Still impressed by BJ?

I try and read as much as possible from reliable scientists and medical experts, without political spin, and it seems that very many do not agree with the government's action plan announced last Thursday.

From the Guardian Mar 14th.
Scientists urge government to enforce social distancing now.
245 UK people support an open letter including scientists from a wide range of departments.......also backed by 29 international signatories.^
Briefly the letter says In particular we are deeply preoccupied by the timeline of the proposed plan...............
Under unconstrained growth, this outbreak will affect millions of people in the next few weeks. This will most probably put the NHS at serious risk of not being able to cope with the flow of patients needing intensive care..........
Going for 'herd immunity' at this point does not seem a viable option.......

The full text of the letter can be accessed on the Guardian site.

It would help if the government published details of the advice they have received informing policy.

Razzy ??Very good post.

I agree Greeneyedgirl

Just what is the alternative?

Everyone on lockdown?

Fine.

What about medical staff? Are they still to go to work?

Electricians? Utility staff? Plumbers?

Will we end up with power cuts?

No Internet? They already have issues in Italy with regard to that.

There is no easy answer to any of this.

None of us know

There are many experts who think the way we're handing this is the correct way

To quote either The Guardian or The Mail will get you your political persuasion's viewpoint

It’s an open letter which has been widely reported on numerous media outlets of all persuasions.

I think all the children and young adults are going to get the virus anyway. They may as well get on with it and develop 'herd immunity'. The only advice should be for all over 60s and people with health issues to self isolate. Everyone else should just get on with normal life and self isolate if unwell. Otherwise the economy is going to go completely down the pan and that's what looks like happening at the moment.

To accept rapid 'herd immunity' is to accept that many of those at risk will die needlessly because the NHS is overwhelmed. There is no evidence that herd immunity will work either. There is much that is unknown about this virus, it's mutation rate, and whether those who have contracted Covid -19 will remain immune.
I am obtaining my information from reputable medical and scientific sources, and do not accept that the letter I quoted was politically motivated.

Basically the government want to do nothing apart from advising hand washing, not going on cruises and staying home if you are sick. The empty shelves in the shops show that most people don’t trust the government to look after them , it’s each person for themselves. So many events have cancelled without waiting for the government to stop dithering, which shows a lack of trust in the governments position.

The government has a strategy. It is outlined here:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-51874084

People may disagree with this strategy but it is not dithering. It is delaying with a purpose.

It has been criticised as, in all probability, any strategy would be in this situation. I heard on the radio that the scientists signing the letter were not virologists who might be better placed to take an informed view.

People should not 'trust the government to look after them' because that is not a realistic position under any administration in the current situation. People and organisations are making their own decisions. We may not know whose strategy works best until next year.

It’s not just ‘people’ who disagree with this strategy - it’s almost 250 scientists from a wide range of disciplines and the WHO have expressed concerns about the herd immunity approach. Virologists are not the only specialists who understand the spread of disease - although it’s actually no epidemiologist who has added their name to the letter.

No epidemiologist has

Razzy that is one of the most sensible posts I've read on GN about the coronavirus - absolutely agree.

This link is to an article written by an expert in the field. It seems that when they heard about the 'herd immunity strategy' they thought it was a joke. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/15/epidemiologist-britain-herd-immunity-coronavirus-covid-19

There are plenty of experts who believe this way is the best way

Tiresome how this is being politicised

One would think Boris was sat there ignoring all advice

He's not

The WHO doesn’t agree that the herd immunity approach is the best one and nearly 250 experts have gone on record to express significant concerns - but no, the Tories on here complain it’s nothing more than a dig at Boris.

The guy who wrote that article is Dr William Hanage a professor of the evolution and epidemiology of infectious disease at Harvard. I have a feeling he knows what he is talking about

Just out of interest, I used the facility on the coronavirus section of the BBC website to see how many COVID-19 cases had been identified in my borough. There were 5. Westminster had 24; Surrey 15; Suffolk 1; and Norfolk 0. In the UK, there were 1,372 out of over 40,000 tested.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274

These numbers will undoubtedly rise but, even so, it might make it difficult to enforce tough national measures across the UK just now.

Perhaps someone will soon suggest sealing off the border between Westminster and surrounding boroughs! There is a certain irony that, within the EU, the response in a growing number of countries is to close their borders.

If we hadn't spent so much on foreign aid and remembered that "Charity begins at home" we could have had so many critical and intensive care places. Maybe this awful plague will bring people to their senses.

but no, the Tories on here complain it’s nothing more than a dig at Boris.

Who said I was a Tory?

Nobody knows what's going to work. Nobody.

This is quite a good article if you can manage to read something that questions your line of thought

edition.cnn.com/2020/03/13/uk/uk-coronavirus-response-boris-johnson-intl-gbr/index.html

There is no simple answer to this. None at all.

Thank you for posting that Daisymae, I read it a couple of days ago. This is one of "the people" perhaps Cunco is alluding to. He is Dr William Hanage, professor of evolution and epidemiology of infectious disease at Harvard.
Some may not read it as it is in the "dreaded Guardian" but I will quote some points he makes.

The UK should not be trying to create a 'herd immunity' that will take care of itself. Policy should be directed at slowing the outbreak to a (more) manageable rate.

We talk about vaccine generating herd immunity..........this is not a vaccine. This is an actual pandemic that will make a very large number of people sick and some of them will die.

It's worth reading the whole article, he and his colleagues thought our government's policy was satire at first!!

You mean you’re not a Tory voter Oopsminty? You surprise me - your many posts on here give the distinct impression that you’re right wing. Are you to the right of Tory perhaps?

I have already read that article which provides a critical analysis of the UK Govt’s approach and I stand by my earlier posts re the WHO and many other experts.

Trouble is if they close the schools grannies will have to childmind or parents will have to stay off work.

Lesser talked about is that children from poor families won’t get free school at midday and will go hungry. There’s plenty of them out there through no fault of their own. Current thinking is that children are less at risk at school, e.g. not running the streets getting into trouble from whoever, not being abused, by whoever and not going hungry and learning 3 Rs that might one day help them out of poverty. It’s sad but true. Those of us lucky enough to have roof over head, warm clothes and shoes, and warm food in the kitchen when we feel like it and loving friends and family can thank our lucky stars. Some don’t.

Come to think of it - where is Johnson??

14 more have now died.

I absolutely agree that schools should not close. Children may be neglected and the economy will suffer even more than it clearly is already. Who will deliver food and provide medical care and other essential services if the parents aren't at work?