Dominic Cummings

theworriedwell

If they weren't supposed to discharged people to homes without tests and they didn't have enough tests they shouldn't have discharged them to homes. There were hotels lying empty all over the country, quarantine should have been set up before people went back to homes.

Not hindsight I said it at the time.

It sounds like a good idea. There would indeed have been sufficient empty hotels to accommodate them, rather than send them to care homes. Who would have cared for them, especially if they became ill?

The evidence is beginning to build up regarding the lies being told.

The government apparently is beginning to refuse to answer questions from “unfriendly” reporters.

Grant Shapps attempts at excusing the ineixcusable on Question Time last night was cringe worthy. Again and again, he was asked if the head of Social Care was right in her assessment, or not- and his answer was, several times in a row 'oh it's not as simple as that'. Squirming.

Actually I was a bit after the fair. Apparently The National Audit Office has produced a report into our preparedness for a pandemic as it stood at the beginning of the outbreak.

I had a look but it's late and I can't make head nor tail of their site.

Well said Smileless2012 my thoughts exactly.

Or, at the very least, care homes should have been warned of the danger from infection.

If they weren't supposed to discharged people to homes without tests and they didn't have enough tests they shouldn't have discharged them to homes. There were hotels lying empty all over the country, quarantine should have been set up before people went back to homes.

Not hindsight I said it at the time.

With regard to Matt Hancock and his rather tenuous relationship with the 'truth' He stated that 'tens of thousands' of people in Bolton we're being injected every day. In actual fact, the highest figure is approximately five thousand on one day, recently the average is closer to two thousand per day
Whilst I applaud the NHS vaccine rollout, it really is exemplary, my question is, why lie about the figures? Why lie about the disgraceful failure of placing patients leaving hospital into care homes, without a test?
Even if I supported this government, which I clearly don't, I would be questioning why I had voted for people who are strangers to the truth
There needs to be an urgent enquiry, the bereaved deserve no less

GrannyGravy13

MaizieD

I am perfectly aware that a public enquiry is not a Court of Law

I have attended four Public Inquiries in the last 20 years. I can assure you, GG13, that they are only one step down from being a Court of Law. They are presided over by a judge, witnesses can employ a barrister to present their evidence and they can be cross examined on it. Barristers can also present legal arguments to the judge if appropriate.

My answer was to PippaZ , I am aware that legal advice is available.

I just find the whole debacle a very sad stain on politics in the U.K.

It is indeed, but would you rather it were kept hidden ?

Lemongrove “ Because he’s a strange one it’s hard to know what is truth and what is attempted revenge.”

Both quite possibly.

boat
^What worries me is that the next pandemic-producing bug may not have the decency to wait for an enquiry starting next year to produce a report and the government to take action on it's recommendations.^(Thu 27-May-21 21:11:55)

Exactly.

Wen I was younger my OH used to say that I should be a Tory politician because I always had an answer to everything, very quickly. My brain doesn't work that fast now.

Watching Hancock today I noticed that when questioned about the release of elderly patients into the care system, he didn't answer that question directly but said he was committed to getting testing done. This Tory govt is constantly telling us that they are committed to doing something or other but they never tell us when it's going to actually happen.

Seven years ago I bought some fabric to make a curtain. Every so often my OH asked when I was going to make it. My answer would be - I'm going to do it. I intend to do it. Si years later a friend made it for me.

The above is an example of how I feel about the Tories. They are committed to doing, or intending to do some project or other and then it's forgotten about. That is what Hancock does.

What worries me is that the next pandemic-producing bug may not have the decency to wait for an enquiry starting next year to produce a report and the government to take action on it's recommendations.

For all we know it is starting up somewhere already while attention is focussed on Covid.

What harm in having a preliminary enquiry, starting and ending soon, to produce recommendations on what needs to be put in place (as soon as possible) to be prepared, just in case.

It would not be apportioning blame so should have no effect on voting choices in the next General Election.

MaizieD

^I am perfectly aware that a public enquiry is not a Court of Law^

I have attended four Public Inquiries in the last 20 years. I can assure you, GG13, that they are only one step down from being a Court of Law. They are presided over by a judge, witnesses can employ a barrister to present their evidence and they can be cross examined on it. Barristers can also present legal arguments to the judge if appropriate.

My answer was to PippaZ , I am aware that legal advice is available.

I just find the whole debacle a very sad stain on politics in the U.K.

He didn't become an empty vessels man overnight. He wasn't a newcomer to government. Why did Johnson appoint him, if he know what he was like, which he must have done?

I think Cummings knows exactly what he's doing with these "revelations".

I am perfectly aware that a public enquiry is not a Court of Law

I have attended four Public Inquiries in the last 20 years. I can assure you, GG13, that they are only one step down from being a Court of Law. They are presided over by a judge, witnesses can employ a barrister to present their evidence and they can be cross examined on it. Barristers can also present legal arguments to the judge if appropriate.

The same man was pulling Boris's strings so now that things have backfired he's now blaming Boris. Nice man, eh ? With deputies like him you don't need enemies.
Empty vessels little man !

