Let us hope that Johnson has finally learned some lessons.

JenniferEccles

No I am not blaming everyone, just stating the fact that our relatively high death toll is due to multiple factors, one of which , obesity, is entirely preventable,

Well that's interesting Dr. Eccles. I'm sure all those who have put on weight due to a health condition, or the medication they are taking for one, will be thrilled to know that they could have prevented it - if only they had your will power to make them well

Baggs

I presume the people who had covid (but without anyone knowing this) and who were discharged to care homes and then died, had gone into hospital with other health issues (possibly ones that were going to be causes of their deaths anyway, regardless of covid, (the average of death from covid during the early part of the pandemic in UK was higher than the usual average) and caught covid in hospital. I've yet to unferstand how that was fault of the PM, of any PM.

So they were old and going to die anyway so it doesn’t matter? Like my friend who had a fall, went to hospital, was sent to a care home where she caught covid and died. But hey, she was 96 so was going to die at some point.

Boris Johnson has been losing weight steadily since he was ill. I thought how much slimmer he’s looking when I saw the wedding pictures. He’s obviously had enough self control to lose weight. Mind you, I’ve always thought that might be down to Carrie’s influence. It’s been obvious for a long time that he was losing weight.

JenniferEccles

No I am not blaming everyone, just stating the fact that our relatively high death toll is due to multiple factors, one of which , obesity, is entirely preventable,

I thought Johnson was going to do something about that after his own dice with death (most probably due to his own obesity). But have heard nothing about it since his initial announcement. Just as he doesn’t seem to have tackled his own obesity. He strikes me as someone totally lacking in any sort of self control.

No I am not blaming everyone, just stating the fact that our relatively high death toll is due to multiple factors, one of which , obesity, is entirely preventable,

So are you suggesting that all those who died had only themselves to blame JenniferEccles? [Mon 31-May-21 11:21:10]

Why do some people always turn to victim blaming in order to excuse the government?

Yes some countries have fared better than us in terms of deaths but unfortunately we are an unhealthy nation.
We are the second fattest nation in Europe second only I believe to tiny little Malta.
It’s been well documented that obesity is one of the major risk factors for dying from covid (plus many other illnesses of course) yet still too many people are in denial about their weight.
Boris Johnson is not responsible for that is he?

It’s not as simple as just looking at deaths per head of population.
Many other factors play their part.

I have just been listening to a very patient newsreader on the BBC reading out messages sent in. Many of them sound like children stamping their feet. "But they said they would", "I want" "I'll do it my own way".

I find it stunning that a part of our society has so little insight into the issues involved.

As for Boris keeping an eye on it - isn't he off on a mini-moon?

We will recover if we take the time needed and help other countries - almost whatever the government does, thankfully.

...people ignored lockdown and travelled to India, often in family groups.....

Absolutely! The government were far too late in putting India on the red list, and therefore allowed this new variant to enter and take hold in Britain. This simple fact annoys me intensely.
However, the ignorant and selfish people who travelled to India when it was illegal to travel or take holidays, even in the UK absolutely astound me. The level of selfishness that it takes to take your entire family on holiday when holidays are actually illegal is simply astounding. Frankly words fail me. I wonder if they’ve all been slapped with the £5000 fine as appropriate. Somehow I doubt it.

I presume the people who had covid (but without anyone knowing this) and who were discharged to care homes and then died, had gone into hospital with other health issues (possibly ones that were going to be causes of their deaths anyway, regardless of covid, (the average of death from covid during the early part of the pandemic in UK was higher than the usual average) and caught covid in hospital. I've yet to unferstand how that was fault of the PM, of any PM.

I think Boris has to weigh up Covid restrictions versus opening up (shops, restaurants) for the economy. The mayor in Porto was enthusiastic about hosting the Championship Cup Final wasn’t he? He said it was so important for the economy.

The Army’s out & about door to door in Bolton today offering jabs. Translators are with them. Seems we are doing all we can to up these vaccinations and protect as many people as possible. The numbers in Bolton are coming down. 7 days ago there were 450 in 100,000 people with Covid. Today it is 382:100,000. Going in the right direction!

So in 4 weeks who knows? Hopefully further unlocking and our freedoms back.

Numbers of deaths are low. The NHS bed situation is stable - not overwhelmed. I think it’s looking good.

Johnson plays to the gallery, always has. Likes to be popular so will adjust the sails accordingly.

Premiership by media.

I wonder why the schools data has been suppressed?

Dithering as in constantly changing his mind.

