Should we ask over 60s to stay in?

To put it brutally COVID culled the sickest and frailest. Those who would probably have died within the year anyway. This as much as new treatments accounts for the drop in deaths and hospitalisation in the second wave.

Mortality rates by age will be based on these deaths. I suspect that, while the death rate does rise with age, the death rate for older people without underlying medical conditions who are fit and healthy is much lower.

It's an awful way to die though.

Lots of ways of dying are awful. My father, fully in his right mind, despite sedation, slowly died of heart disease struggling to breathe

Agree M0nica. I watched my dad die from lung cancer, a tortuous process where he struggled for every breath. Many illnesses have the potential for a painful, undignified death.

My sister died slowly and hideously of brain cancer. Covid/flu/pneumonia would have been a blessing.

SueDonim, the death toll from flu and pneumonia is low because - many of those who would have succumbed this year have already gone with Coronavirus.

My son's friend (in his thirties) died from Pancreatic cancer. He was in terrible pain and there was just no effective relief from it. We allow such awful cruelty to the dying - yet we'd be prosecuted if we let our pets suffer like that.

Over 60s?? I would hope you were joking, but clearly not.

This slightly-over-70, and dh ditto, are certainly not staying in. We don’t have food shopping delivered, and we need our exercise in the fresh air.
We are lucky in that we’re reasonably fit and have no underlying health conditions though.

I don't know, I can think of pros and cons so, I'm going to let the individual decide and say, we all have in our power to take all possible precautions and we should all be doing that.

What would be the point in over 60's isolating?

Isn't it plainly obvious that the virus will now run it's course (eventually) through the population? There is no defeating it.

All our efforts to contain it are merely an attempt to slow down the spread. We're trying to avoid the NHS being overwhelmed, possible civil unrest and huge disruption to services - that's all.

We allow such awful cruelty to the dying - yet we'd be prosecuted if we let our pets suffer like that.

Absolutely right Hetty, we afford more dignity to our animals in end of life care than to people.

The vast majority of the hospitalised patients are over 60, nearly all those who die are over 60, and by no means all those who die have underlying health conditions, or are in the oldest, frailest groups, it’s indiscriminate in that respect. Our immune systems are weaker, regardless of how fit we think we are, so there has to be an argument that we should stay at home. None of us want to, and we find ways of justifying why we can’t or won’t, but the facts speak for themselves unfortunately.

I have no reason not to agree with all you say Casdon, unfortunately the over 60s have been propelled back into the workplace by successive governments who insist that we must continue to work. Without an income, how can the over 60s keep a roof over their heads, food on the table and support themselves? They have no choice but to put themselves into situations where they are most vulnerable.

I know Chewbacca, I’m still working too. It’s not fair, but all we can do is arm ourselves with the facts and stay as safe as we can given that we don’t have the option. It does annoy me though when some people bury their heads in the sand and justify behaviours that put them and others at risk.

Chewbacca (and Casdon) very true. Maybe it's time all over 60s were 'furloughed' and given financial support? Surely it would relieve pressure on the NHS.

Casdon

The vast majority of the hospitalised patients are over 60, nearly all those who die are over 60, and by no means all those who die have underlying health conditions, or are in the oldest, frailest groups, it’s indiscriminate in that respect. Our immune systems are weaker, regardless of how fit we think we are, so there has to be an argument that we should stay at home. None of us want to, and we find ways of justifying why we can’t or won’t, but the facts speak for themselves unfortunately.

It’s all to do with our thymus gland isn’t it? I actually read an article about the thymus gland before the pandemic.

Hetty58

Chewbacca (and Casdon) very true. Maybe it's time all over 60s were 'furloughed' and given financial support? Surely it would relieve pressure on the NHS.

That would suit me down to the ground Hetty.

Keep your Vitamin D levels up everyone, to help your immune system. This is particularly important now we haven't so much sunshine, also for anyone with dark skin as they don't make Vit D so readily. I have no idea why the government isn't publicising this more. It is all in Lancet, not an old wives tale.

Dr John Campbell has been telling people to take VitD for months. He can’t understand why the government don’t advise it. Also zinc is quite important too. And I’ve just bought some quercetin.

Hetty58

Chewbacca (and Casdon) very true. Maybe it's time all over 60s were 'furloughed' and given financial support? Surely it would relieve pressure on the NHS.

There are an estimated 20-30 million people either over 60 and/or with underlying health problems which put them at higher risk of death. There is no way in the world that the government would find the money to support all of them, if they were forced to shield. They didn't even do that much the first time round when only a couple of million had to shield.

People should be aware of their individual risk, whether it's due to age or a health condition, and act accordingly. For those who can't leave the house or have dementia and might not realise what's going on, there should be support and protection available. There should also be more protection for high risk people who can't work from home. However, forcing everybody over 60 to stay at home would be unrealistic and push many into poverty.

I don't think you can force anyone to do anything - just advise and let each person make their own decisions. We are both over 65 and have underlying health issues so therefore only go out when it's absolutely necessary but that's our choice.

As others have said many our age (and older) are carers for either young children or elderly relatives or still working full time and don't have the luxury of choosing to stay home.

Good gracious - No!
I am 69yrs. I think that my mother needs to stay in - and she does.

If they tried to do that I would refuse to comply. Sorry.

Good question kittylester. Although the death rate , so far, is highest amongst those over 80 the risks increase once 60 is reached and go on rising.

People in their 60's are part of the work force as well as being involved in caring for elderly parents and grandchildren. For those reasons they can't be asked to stay in. I was that person 10 years ago but I'm luckily now retired so its easier to keep myself a bit safer.

A GP friend says we missed the boat and should have had a circuit breaker three weeks ago. It's too late now, the virus is raging through. I am 'clinically vulnerable' , awful phrase that I can't associate with myself but know I have to accept that. I'm continuing to be very careful. In our friendship/family group we have two friends in their late 60's recovering well from the virus. In the mid 30's group, which includes our children, a number are positive but not very sick and every local school has bubble groups at home because of covid contact.
I don't think the over 60's should stay home but I do believe the whole population should be responsible, follow the hands/face/distance guidance. I wish the anti vac/conspiracy theorists would stay at home.

Can I just say, that it wasnt my suggestion but something that has been bandied about in the media.

This 71 year old would rather not be confined again but, if needs must.....!3