I can't say I've analysed everything he claimed. However, it's interesting that much of what he's claimed (from what I can see) is about actions/issues/decisions (etc) which were reported at the time and quickly brushed under the carpet and forgotten about. I think he's telling the truth about them.

If people are saying that we should wait and see if what he's saying is true then they haven't been following developments over the past year or so. I'm not saying all of it is true but much of it has been written about in articles by others, such as investigative reporters. The book, Failures of the State' which was published earlier this year, and which I have read, is by two Sunday Times reporters who have used a number of sources, news items, minutes of meetings and interviews with people from many areas, sets out much of what Cummings has said. There is already plenty of corroboration out there.

Like Pippa I would be interested to see all these threads about Cummings 'running the country'. As far as I recall there was a lot of discussion of his little jaunt to Durham (and, BTW, I think he is still lying about aspects of it, such as the 'mob' at his house. There was no 'mob' until the news broke about his trip, and then it consisted mostly of reporters and photographers. AS GG13 has pointed out. I recall one socially distanced protest, too, but not 'mobs') but not much else.

He didn't say much that was unfamiliar to those who had been keeping their eyes open...

I certainly don't think he's a white knight.

Well, many people, me included, did think that he was running the country. So, as with other things I have to hold up my hands and say I must have been wrong

So did I at the time, Maybee

But, having been proven to be a liar and prevaricator I still don't trust him an inch.

Not that I trust Boris either. However, I did think Hancock was a decent man but out of his depth.
I thought Cummings was in charge of all of them anyway and Hancock and Boris were his Archie Andrews.

Iam64 wrote: yes, I remember all these ‘allegations’ he’s making as facts during those months.

I can't say I've analysed everything he claimed. However, it's interesting that much of what he's claimed (from what I can see) is about actions/issues/decisions (etc) which were reported at the time and quickly brushed under the carpet and forgotten about. I think he's telling the truth about them.

I'm not so sure about other claims and I suspect nobody else is either, but much of what he has claimed is true - not bad for somebody who has a reputation for lying.

I have no idea what his real motivation is. I doubt very much if he's been overcome by altruism or remorse. He's not the soothsayer he claimed to be, but I'll give him credit for understanding public reactions. None of the fallout and criticism of him today will have been unexpected. He wouldn't have made the claims he has, if he'd thought they'd be dismissed out of hand, so I'm sure he has some goal.

Iam64

MayBee70

Well, many people, me included, did think that he was running the country. So, as with other things I have to hold up my hands and say I must have been wrong. I still don’t trust Cummings or his long term agenda, but I do believe what he said yesterday because it fitted in with how I felt at the time that the pandemic was being handled (or not handled). A bit like getting the right answer to something albeit arriving there by the wrong route.

Thanks MayBee70. I’ve caught up with this thread with increasing irritation at what I see as a tribal response from right wingers.
I listened to Cummings. Two immediate responses from me. Firstly, he’s very angry and I’m sure he has contemp notes/audio recordings to back up what he;s saying. Secondly - yes, I remember all these ‘allegations’ he’s making as facts during those months. We didn’t have Ppe, Johnson told everyone he was shaking hands with COVID sufferers. His approach changed after his near death experience. And of course - herd immunity, care homes - I’ll stop there

I wonder if anyone remembers, as I do, feeling that no one was running the country - and that wasn't just when Johnson was in hospital or ill either.

Matt Hancock is not telling the truth today.

It may be easier to count when he does than when he doesn't.

From The Spectator email: (so not a Gnetter's opinion)
Matt Hancock repeatedly dodged questions on whether he had told the Prime Minister that people going into care homes from hospital would be tested.

MayBee70

Well, many people, me included, did think that he was running the country. So, as with other things I have to hold up my hands and say I must have been wrong. I still don’t trust Cummings or his long term agenda, but I do believe what he said yesterday because it fitted in with how I felt at the time that the pandemic was being handled (or not handled). A bit like getting the right answer to something albeit arriving there by the wrong route.

Thanks MayBee70. I’ve caught up with this thread with increasing irritation at what I see as a tribal response from right wingers.
I listened to Cummings. Two immediate responses from me. Firstly, he’s very angry and I’m sure he has contemp notes/audio recordings to back up what he;s saying. Secondly - yes, I remember all these ‘allegations’ he’s making as facts during those months. We didn’t have Ppe, Johnson told everyone he was shaking hands with COVID sufferers. His approach changed after his near death experience. And of course - herd immunity, care homes - I’ll stop there

MayBee70

Well, many people, me included, did think that he was running the country. So, as with other things I have to hold up my hands and say I must have been wrong. I still don’t trust Cummings or his long term agenda, but I do believe what he said yesterday because it fitted in with how I felt at the time that the pandemic was being handled (or not handled). A bit like getting the right answer to something albeit arriving there by the wrong route.

It appears to fit in with what the fact-checkers are producing to Maybee and they are only using facts, not likes/dislikes or politics so worth listening to.

The lies go on and on.

Dr. Mike Face
@EmergMedDr
·
5h
Emergency departments DID NOT WANT to send the elderly with covid or suspected covid back to care homes.

We wanted to test them.

However, PHE and the government only allowed us to test those who were being admitted to hospital.

Matt Hancock is not telling the truth today.