Labour has come under fire after refusing to hold a public inquiry into historic sexual abuse by grooming gangs in Oldham.

They are grooming the girls to "consent" to have sex; except children can't consent.
They are offering drink, drugs, affection, a sense of belonging, as well as pretending that these girls are their girlfriends, and that they love them.

It's how predators work, and it's grooming.

MissAdventure

They are grooming the girls to "consent" to have sex; except children can't consent.
They are offering drink, drugs, affection, a sense of belonging, as well as pretending that these girls are their girlfriends, and that they love them.

It's how predators work, and it's grooming.

Exactly, calculated and disgusting behaviour.

Yes but it doesnt include the word rape.

rafichagran

Elon Musk should mind his own business, and look to the injustices that happen to the black, poor, and people either learning disabilities, and mental health in the USA. His country is a disgrace at times.

Elon thinks he should run the world since he is the richest man in it. He must be stopped!

MissAdventure

They are grooming the girls to "consent" to have sex; except children can't consent.
They are offering drink, drugs, affection, a sense of belonging, as well as pretending that these girls are their girlfriends, and that they love them.

It's how predators work, and it's grooming.

It is grooming but under-age sex with a minor under the age of 13 is rape. Anyone under 13 is not considered capable of giving consent.
Having sex with someone over the age of 13 but under 16 could be considered sexual assault. If the child is under 18 and the other person is in a position of trust then that is also sexual assault.

That is how I understood it; others may know more.

Allira rape is not age related.

It is penetration by a penis, without consent.

Oh yes, it's those things first and foremost, but the grooming ensures a supply, who won't cry "rape", who will bring similar girls into the picture, and will comply.

That's the ideal scenario for groups of men interested in sex with children, and how it can go on for so long, and involve so many people.

MissAdventure

Oh yes, it's those things first and foremost, but the grooming ensures a supply, who won't cry "rape", who will bring similar girls into the picture, and will comply.

That's the ideal scenario for groups of men interested in sex with children, and how it can go on for so long, and involve so many people.

Aided and abetted by like minded perverts.

GrannyGravy13

Allira rape is not age related.

It is penetration by a penis, without consent.

Yes.
But if minors over 13 are groomed they will think they are giving consent.
I believe that could be statutory rape.

It includes targeting gangs involved with younger children, this gang targeted 7 children over near 10 years

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/05/twenty-one-convicted-in-west-midlands-child-sexual-abuse-inquiry

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Perhaps there wouldn’t be an outcry for a public inquiry if even SOME of the 20 recommendations put forward 2years ago had been implemented!

Why haven’t they been?
Any inquiry won’t have been cheap.

A waste of taxpayers money then?

Well, Boris Johnson did described money spent on investigating historic sexual abuse cases as "spaffing money up the wall"

Anyone who says “I’m with Elon Musk” with a straight face is either a bot being paid by the Reform Party, or deluded. Musk is a mad man who spends his time ranting while in a ketamine induced haze

HousePlantQueen

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Perhaps there wouldn’t be an outcry for a public inquiry if even SOME of the 20 recommendations put forward 2years ago had been implemented!

Why haven’t they been?
Any inquiry won’t have been cheap.

A waste of taxpayers money then?

Well, Boris Johnson did described money spent on investigating historic sexual abuse cases as "spaffing money up the wall"

"I think an awful lot of money, an awful lot of police time, now goes into these historic offences and all this malarkey and you know £60million I saw has been spaffed up the wall on some investigation into historic child abuse?

... "all this malarkey"... "some investigation into historic child abuse"...

And then, later, attempted to justify the use of his "spaffed up the wall" comment by insinuating that it didn't mean what the person who was interviewing him thought it meant - that he, the interviewer, was using his own interpretation of the phrase.

What an oaf.

Well, Starmer and Phillips have a chance to right wrongs, so why are they refusing?
Concentrate on the here and now.

KateW19

Anyone who says “I’m with Elon Musk” with a straight face is either a bot being paid by the Reform Party, or deluded. Musk is a mad man who spends his time ranting while in a ketamine induced haze

Indeed. I believe his latest words of wisdom are that children born by cesarean section are smarter than those born vaginally because their skulls and brain don't get compressed.

eazybee

Well, Starmer and Phillips have a chance to right wrongs, so why are they refusing?
Concentrate on the here and now.

No. Why would we attempt to expunge the past and put all the onus on the current government? You can’t blame people who don’t have the memories of fish being annoyed at the bile now for wrongs that could have been righted years ago. They are all culpable.

eazybee

Well, Starmer and Phillips have a chance to right wrongs, so why are they refusing?
Concentrate on the here and now.

