Indian variant

I think that for the last year and a half, the only answer we've had to increasing cases is lockdown.

We have to remember that we've got effective vaccines that work against all the variants, even the Indian ones. The vast majority of people who are likely to die from the disease have been vaccinated. Young people are still at risk, absolutely, but the risk of death is so much smaller. And Long Covid is there, for sure, but at some point we will have to grit our teeth and open up society.

I don't know what Johnson will say this afternoon but I don't think we should stop what is going to happen on Monday. And there is still time to consider what happens next.

I don't think we should stop Monday's opening up. All the pubs and restaurants have ordered and stocked up so there would be an outcry about wastage, rightly so, if they couldnt re-open.
Maybe some kind of tier system will be introduced in the coming weeks while we get on with vaccinating the younger people.

A large number of people in their 20's and 30's will choose not to be vaccinated, going by people I've heard from. They are now vaccinating people in their 30's in our area.
My sister is 30 and was offered her vaccine several weeks ago because she had asthma as a child so I think asthmatics have been included in the 'vulnerable group'.

I'm not dismissing anyone's health as unimportant - I'm not very old myself and am considered high risk - but at what stage do we start returning to normal life?
Can you imagine wearing a mask in 30+ degree heat this summer? (if it ever arrives!)

I'm all for tightening restrictions again if the numbers start to rise but at the moment they are very low as a percentage of the population and we have already been told we will never be fully rid of the virus.

Some of those areas where the Indian variant is spreading have been in local lockdowns/tier systems longer than the majority of us. I don't believe it would work.
The surge vaccinations may curb it eventually but it does take around 3 weeks for the vaccine to provide some immunity.
To stop the spread vaccinating as much of the surrounding areas may stop it infecting more of the UK.

Doodledog

Thank you Callistemon. That's a relief.

?

I suppose the other point is that perhaps younger people do want to get back to work etc, to normal life although no-one should be forced to if they they don't think it is safe.

As soon as they get as many people vaccinated as possible, particularly in the areas where the variant is taking off, the better.
Perhaps more localised lockdowns are better.

It's worrying that the Indian Government is refusing help from charities because of the new law introduced last year. It may have been well-intentioned to stop the misuse of foreign funds but it is stopping aid getting to where it is needed.

I am asthmatic, and had my first vaccination along with everyone else in my age group (62).

I also find that asthma means that wearing a mask is horrible and makes me more breathless (despite being told on here that that this is wrong?), so I have not gone out other than for medical visits for 14 months. My life (which was very busy before) has been massively disrupted, and I am not enjoying this at all. I can't wait to get back to some sort of normal, but not at the expense of others.

It may be the case that some young people don't want to get vaccinated, (and what we should do about that is maybe for another thread) but what about those who do? To hear that the older folk they have protected all this time see them as low-risk-so-not-to-be-considered, and that they are being penalised because of the behaviour of their anti-vaxx peers must be a real slap in the face.

Callistemon, the trouble with saying that young people shouldn't be forced to go back to work is that by definition they are going to be in junior roles, where to refuse would be very difficult. If we were looking at months and months of extra lockdown I might understand the calls to 'stick to the road map', but we are just a few weeks ahead of the date for having all adults vaccinated, so it just makes no sense to me at all.

the trouble with saying that young people shouldn't be forced to go back to work is that by definition they are going to be in junior roles

True and often in hospitality where they will be inevitably meeting the general public.
Half to one-third of young adults, 18-29, have now had their first vaccination here in Wales
One vaccine centre manager said young people were "coming in their droves".

The problems will arise when people want to go abroad on holiday.

If you have asthma you are exempt from wearing a mask. I'm also exempt so I've done the same as you and barely gone out, had my shopping delivered and kept my distance when I do go out.
As I said, I'm not dismissing anyone as 'not to be considered' but if you ask the vast majority of the younger population, they want their lives back to normal more than most.
They don't see themselves as vulnerable on the whole because the official figures show this.
We've been told all along that once the case numbers and deaths fall significantly and the NHS are back to a level they can cope with, once a large percentage of the population have been vaccinated (which also in turn protects passing on the virus to those not vaccinated by a large percentage) we will start getting back to normality.
Nobody is saying don't be careful or thoughtful when around others - I personally would love social distancing to remain with strangers! - but just that we want to be able to use our own common sense now.

donnab31

That being said, I'd happily sacrifice overseas travel for the privilege and think keeping all borders closed for the time being is very sensible!

