Do you have friends who have declined to be vaccinated.........h ow do you deal with this (stay polite!)

She is relying on the vast majority of the rest of us having the vaccine to protect her - this is exactly what bugs me. It is apparently OK for me to take what they perceive as a "risk" on their behalf, so that they can be protected from a virus running rife in the community.

The issue arose in relation to my singing group where two members have chosen not to be vaccinated. So they will be absent from our first garden meet for over a year as the rest of the group have decided that they do not want to include those who have not been vaccinated. I understand why as several of the members are clinically vulnerable but it is sad to see such a cohesive and happy group being broken apart for no good reason.

My cleaning lady won’t have the vaccine, her cousin had both dose , but still got the virus
I open all doors and windows and leave the house while she is here and have no conversation except to tell her why !
I guess she will have to get the vaccine when she wants to fly to her home country

As I’ve posted before DH has an old school friend and his wife , no health conditions, but they are not having the Vaccine, unless they need it for foreign holidays.
We have tried to persuade them (on the phone) as they have a newborn Grandchild and we thought they might reconsider.
I doubt that we will see them in the near future, however if we go out to restaurants etc. we won’t know who we are sitting next to or whether or not they have had the jab, so I guess we will have to get used to it.

"It is apparently OK for me to take what they perceive as a "risk" on their behalf, so that they can be protected from a virus running rife in the community. "

I think this is mistaken reasoning. I haven't heard or seen any non-vaccinators ask people to take the vaccine to keep the non-vaccinators safe. Those I am aware of are not particularly concerned about Covid (but that's another topic). The only people I have seen asking others to take the vaccine to protect others are those who have had vaccines themselves.

I don't expect anyone to take what they feel is a personal risk to themselves for me, whatever that perceived risk might be.

I do have a vulnerable person in my household. I asked someone who was visiting if they would consider getting a flu shot to protect that person. They didn't want to. I accept that decision and they accepted my decision to say they could only visit if they had no symptoms that even hinted at illness.

So far the only people,who I know,aren't getting vaccinated are men,smokers I might add who are concerned about blood clots.Funnily enough they have no issues with the clots that smoking can cause! Also no issues with their partners going on the pill or hrt! Because it's "for the best" I read an article that indicated that the conspiracy lot and no vaccine people,are more likely to be people who smoke drugs and Tobacco and can't hold down jobs and have issues with authority.It 100% represents the people I know! I thought it was interesting.Like others have said,we don't necessarily get vaccinated just for ourselves,it's for those around us too...

CafeAuLait

"it’s about the health of the world"

The world isn't going to do anything for me if I have a serious adverse reaction to the vaccine and can't work or live a normal life. I know that's rare but it does happen. The individual is important too. They are the one that has to live with the consequences of 'doing the right thing' if they are one of the rare unlucky ones. So I very much support people making their own decision about what they want to put in their body.

Agreed.

The long term effects of these vaccines cannot be known just now. The vaccines will be thoroughly reviewed for the first time in 2023.

I just remember that having had the vaccine I’m much less likely to have a serious Covid infection and much less likely to pass it on. Current information suggests that the Delta variant is more prevalent in the younger population and is less likely to be severe. Fewer people right now are ending up in hospital.

People who do not get vaccinated are not "asking" me to get vaccinated to keep them safe - but they are reliant on it and no doubt this is part of their "reasoning."

“ As I’ve posted before DH has an old school friend and his wife , no health conditions, but they are not having the Vaccine, unless they need it for foreign holidays”. Wow. Why are they not having it ? Why for foreign holiday then ?

Nowthat I do find selfish !

We had a neighbour in the 70s who told us she would not get her kids MMR vaccinated. Her pov was that as we were prepared to take the risk (as she perceived it) with our own children, then hers would be covered by default. We were furious and found it hard to communicate after that!

Same one who came to borrow our wine glasses for a party, because ours were not so valuable as hers. Yes!

I think that as a society, we have grown too used to being protected by good healthcare and because an understanding of the value of vaccination seems to have been lost.

I find it upsetting when people refuse to be vaccinated if they don't have a reason such as a serious allergy/condition. As knowledge disappears of the effects of illnesses we currently vaccinate against, false information grows. For example - polio (years in iron lungs and disability/death), measles (blindness), diphtheria (paralysis/death), chicken pox (shingles), rubella (miscarriage), smallpox (disfiguration/death), TB (lung disease/early death) and lately the vaccination against cervical cancer protecting young women.

Bill Gates hasn't spent millions on vaccination in Africa for no reason. And btw, I haven't yet come across anyone who has apparently now become a zombie of his after being vaccinated!

I think it's very serious and vaccination should be compulsory unless there is reasonable cause. Sorry.

* Fewer people right now are ending up in hospital.* - exactly - and this is because so many people have been vaccinated.

