Up to the 2nd December.

twitter.com/timspector/status/1322833146669371392?s=20 For interest, from the Zoe Covid Symptom Study App, with over a million users each day. The best evidence by a country mile!

MaggieMay69
Spot on.
I can't comprehend how wishywashy women can be feeling sorry for the philandering bafoon who put himself up for the job. So arrogant he ignores all expert advice, then blames everyone else. The man who withdrew pandemic planning to push through his Brexit agenda.
I know one woman who won't be feeling sorry for him. One who probably says to her husband evety night, "lets get brexit done!" Teresa May - i wonder what she really thinks about BoJo right now.
I would also like to know how much it costs the taxpayer for his current bit of stuff and sprog number - who even knows - to reside at no10. This Government have just all got their heads in the trough.

grannyrebel7

I thought the usual rhetoric and flowery language was missing from Boris's bulletin yesterday. There was no 'a stitch in time saves nine' or 'invisible mugger' or ' we're going to wrestle Covid to the ground'. It was all very straight to the point and less optimistic than usual. Perhaps he's had a change of tack to get people to realise how serious this is. It's possible of course that the lockdown could be extended but we'll have to wait and see what happens.

It depends on compliance and what happens over the next two weeks or so. The people who will be hospitalised and/or die, have probably already been infected.

If anybody dangles Christmas as some kind of reward, I think I'll scream. There will be about two million students returning home from all over the place, bringing their infections with them. Then there will be groups getting together - with alcohol - followed by New Year - with alcohol. If lock-down doesn't extend to Christmas, I hope all NHS leave has been cancelled for January.

You believe what you want to Hetty. Personally, I prefer to believe scientists and statisticians and I'll act accordingly.

Hetty I didn't compare infections because I know people in the first wave weren't tested. That's why I didn't post a chart with them in. However, they did go to hospital and they did die.

Can you honestly not see the rise in new infections over the last few weeks? Or see the rise in hospital admissions and deaths?

Growstuff, there's a big problem with the 'new infections' comparisons - simply because the number of people tested is not comparable with the first wave. It's likely that infection rates back then were far higher than thought (or measured).

I think the only fairly accurate numbers we have to compare are the excess deaths figures.

Still, there's a problem, though, because many deaths are not due to Coronavirus. (That is, not directly, although other causes, such as heart attacks and strokes have increased due to people not accessing healthcare.)

I thought the usual rhetoric and flowery language was missing from Boris's bulletin yesterday. There was no 'a stitch in time saves nine' or 'invisible mugger' or ' we're going to wrestle Covid to the ground'. It was all very straight to the point and less optimistic than usual. Perhaps he's had a change of tack to get people to realise how serious this is. It's possible of course that the lockdown could be extended but we'll have to wait and see what happens.

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202011/medium-688299-covid-1nov.png https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202011/medium-133409-covid-hospital.png

Can you really not see a second wave?

The Government have made a complete cock-up and anyone feeling sorry for them with all the money they are raking from this, you are truly deluded!!!

Test and Trace has been done completely wrong, and not nearly half the amount of people that should have been contacted were!

I cannot believe people STILL think they are doing the best they can! We should have locked down weeks ago! A circuit breaker, instead of this now...but they didn't, because just like in March they dithered and delayed and thousands died!!

Those folk who only follow the newspapers though are going to think they're doing well, seeing as Murdoch supports/owns the Tories!

12 billion spent, world beating test & trace? Not on your nelly.

They are thieves...the lot of them. One of them even voting to keep Children hungry over Christmas and then asking our local tea-rooms in Aylesbury if they could bring the press to help hand out the lunches that the tea-room itself was organising & paying for! Just for a photo op!

Tories are robbing us in broad daylight.

I worked through the last lockdown and will through this one . I think people have become a lot more complacent about social distancing when the mask wearing came in and just walk round stores and public places as though things are normal . I think more emphasis should be placed on distancing to remind people that it still needs to be done ?

Hetty58

Yes, take a look at Figure 2, where the five year average is marked by a dotted line. I don't see any second wave there.

the figures are only up to the 16 October. They have risen dramatically since then.

Yes, take a look at Figure 2, where the five year average is marked by a dotted line. I don't see any second wave there.

NemosMum

Tinydancer I think you have mistaken the total number of Covid-related deaths with excess deaths. As I said, total deaths are pretty much normal for the time of year, riding near the 5 year maxima. Here is the link to the relevant Office of National Statistics graphs for total deaths and showing Covid-related deaths and other respiratory deaths. There will be excess deaths from all the cardiac, stroke, cancer and other patients not treated by our "National Covid Service" . There was a peak in the Spring, but not now.
www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending16october2020

And there will be even more non-Covid deaths, if hospitals are full of Covid patients and even more resources are diverted.