Absolutely agree.

donnab31

If you have asthma you are exempt from wearing a mask. I'm also exempt so I've done the same as you and barely gone out, had my shopping delivered and kept my distance when I do go out.
As I said, I'm not dismissing anyone as 'not to be considered' but if you ask the vast majority of the younger population, they want their lives back to normal more than most.
They don't see themselves as vulnerable on the whole because the official figures show this.
We've been told all along that once the case numbers and deaths fall significantly and the NHS are back to a level they can cope with, once a large percentage of the population have been vaccinated (which also in turn protects passing on the virus to those not vaccinated by a large percentage) we will start getting back to normality.
Nobody is saying don't be careful or thoughtful when around others - I personally would love social distancing to remain with strangers! - but just that we want to be able to use our own common sense now.

I’ve had asthma since the age of 17, working as a Nurse, qualified, have worn a mask for long hours during my working life. Never once thought to not wear a mask during this pandemic.

I am asthmatic on a ^cocktail of inhalers, drugs and often long courses of steroids have worn a face covering since beginning of March 2020.

Again, I didn't say anyone shouldn't, just that you don't have to if exempt and you don't know what my reason for being exempt is.
I physically can't wear one.

When I have gone out I have worn a mask, but as I said, that has only to medical things - I wouldn't dream of not wearing one, so I have been a virtual prisoner in my house for over a year.

Well, it looks like England is going to be business as usual, as expected. Let's hope that we don't see the level of deaths caused by the Christmas fiasco.

The issue seems to be that more younger people are being infected. So far there's no noticeable increase in hospital admission, let's hope it stays that way.

I don’t know if I am a ‘certain poster’, but I commented because to me it looked very like a racist remark. I was very careful to give the poster the benefit of any doubt, though, as I’m sure we have all posted things that we haven’t realised could be taken differently.

I don't think it was intended as a racist remark. I agree with Atqui's interpretation.

Alegrias1

tidyskatemum

A woman of Indian origin in Blackburn was blaming Boris for not stopping people from coming back from India. Does nobody have any sense of personal responsibility?

Why is it relevant that the lady was of Indian origin?

I think tidyskatemun was showing the irony of the situation.

Flights from India still coming into the U.K.

Whitewavemark2

Flights from India still coming into the U.K.

Yes but only for UK nationals who must isolate in hotels at their own expense

Yes ‘Ellanvannin* . What is wrong with their government. It’s the only way. Close the airports!

I meant THIS government

I think tidyskatemun was showing the irony of the situation.

There is no irony in this situation. Lots of women on this very forum are blaming Johnson for not stopping people coming back from India. By mentioning the fact that the woman was of Indian origin, tidyskatemum implied that people of Indian origin need to take some personal responsibility for the people coming back from India.

We don’t know how long this woman has lived in the UK. We don’t know her nationality. We don’t know if she knows anybody who has recently come back from India. We don’t know if she still has any family in India with whom she is in contact. We just know she was of “Indian origin” (Like Cliff Richard, in fact. )

But by telling us that she is of Indian origin tidyskatemum implies that she must take some responsibility for what she, tidyskatemum sees as a problem created by other people of Indian origin.

Bit of a sermon, sorry, and maybe that’s not what tidyskatemem meant at all. But I can’t imagine what she did mean, and she doesn’t have to come and tell us, of course. But anyone shouting “You see racism everywhere” might want to consider that this is because it is everywhere, and much of the time people don’t even realise what they are saying.

I don’t think now is the issue in terms of flights bringing British nationals home as they will all be quarantined, the cat is already out of the bag because of the rush back here from India before the restrictions started. The Government should not have given notice.

I’ve seen in the news that Germany are very critical of the UK approach, and are discussing imposing new restrictions on UK residents going there again. I’m not surprised they are concerned, as the impact on Europe could be enormous as they have fewer vaccinated citizens.

rosie1959

Whitewavemark2

Flights from India still coming into the U.K.

Yes but only for UK nationals who must isolate in hotels at their own expense

We cannot leave UK nationals of Indian descent to stay and take their chances there, they have to be brought home.

Bobbysgirl19

Flights coming in from India should definitely have been stopped earlier! What on earth is going on, don't we ever learn from our previous mistakes?

It is worse than that. I live in Devon and it is reported that two coachloads of crew for the cruise ships docked round the coast arrived last week from India. No checks at Heathrow, coaches to Torquay I think, tested before being allowed on the ships and two positives. Don't know if it is the Indian variant but doesn't seem unlikely. They were then put back on coach and taken to Southampton to isolate.

This is a link to the story www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-56998273

I wonder how many people they came into contact with? Did they stop at the services? Why were they allowed in from a red list country without quarantine or even testing?

We aren't being told the whole story about how these red list countries are really being treated on arrival.

Precisely, Alegrias.