Antibody test shows that 50 - 80% more people have had C19 than was thought (US)

Here is an interesting piece on WHO involvement from Sydney Morning Herald

February 1 would prove to be a fateful day: it was when Australia truly decided to move ahead of the WHO and never look back.

Other measures that would follow - such as the worldwide travel ban, declaring a global pandemic, the creation of the national cabinet and social-distancing measures - all stemmed from this day.

Announcing the ban, Morrison was questioned by a journalist over why Australia was doing it against the advice of the WHO. “Because our medical advice is it’s in the interest of Australians to do so,” Morrison said.

Two days later, the WHO’s director-general, Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, hit out at Australia and the United States for putting in place travel restrictions from China, saying there was no need for measures that “unnecessarily interfere with international travel and trade”. If anything, this reinforced the Australian government’s decision.

And, of course, there are no visitors at the moment ....... or very few.

Perhaps you're a statistician Gran52

On some threads you seemed bewildered by what is going on and asked a lot of questions which other posters kindly answered for you, now you seem to be an authority on what is happening.

Gran52 I think many of us have relatives who work in hospitals, in ICU for extremely long shifts, in path labs etc and yes, we do realise that they are quieter than usual except in the areas designated for COVID19 patients.
We also know why.
Outpatient appointments have , in the main been cancelled.
Operations have been postponed
Treatments are on hold

Hospitals are not the best place to be at the moment unless one is a staff member or being cared for because one has the virus.
Medical staff from other departments are being trained in ICU work.

You sound puzzled about it.
What is your job that you do not realise why?

Oh Gran52. Could you be transferred? Then some of those who are working could take a break.

I’d really like to know which hospital that is Gran52.

My family work in three hospitals in different areas f the country. Those are not empty.

Would you be prepared to at least indicate which area to f the country you work in?

Callistemon - Facts are as stated regarding empty wards at hospital where I work. Perhaps you and other readers do your own research as to situation regarding empty hospital wards at other hospitals in the UK...... Where I work we all feel the round of applause on Thursday nights is a bit of a joke

I work a hospital - wards are empty.

Where on earth do you work?

It said on the news that people are frightened to go to hospital when they would normally do so because of Covid 19.

It wasn’t that rare for people to wait all weekend with symptoms of heart attacks because they didn’t want to bother the doctor! Or perhaps were frightened of the outcome?

I find your posts unfathomable too, Gran52

How can the number of deaths from this virus be over-calculated?

Are you a nurse, a doctor, admin, laboratory staff, porter, mortuary attendant, cleaner?
Perhaps a pathologist?

Perhaps you could share your inside knowledge of the true facts and figures so that we can assess for ourselves?

Any frontline, probably poorly paid, admin staff I have had to deal with at our local hospital have been wonderful (so far).

I had a hiccup once but that was due to an error by someone from the appointments department who contacted me by phone; since then a belt and braces approach seems to be the norm.

As for some of the more senior management, medical staff have reportedly found some of their decisions unfathomable and said that they managed perfectly well before these posts were created.

We did anyway Gran52. I said that on this site after the election results and was mocked.

Yes this is true.... coronavirus death figures have been vastly over calculated to spread panic in the general public. I work a hospital - wards are empty. Just look at what is happening .... we have given up just about all of our rights and freedom ... Nobody ever voted for this, not even public debate.... we now live in a police state dictatorship

Agree, Growstuff.

Management in hospitals hasn't caused a crisis in PPE - a shortage of PPE and the resources to buy equipment has.

The responsibility is the government's and nobody else's, however much the spin machine and PR tries to persuade people otherwise.

In my experience it's the front line admin staff who do an abysmal job. They're jobsworths, who don't seem to be the sharpest knives in the box and are incapable of using their brains and any common sense they have. Some of them could do with training in interpersonal skills too because they're just downright rude.

PS. I realise that's a huge generalisation, but has unfortunately been my experience. I stopped complaining to PALS about my experiences with some of these people because I don't think anything was ever done.

Management in hospitals I’ve worked in and been a patient in is ramshackle, badly organised and a disgrace. Top people earning silly money with no particular skills either with people or finances. There need to be huge fundamental changes made and more effort to use money sensibly and effectively.

I think an issue with SARS was that, while it was less infectious, it was also more deadly, so that it killed its hosts.

I agree with you that the best we can hope for is treating the symptoms, which is why it's so important that the NHS isn't overwhelmed and that its staff are protected.

The official figures for deaths in the US is actually 40,000 just where the other figures come from is a mystery.
Are we going to get an antibody test, probably not a test that is reliable for Corona virus, because the virus behavior is unpredictable.

In another forum it was explained why a vaccine is doubtful, never mind being tested anytime soon. MERS and SARS were also Corona viruses, no vaccine was produced, both epidemics declined naturally because they were much less infectious than Covid 19
Worryingly no vaccine has ever been successful for Corona viruses in human or animal treatment, the common cold is a Corona virus they have searched in vain for decades for a cure.

I’m just repeating what seemed to be plausible explanation, we must really hope that it’s wrong, until then all we can do is treat the symptoms

We already know that many more people have had this virus than the official figures from every country indicate.
We know this because some people have mild, negligible symptoms which go unreported and others may be asymptomatic.
Even some who may feel ill may not report in to their GP. COVID19 became notifiable here at the beginning of March but some people may have contracted it before then.

Until we have reliable, official antibody testing available we will not know.

growstuff I was reading about that research and I think that the results are going to be very interesting.

Gagajo is this just in the States?
I wasn't aware that there was a test which has been widely produced as yet that is reliable and laboratory-verified?

We have been warned that such tests may risk increasing infection rates if people think they are immune when they may not be.

MOnica I agree with you. That's why I delved a bit deeper, to find out what the original research was actually claiming.

growstuff The research group are not claiming anything about heard immunity. That conclusion has been reached by others, whoever they may be, they are not named.

It is interesting reading this thread, already people are taking the results of a small survey in one small place and applying it universally and drawing conclusions from it that are just not there.

This is what happens to so much scientific and other research these days, the research team publish a small note in a scientific journal hoping to attract more funding or encourage other teams to do the same research to see if they get the same results. The team are cautious and make no great claims for their research, but a journalist sees the report, knows the subject is of high interest at the moment, writes it up, speaks to a couple of people (Who?, he doesn't say). To attract attention he writes it up as being more than it is, and Yahoo picks it up and runs with it.

Gagajo has reported it, and with good reason, it is an interesting result. But now people on GN are ratchetting it up further, reading the research results, but not the caveats and assuming that the results are much more reliable than they really are and making all kinds of extrapolations from that.

All that has happened is that a reputable university did a small scale survey and got results they hadn't expected, but do not want to make any claims until others have replicated them and an expert in the field, not at that university, has peer reviewed them, that is studied everything from sampling methods, tests done, analysis to write up and agreed with them. In a case like this several peer reviewers would need to check it.

Sorry to be such a deaths head at the feast, but these results are neither a breakthrough, nor a guide to possible future action.

GagaJo. I think there are so many numbers and graphs and charts on the go now that it certainly makes my brain hurt at times!

There's an awful lot of pressure from the US alt-right to lift restrictions and persuade people that it's not so bad as they think.