People in denial are the problem.

TwiceAsNice

I am not interested so much in what adults do I’m afraid. We must all calculate our own risks. I am moderately at risk but have chosen to continue to work part time in education and I am adamant that schools should stay open . I am much more concerned about children’s and adolescents mental health we should not jeopardise our children’s welfare, it is much more complicated than just learning. Close what you like but don’t mess with my grandchildren

So you know that classrooms aren't Covid safe environments. I just don't understand how anybody who professes to care about young people can force them into that environment. It would have been better right from the start to plan for blended learning because that's what we're going to end up with - all arranged at the last minute and as a reaction to what's going on, rather than taking control of it.

Parent don't know from one day to the next whether their child will infected or told to self-isolate because there is so much transmission. It would have been better to avoid the transmission as much as possible by having half classes and enabling social distancing. Parents would have been able to plan better too.

Tinydancer I think you have mistaken the total number of Covid-related deaths with excess deaths. As I said, total deaths are pretty much normal for the time of year, riding near the 5 year maxima. Here is the link to the relevant Office of National Statistics graphs for total deaths and showing Covid-related deaths and other respiratory deaths. There will be excess deaths from all the cardiac, stroke, cancer and other patients not treated by our "National Covid Service" . There was a peak in the Spring, but not now.
www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending16october2020

I am not interested so much in what adults do I’m afraid. We must all calculate our own risks. I am moderately at risk but have chosen to continue to work part time in education and I am adamant that schools should stay open . I am much more concerned about children’s and adolescents mental health we should not jeopardise our children’s welfare, it is much more complicated than just learning. Close what you like but don’t mess with my grandchildren

aonk

I’ve just been reading the papers. It seems there is very little evidence that schools are contributing to the current severe rise in cases. It’s a different scenario in the universities of course. Yes there have been some infections in schools, nearly always among the adults and, certainly in my area they seem to be dealt with quickly and efficiently. It’s yet another burden on our shaky economy if working parents have to homeschool and care for their children during the school day. I’ve also seen first hand how damaging this can be for the mental health of both children and parents.

Unless we are testing all children to get an idea of how infectious they are, there is no evidence at all that they are less infectious than the rest of society. They can easily be asymptomatic or have very mild symptoms which are gone before you know it. My grown up son and one day of feeling hot and a slight cough who wouldn't have known he was a risk to anyone else except he got privately tested because he knew he had been in the vicinity of someone who had tested positive. However, I do think that we need to be careful about denying children an education unless we look at adding an extra year or two to their school years.

No matter who is in charge politically, they are all going to be playing this by ear. This is a totally new situation which is a balancing act. No matter what any government do, they will be damned by a public who just want a magic wand waved to make it better. I feel sorriest for those who are caught in the gaps so they aren't getting the right benefits or qualify for Furlough.

We haven’t locked down in Scotland but are on Tiers. I’m not sure if a full lockdown would be a better idea. I think people do what they’re told more if it’s a total lockdown.

SunnySusie

Lock down does no good. Unless a vaccine is literally just around the corner it simply moves the problem to a few months hence, wrecks the economy and ruins peoples lives. Only medical treatments which prevent those affected from developing serious and life threatening illness - and vaccination - will tame the virus, or possibly time itself. Most pandemics peter out in due course e.g. SARS, MERS and even the First World War Spanish flu.

Lockdown gives the NHS a breather. Badly needed

Lock down does no good. Unless a vaccine is literally just around the corner it simply moves the problem to a few months hence, wrecks the economy and ruins peoples lives. Only medical treatments which prevent those affected from developing serious and life threatening illness - and vaccination - will tame the virus, or possibly time itself. Most pandemics peter out in due course e.g. SARS, MERS and even the First World War Spanish flu.

Our lockdown in Wales is due to end on 9th November, I wonder if it will, it's been 8 weeks already

Perhaps we'r going to be in 'lockdown' until young people stop having raves of 700 people which happened last night in Bristol and also stop attacking the police. Spoiled brats

Headteachers were told on the Thursday before the half term break to have distance learning packages in place. They could have been told much earlier. As it is, teachers have had to spend their break doing a huge amount of planning. Meanwhile, the government will try to make it seem that they have done everything possible to keep schools open and it was the lazy teachers and their unions who forced their hand.

This is why secondary schools should have some kind of rota system. The rate of new infections in 11 to 16 year olds has risen more steeply than in any other age group.

I think they should just close schools and be done with it. It is the economy they are worried about. If schools close people cannot work. Our children are the future and much more important than money. Kids are the worst germ spreaders as lovely as they are. They should be kept safely at home until this whole thing calms down.