Well, they’re sorting out the compensation for postmasters and haemophiliacs aren’t they?

eazybee

Well, Starmer and Phillips have a chance to right wrongs, so why are they refusing?
Concentrate on the here and now.

... Concentrate on the here and now.

Is that an order?

I don't know why Starmer has blocked a public inquiry.

Starmer has admitted 'culpability'in that the CPS had let down vulnerable girls after a case was dropped against a rape suspect - despite the evidence pointing to his guilt.

I am hoping he will have more to say on the matter in the next few days, and that he will give his / the government's reason(s).

But I'm not in any doubt that this is politically motivated on the part of Badenoch, Musk, and the RW media who have been (naturally, this is politics) gunning for Starmer from day one.

But if we are going to look at the culpability of all those involved, then I think it is quite fair to raise the issue of the way this has been dealt with by the previous government - to look also at their motivation, and their attitude towards child sex abuse in general, and in these particular cases - including those within our care institutions and religious establishments, not just the networks of taxi-drivers in Oldham, Rochdale, etc.

Sex abuse, rape - of children and young people appears to be epidemic. So of there is to be a public inquiry, it needs to be all encompassing.

Meanwhile, the recommendations of the Independent Inquiry need to be implemented - because a full public inquiry will possibly take a very long time.

I don't care what the previous government or this government has or hasn't done, it's time that there was a full and transparent enquiry into who knew, who turned a blind eye and would be quite happy for some of the people in positions of trust to be hauled before the courts.

How can we moan about how much this costs the young girls deserve it. If Musk puts pressure on to get this then good on him.

How can the home office etc keep saying lessons have been learnt?

How can the home office etc keep saying lessons have been learnt?

I was going to mention lessons being learned and wondering if they ever are.

Allira

^How can the home office etc keep saying lessons have been learnt?^

I was going to mention lessons being learned and wondering if they ever are.

Exactly

If you are in say the police or child protection and turned a blind eye knowing what was happening makes you nearly as bad as the rapists.

If I knew a terror threat was going on next door and I never reported I would rightly dragged before the courts

Ohhowwelaughed

I don't care what the previous government or this government has or hasn't done, it's time that there was a full and transparent enquiry into who knew, who turned a blind eye and would be quite happy for some of the people in positions of trust to be hauled before the courts.

How can we moan about how much this costs the young girls deserve it. If Musk puts pressure on to get this then good on him.

How can the home office etc keep saying lessons have been learnt?

it's time that there was a full and transparent enquiry into who knew,

You do know that there was an independent inquiry which took 7 years to complete - 2015 - 2022?

I don't know how long a public inquiry might take, but action is needed now on what is already known and understood, surely?

How can we moan about how much this costs the young girls deserve it

... who is moaning? No-one on here as far as I can tell.

It isn't we who are moaning - it was Boris Johnson who appeared to consider money would be better spent on current issues facing the police rather than on historic child sex abuse.

That might be uncomfortable for some to hear, who want to now put the blame solely on to the Labour party.

How can the home office etc keep saying lessons have been learnt?

... because they haven't yet concocted a suitable alternative mantra?

You do know that there was an independent inquiry which took 7 years to complete - 2015 - 2022?

These were local enquiries that didn't link all full list of towns where rape gangs were a problem.
Many were underfunded and were carried out by local councils who in many ways could mark their own homework.

Who were the civil servants who knew what was going on, who did they tell and how far up the chain did it go?

I am not interested what Boris said as he wasn't there at the time controlling things

This should not be party political.

I think Musk and Trump may start making many problems for the UK.

Musk latest today:

"On Friday, Musk shared a post asking whether the king “should dissolve parliament and order a general election … for the sake and security” of the UK. He retweeted the X thread with a one-word comment: “Yes.”"

He has has used the social media site to post or repost about child grooming in the UK more than 40 times over the past 24 hours.

its reminding me a bit of that period when Trump was up half the night posting obsessively on twitter.

its all "political" - the those closest to the victims past and present are asking for the priority to be actually put into carrying through the results of the long inquiry.

Wyllow3

Musk latest today:

"On Friday, Musk shared a post asking whether the king “should dissolve parliament and order a general election … for the sake and security” of the UK. He retweeted the X thread with a one-word comment: “Yes.”"

He has has used the social media site to post or repost about child grooming in the UK more than 40 times over the past 24 hours.

its reminding me a bit of that period when Trump was up half the night posting obsessively on twitter.

its all "political" - the those closest to the victims past and present are asking for the priority to be actually put into carrying through the results of the long inquiry.

Why are people so bothered what Musk is tweeting?

Another rich guy Dale Vince was tweeting things about Trump during and after the American election.

Just ignore it.