"Dithering" always suggesting to me somebody going "Let's do this, oh no, let's do that, oh, I can't decide.

I don't think he dithers at all. He knows what he wants to do and has to be dissuaded from a course of action by people with evidence and facts.

Not every leader in every country. Only the ones that people wish to compare the U.K’s track record to. By the way the new word fir dithering is wibble wobbling as used in Parliament by the PM.

Is it dithering or is it a PM carefully studying the data given to him and then, quite sensibly taking his time in deciding the best course of action ?
The latter isn’t it?

Dammed if he does, dammed if he doesn’t springs to mind yet again.

It’s worth remembering that every leader in every country has made mistakes over the best way to deal with the virus, balancing protecting lives and livelihoods.

Data relating to covid in schools.

twitter.com/chrischirp/status/1398757529430208522/photo/1

There is an emerging pattern here which only dawned on me when it was mentioned that when Hancock announced the target of doing 100,000 tests various things had to be manipulated to fit in with that figure. I feel that the government are setting targets and then having to fit things around those targets and are under pressure to do things by set dates. It reminds me of a retail company setting sales targets and I think it clouds their judgement. Ok, I realise that there needs to be a timeline of some kind but once people have been given dates it’s more difficult to back track even if backtracking is the sensible option. And I still remember Johnson saying it would all be over in 12 weeks last year which shows how knowledgeable he was back then and I dingy think he’s changed a great deal from then.

Urmstongran

I’m just enjoying my new freedoms in the hope that more will follow soon. We will find out in 2 weeks when scientists will have gathered enough data to make informed recommendations.

Aren’t we all?

No problem with the data the scientists collect at all, but a massive problem persuading dithering Johnson - that is the main issue.

I know we only let uk nationals back in but they obviously didnt all isolate as they should have done

Other countries have required isolation in hotels, at the individual's expense.

I’m just enjoying my new freedoms in the hope that more will follow soon. We will find out in 2 weeks when scientists will have gathered enough data to make informed recommendations.

We have a Prime Minister who, as a result of previous dithering and pushing back against scientific advise at both the first and second wave, was responsible for thousands of deaths. Who because of his narcissistic character, which is image-obsessed, contradictory and indecisive, “changed his mind day after day” as scientists tried to get him to make a decision, whilst the virus seeded itself throughout the U.K.

The same thing has happened again as a result of the failure to close the borders in a timely manner., as a result of which there are now early signs of a third wave.

I would have expected for at least some Tory supporters to be sufficiently disturbed by this grave set of charges to at the very least calling for this be investigated in a timely manner in order that we can take remedial action in order to avoid further catastrophes. But it seems that the Tories are willing to accept anything as long as “their man” however flawed, is the PM. The normal criteria of a leader as competent, professional, integrity and trustworthiness is completely absent in Johnson, or in the expectations of Tory supporters.
So many Tories must have held their noses when voting for him, but regardless whether they did or not they must surely hold some responsibility for the deaths and suffering of so many.

This is another case of the government being criticised over whichever decision is made.

As the PM has repeatedly stated, four factors need to be met before any further lifting of restrictions can happen.

They were expecting cases to rise once pubs and restaurants were able to open indoors so the current increase in numbers is not unduly worrying, especially as hospital admissions haven’t risen to a worrying level.

They will also be looking at data to see how transmissible the Indian virus is.

All in all there is a very sensible plan in place.

I'm no fan of BJ but isn't he continuing to assess the situation before opening up on the 21st? It was a pity that people ignored lockdown and travelled to India, often as family groups, despite knowing how serious the situation was there. I heard a number interviewed and tbh it was not essential travel. I do think we should all be doing our bit to keep ourselves and others safe but even if we don't open up fully on the 21st, there will still be those who ignore the rules and refuse to be vaccinated. I don't think it's possible to please everyone nor is it possible to get everyone to behave responsibly and it's also impossible to accurately predict the future course of this pandemic, much easier to criticise with hindsight though.

Both those quotations are about scientists urging caution before moving on to lifting the restrictions. Which is of course the right thing and is what ministers have been setting the tone for, for a few days now.

But there is no emerging data about transmissibility, the transmissibility is not defined yet and JVT said it would be this week before we knew more. And there's nothing in those quotes about scientists recommending "firming up" travel restrictions.

When I read statements like "emerging data" I tend to expect that new data has emerged. Which is why I asked about sources.

Until we know, then we are still just saying that Johnson has performed badly in the past and we hope he doesn't do it again.