Where's CariadAgain? 🤔

I remember your lockout, Iam. It took ages to get it sorted out.

I don't remember the comment to rafichagran, but a lot of people were a bit bonkers during Covid - a combination of fear and loneliness probably. Maybe it was that which prompted the comment?

I agree with you about both GSM and Cariad. I can only remember one poster who I think deserved to be banned, and she seemed to be Teflon for ages. I have never known anyone cause so much trouble, and she had already been banned and allowed back. That was a mystery, but apart from her, I can't think of anyone.

There are/have been people I would probably put on ignore, if we had the ability to do so, just as there are people in any group that I wouldn't go out of my way to mix with, but I think that GN as a whole needs to have a mix of personalities and opinions. It has to, as I'm sure we would all choose different people if we could select from the membership list .

Comments like the one rafiagran was subjected to are the ones I understand being reported, though I can see the positives in letting it stand to show the poster as they are.

A couple of years ago, I was locked out of gransnet due to a technical issue. Gnet hq were good but what really helped was the number of posters who kept up a campaign to let me back. I’ve never forgotten how much this meant

My politics (no surprise) weren’t those of GSM or more recently Carriad but I can’t see any reason for banning

How horrible. What was so wrong about having your hair done.

I was told that because I had my hair done a week before covid "I would look good in my coffin.

😲 that is unforgivable.

Galaxy

Yes I know the forum rules. I have been on both sites for 20 years.

Which 2 sites? GN hasn't been going 20 years.

The disappearance could be due to serious misleading medical statements which I remember in this case.

I was told that because I had my hair done a week before covid "I would look good in my coffin. The poster was also very nasty to me. Ivcsn take posters disagreeing with me but this went too far. If this poster is still here under a different name shame on you.
The mods did nothing about that. At first I was upset, but I just thought what a lonely spiteful person you are. This is the polite version. Alot of posters said I was being bullied by PM.
I do not report unless a person is racist, or have been unesarily nasty to another poster. Even then I think twice as reporting does not sit well with me.
Carried again has not offended me but maybe I missed posts that caused upset.
I always read every post as to me all posters are equal.

Graphite

Galaxy

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

But it would constitute a personal attack, therefore breach Talk Guidelines and should be deleted. If somone were to do that repeatedly, then the moderators have the discretion to ban the offender.

The guidelines are clear:

... where necessary, we will use our discretion to delete posts (or ban posters).

We do have a few forum rules to make sure we keep Talk a good place to hang out:

• No personal attacks

• No posts that break the law, including hate speech of any kind

• No trolling, misleading or deliberately inflammatory behaviour

• No trollhunting

• No spamming

We'll remove posts we consider to contain personal attacks, to break the law and/or to be obscene, racist, sexist, disablist, ageist, homophobic or transphobic, once they are brought to our attention. We will also delete any posts that we think are just seriously unpleasant (please note that any subsequent posts repeating the words in the deleted post may be removed also).

Please note the guidelines say "we consider". The 'we' in question is the owner of the website. They have the right, as the owner , to dictate who says what.

I feel that the owner is less tolerant than I .However as long as I use Gransnet I must abide by her rules.

I am sort of arguing on both sides of the fence doodledog which is confusing even for me! But that is because how to manage this kind of thing is complex, and as you can tell I find it vaguely fascinating.

Sorry I wasn't clear. Someone upthread said that they didn't think posters should be banned unless what they said was illegal. I gave an example to show that wouldn't work. Generally I am comfortable with the forum guidelines, I actually trust MN/ GN in terms of speech. That doesn't stop me from moaning if someone disappears of course.

Galaxy

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

That's exactly what I was getting at upthread, and you replied to say that JR is at the forefront of free speech😀.

Graphite, we know that no websites can be too careful about legalities, but I honestly don't think that most bannings are because of anything remotely illegal. This is not Twitter 😀

I understand that there are rules, but don't really understand what they are. If, for instance, there were a 'no swearing' rule I would understand if those who swore repeatedly were banned. As would they, and all the rest of us, whether we disapprove of swearing or not. But 'the spirit of Gransnet' doesn't mean anything - and it appears to be interpreted in different ways depending on who is on mod duty when a post is reported.

Posts that are nasty to individuals are usually picked up by other posters, and some are left to stand whilst others are deleted. I was once compared to the KKK for a comment about not allowing men to compete in women's sport. I didn't lose sleep, but clearly it bothered me, as I can still remember it. I didn't report it though (I don't report), and I assume no-one else did either as it stood, but a few people posted to say it was out of order. IMO that is more appropriate, as deleting it would have deleted the evidence of that poster's lack of boundaries - as it was her true colours were on display. I'm sure we would all wade in the circumstances you describe too, Galaxy 😀

Yes I know the forum rules. I have been on both sites for 20 years.

Caleo

Galaxy

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

I don't think a matter of personal prejudice amounts to hate speech. I think hate speech is speech that makes unsubstantiated allegations.

Free speech is harmed if posters must aim not to offend. Hate speech is something else.

Yes that's what I mean it isnt illegal but I really would expect GN to moderate that behaviour ( against anyone not just me!)

Galaxy

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

But it would constitute a personal attack, therefore breach Talk Guidelines and should be deleted. If somone were to do that repeatedly, then the moderators have the discretion to ban the offender.

