UK State Pension - Is it really enough?

Cossy

I absolutely don’t agree that if SP was raised to a sensible amount that anyone with a workplace/private pension should be penalised by means testing.

I do, because there would be justified claims of unfairness from working age people who would be paying higher tax to pay for higher pensions, when the income divide between them and pensioners with high private pensions as well became greater than they already are.

Btw I’m not suggesting that SP and MW are in any way linked. I’m simply pointing out that this is (presumably) linked to how much someone somewhere decided was the “minimum” required amount to live on.

Many many people working don’t have children, so using this as an example as to why we shouldn’t get a “living amount” to live on is not really relevant. (imo)

Actually, as many of you’ll be aware I actually favour getting rid of all welfare payments, including SP and paying a UBI (Universal Basic Income) of say ) £15,000 per person, irrespective of their situation from age 18-death.

If you actually total up every single benefit paid, including state pension, child benefit, YC, free school meals, pupil premium etc etc etc then it would probably cost less.

Most people, I truly believe, would choose to still work, some full time, some part time, to top that up so housing etc etc could be enhanced. It also gives those with children (and indeed without) the opportunity to retrain or attend higher education.

I’ll st back and eat my popcorn …..

Remember, only imo

I'm fine on £10, 600 per year my occupational pension.
I sell a few things on Ebay & have savings I could use till I get my state pension in 18 months time at 67.
DH works & pays our council tax & most utilities, but I buy 95%
of food & household items, pay half tradesmen's bills, pay for our holidays, run a car, pay all the vets bills.
We're in an "expensive" area. I thought I would be dipping in to my savings, but so far I seem to have enough for what I want.

I can't see the logic in the state paying people the same p.a. whether they're top earners & single, or unemployed with 2 children & additional costs associated with disability, Cossy? Is this what you meant? I might be missing something....

Shinamae

I have the old rate state Pension and I also work 18 hours a week. I usually pay about £160 a month, tax
So with my wages and state pension I have about £18,000 a year, when I read on here some peoples Pension pots I can’t believe how much they’ve go 😵‍💫I never had a workplace Pension and actually I do manage well enough(I don’t drink drive or smoke)
I was able to buy my council house outright 23 years ago so I have not got the burden of rent Or Mortgage…

I think you do extremely well.

My husband and I are both fully retired, both have new SP and very modest private pensions.

But surely the money we get in our state pension goes back into the economy anyway. Thankfully, when my marriage ended 25 years ago, my solicitor negotiated one of my husbands pensions as part of the settlement. Retirement was such a long way ahead back then and I was too stressed to even think so far ahead. The pension from my NHS job is @£80 a month and I’d been a stay at home mum prior to that. If I was on just a state pension I would not have been able to help my children with child care as I couldn’t afford to run my ancient car. Couldn’t afford to move house. Couldn’t buy anything apart from essentials. Growing up and growing older I always thought I lived in a country that would indeed look after me ‘from the cradle to the grave’.

If I had to live on just my own earned State Pension, it would not be enough, but it has increased since my husband died. Still not enough, as neither of us had complete contribution records because of time out for training / children.
So my SP would need to be topped up.

But I have my own occupational teachers’ pension, albeit from only 22 years contributions, and now half of my late husband’s occupational pension. Altogether this is more than some people earn.
I would not expect my State Pension to be increased now to the equivalent of minimum wage. The country cannot afford it and I don’t need it.

valdali

I'm fine on £10, 600 per year my occupational pension.
I sell a few things on Ebay & have savings I could use till I get my state pension in 18 months time at 67.
DH works & pays our council tax & most utilities, but I buy 95%
of food & household items, pay half tradesmen's bills, pay for our holidays, run a car, pay all the vets bills.
We're in an "expensive" area. I thought I would be dipping in to my savings, but so far I seem to have enough for what I want.

I can't see the logic in the state paying people the same p.a. whether they're top earners & single, or unemployed with 2 children & additional costs associated with disability, Cossy? Is this what you meant? I might be missing something....

If you mean my para on UBI, that’s how UBI works. Every individual is paid a flat rate and what they then choose to do to generate more income, which is taxed from the first penny earned, is up to them.

I don’t think any country has ever fully adopted it but there have been “trials”

We even trialled it here, for a year believe, but with a very small group of careleavers.

It’s clearly very innovative and entirely different from any welfare or benefits system we’ve ever had, but some agonists seem to believe it would actually work.

The UK bill for all benefits and SP in 2025 was £215 billion, so I can see how some believe this might be a better route.

If I didn’t have my ex husbands added pension my state pension is £800 per month. I don’t see how I could possibly live on that. My monthly outgoings are £200 and then there are things like car tax, mot, boiler maintenance. I wouldn’t be able to put money into my crisis fund or save up to replace my old car.

Is the UK State Pension really enough?

No, not in my opinion.

But do we want to pay more in tax as in other countries to fund an increase in SP?

Cossy. I think you are starting from a faulty assumption:

[ Quote] I am assuming minimum wage is calculated based on what our government believes is the minimum amount of money the average person requires to live.

It isn’t. It’s a pay floor - designed to protect as many low-paid workers as possible without hurting jobs or the economy.

Guidelines are:

• It should not fall below two-thirds of median hourly earnings

• It should take take into account increased costs of living over the previous year and/

• Considers the impacts on businesses and the wider economy.

It’s the third one that’s problematic.

In short, people could and should be paid more, Union leaders such as Mick Lynch repeated call for a proper living wage but employers don’t like it, whether they would be able to pay it or not. Heaven forbid that the CEOs and other directors of some of our largest employers should be paid less than £5 million a year and often much more. But then if these employers paid their employees more how would small businesses compete for staff?

We know that wage growth leads to inflation because employers push the increased costs of providing goods and services to consumers. In addition, consumers with more money tend spend it chasing a limited supply of goods and services and that causes inflation too. It’s a vicious circle.

We know that the discussion about removing the triple lock is to uncouple it from earnings growth but that would leave pensioners unable to keep up with the cost of inflation caused by earnings growth - which would be unfair.

Again, as I said in my first post, the way to deal with this is to control the costs of life’s essentials, the things we have to spend most of our money on: food, water, energy and the biggest one, housing (including the taxation of housing through council tax). Tackle those, especially extortionate private rents and we would need far fewer safety nets.

And the real big one overarching all of those is the cost of adult social care. Nationalise that and remove the moneymen creaming off the top and we would all have to pay far less council tax.

All that said, I could live on my SP alone which would be full but for contracted-out deductions as I paid NIC for 50 years. I do live very simply though. However, without savings to fall back on, it would leave very little for any luxuries, for larger household maintenance costs or to replace my ageing car which is just scraping through its MOT each year and other emergencies.

My biggest outgoing is council tax even with 25% single occupancy discount but if I had only full SP I would qualify for enough Council Tax Support to bring my income up to the £15,000 mark - as you have suggested as a benchmark.