I don't remember much fuss being made about this or anything done about it I don't like the Labour Party either

I remember there was a terrible outcry about it as no-one would explain how the system worked and even today, there is a lot of questions being asked because even though people who get the old style pension worked for many more years than the new style pensioners who worked less but perhaps paid in more.

Surely this should have levelled itself out, we older pensioners paid in less for a longer term but the new state pensioners paid in more for a shorter term. So, why the big difference in payments.

www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/sep/07/winter-fuel-payments-cut-one-of-the-worst-decisions-i-have-ever-seen-says-ex-pensions-minister

Second home heating benefit paid to MPs towards heating their second homes is over £3,000 each year on top of a good salary, subsidised meals help with running those second homes yet they think that we can manage on around £11,000 pension and don’t need the £300 they have just taken away. This government in just a few weeks has shown itself to be cruel and heartless.
Giving train drivers a £10,000 p.a. Pay rise for a 4 day week on top of their £60,000 salary with no conditions means that they could strike for more tomorrow if they wanted to.
I despair, I really do.

Sorry that link didn't unfurl. Ros Altmann posted today

"Today is the last opportunity for Parliament to protect the poorest pensioners who are at risk this winter. My Fatal Motion in the House of Lords to cancel the Winter Fuel Payments Statutory Instrument will be debated later today."

x.com/rosaltmann/status/1833818858936746234

Eighty years old , no pension , and still working . Up yours Starmer.

We should remember that the tories introduced the two tier pension system. I don't remember much fuss being made about this or anything done about it I don't like the Labour Party either