The guidelines are clear:

... where necessary, we will use our discretion to delete posts (or ban posters).

We do have a few forum rules to make sure we keep Talk a good place to hang out:

• No personal attacks

• No posts that break the law, including hate speech of any kind

• No trolling, misleading or deliberately inflammatory behaviour

• No trollhunting

• No spamming

We'll remove posts we consider to contain personal attacks, to break the law and/or to be obscene, racist, sexist, disablist, ageist, homophobic or transphobic, once they are brought to our attention. We will also delete any posts that we think are just seriously unpleasant (please note that any subsequent posts repeating the words in the deleted post may be removed also).

Galaxy

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

I don't think a matter of personal prejudice amounts to hate speech. I think hate speech is speech that makes unsubstantiated allegations.

If women had moderated what they said on MN it would have been a disaster both politically and in terms of safeguarding, I realise I am arguing on both sides of the debate at once here, but when people are constantly being careful of their words it does impact their ability to think.

I am not sure it is as simple as legality though is it.
Say for example every time I posted someone said 'I loathe Galaxy, she is vile'. I am not sure that breaks the law but it would be particularly unpleasant ( especially for me )

There is no sufficient reason to ban any poster unless their activity on Gransnet is illegal.

And that’s the point. It may have been and site owners can now face heavy penalties if they don't take action.

I can only assume that bans occur due to persistent breaches of the Talk Guidelines although how those guidelines are interpreted might be subjective and cause for debate.

The book We Had to Remove This Post by Hanna Bervoets is fiction but is based on real life experiences from people who had worked as moderators on some of the more toxic platforms. Harrowing work. It’s quite a short novel and worth reading.

I do understand what some are saying about how some may see this site as a lifeline but moderators won’t know someone’s personal circumstances. We are just usernames. They will look at Talk Guideline transgressions post by post. If they do impose sanctions then the person on the receiving end can always make their own representations and ask to be to be reinstated if they think the decision harsh.

The anonymity of social media means that people don’t always exercise the discretion they might show in face-to-face conversations. When people let rip they aren’t always thinking, or thinking at all, about what effect their words may have on other people. Their rant about something may be triggering for someone else who also has issues to contend with.

The key is the word moderation as well as consideration for others. Were people to moderate what they said in the first place there would be no need for staff to moderate.

TheSunRisesInTheEast

It wouldn't occur to me to report someone, on the odd occasion I've not liked a response to something I've said, I just ignore them and move on. I would hope that the moderators would step in if rules were broken, without us having to prompt them.

I'd rather see an edit button for typos and the facility to send a supportive emoji to a poster like you can on Mumsnet without having to post a separate response.

👍👍

BlueBelle

I would never report anyone, I believe in fighting my own battles but I wasn’t a fan of Carriad so I hadn’t actually noticed she wasn’t on. If she has been banned she will have plenty to say when she’s back
( I do report the advertising trolls as I m often up in the night when they are at their worst )

I agree, never ever reported anyone but scam ads

Doodledog

Allira

BlueBelle

I don’t think there needs to be an announcement as such, that’s very official sounding but if Iwas ill I d just send a pm to someone I trust on here just to say BB won’t be around for a bit, it doesn't need more than that, or if able I d do just that myself at least you’re not left hanging thinking well she did say she wasn’t well could she have died or be in hospital etc etc
When you see a familiar face disappear ( at our age) you tend to think the worse
Rosie well of course it’s obvious if you’ve read both
posts !!!!!!

Three of my friends died, just suddenly. 😥
That's why I joined GN in the first place, I felt bereft and in need of somewhere to chat.

This is why banning someone from here can have big impact on their life. As we can see from the other thread about GN and what it means to individuals) some people just dip in and out, but others see it as a social life, or a way to stay sane during an illness. To have that taken away for what might be an unfortunate communication style seems disproportionate.

We don't know, JaneJudge. That's what we're talking about .

I do so much agree. If any posters to Gransnet feel it;s a lifeline, then banning causes terrible harm to them. Banning should never be done without a full explanation to the banned poster that they fully understand.

There is no sufficient reason to ban any poster unless their activity on Gransnet is illegal.

It wouldn't occur to me to report someone, on the odd occasion I've not liked a response to something I've said, I just ignore them and move on. I would hope that the moderators would step in if rules were broken, without us having to prompt them.

I'd rather see an edit button for typos and the facility to send a supportive emoji to a poster like you can on Mumsnet without having to post a separate response.

Re: how people express themselves. I think if someone is downright rude or insulting, then some measure of discipline needs to be put in place as that is unacceptable. However, if someone is stating their opinion in a measured way, it may not be what we agree with but we must respect that it is their right to express themselves. I often find that people flinch when something is mentioned about a subject that affects them. i.e. I know a lady whose husband was imprisoned for a particular crime (fraud) and when that subject is raised her face does flinch but she doesn't say anything. Should the group carry on talking or should they be aware of her presence? It is about being the adult in the room I think.

SpinDriftCoastal

MaizieD

Scribbles

SpinDriftCoastal

I do miss biglouis. She was a voice for her generation.

I think you'll find she is back among us in feline form. 🐈

That's what I was thinking of pointing out. She's been back for quite some time...

Oh, that is good to know. I did miss her comments. She often wrote what I thought. Thank you for pointing that out.

She often wrote what I didn't think 😀 but it's always interesting to read other points of view!