The vaccine is not wholly new - research into coronavirus vaccines has been ongoing for many years but the pandemic provided the incentive to bring it to fruition speedily. The vaccine is the result of decades of research and testing.

Luckygirl

People who do not get vaccinated are not "asking" me to get vaccinated to keep them safe - but they are reliant on it and no doubt this is part of their "reasoning."

I do not know any non-vaccinators who are relying on anyone else's vaccination status. They simply don't care if you get vaccinated or not. If they were that worried, they'd get vaccinated themselves.

An ex colleague of mine won’t have it, but he’s the sort of person who won’t even take paracetamol for a headache anyway.
Another ex colleague and I will be meeting him for lunch next week anyway - we both had 2nd jabs some time ago so are fairly relaxed about it.
I won’t get into an argument with him about it, no point, probably won’t even mention it.

Kali2

We had a neighbour in the 70s who told us she would not get her kids MMR vaccinated. Her pov was that as we were prepared to take the risk (as she perceived it) with our own children, then hers would be covered by default. We were furious and found it hard to communicate after that!

Same one who came to borrow our wine glasses for a party, because ours were not so valuable as hers. Yes!

She sounds like a charmer.

I do think that part of the problem lies in the fact that we have become so complacent about the human capacity to fight disease.

This pandemic has shown that, unless we fight back, nature rules.

Biscuitmuncher

I'm not having the vaccine. In fact having it terrifies me. I've had a lot of friends who have felt very unwell after it

Have you ever had Pneumonia Biscuit? because it is very, very unpleasant and if even a mild dose of Covid is in anyway similar I think you would be reconsidering your decision. I think a few days discomfort is a small price to pay for the protection it is obviously giving. I'm thankful to have had mine and hope I am going someway in protecting myself and those around me.

I have a friend who won't have the vaccine and posts, on Facebook, videos of the protests.

She is a very healthy, nearly 80 year old and I was pleased to see her at the shops the other day. I was not so pleased when I saw a big sign hanging from a cord round her neck which said she is exempt from wearing a mask. There is nothing wrong with her!

I could be exempt due to lung problems and was given a certificate from our local surgery but I still wear a mask in shops although I have been known to have to dash out to be able to breathe.

I don't know anyone who hasn't had it who is able to. Even my African friend who was blind 'vaccinated' as a child at school in the 70s has had it.

I guess we have to accept that some people have an overriding need for control of their own lives, even if it means putting that life at risk. A kind of ‘I won’t be told what I can or can’t do.’

It’s so dominant in their personalities that they can’t change. They’ll come up with all sorts of reasons and explanations but at the root is that need to be in control.

They are the people who find it very hard to deal with disease one or disability when it strikes and so prefer not to think it can happen.

They can’t change. Anymore than I can change from someone who plans for every possible disastrous scenario. Even fictional ones?

I guess we just have to decide whether we want that sort of person as a friend.

I totally agree with Marydoll's post. Yes we must respect everyone's views but totally selfish not to get vaccinated if possible. They need to consider others.
My husband has had a double transplant, with heart problems and remains vulnerable.
We know a 50yr old friend who refuses to have vaccine, we won't be meeting up.

Only one person I know - though, thankfully, haven't seen recently - is a Covid denier and a vaccination refuser. But she has always been an 'oddball' and it doesn't surprise me at all. My family and friends are all either fully vaccinated or almost there.

CafeAuLait

Luckygirl

People who do not get vaccinated are not "asking" me to get vaccinated to keep them safe - but they are reliant on it and no doubt this is part of their "reasoning."

I do not know any non-vaccinators who are relying on anyone else's vaccination status. They simply don't care if you get vaccinated or not. If they were that worried, they'd get vaccinated themselves.

So would non vaccinators be hasn’t to contract eg smallpox?

Everyone I know has welcomed having the vaccine. Both myself and my daughter had side effects but would still have it again. Son in law only had a sore arm. Every vaccine or tablets has side effects. Being ill after the jab is a poor excuse unless you end up in hospital. I have always held the view it should be compulsory unless you can't have it for medical reasons then you need a doctor's letter saying that.

I am 63 well remember people having whopping cough because they didn't get vaccinated. And being dangerously ill. My brother and sister in law where very ill for 6 weeks with Covid both have serious health problems. They couldn't wait to have the vaccine.

Wonder how may who wouldn't have the vaccine will change their minds if they get Covid .

MayBee70

CafeAuLait

Luckygirl

People who do not get vaccinated are not "asking" me to get vaccinated to keep them safe - but they are reliant on it and no doubt this is part of their "reasoning."

I do not know any non-vaccinators who are relying on anyone else's vaccination status. They simply don't care if you get vaccinated or not. If they were that worried, they'd get vaccinated themselves.

So would non vaccinators be hasn’t to contract eg smallpox?

I don't quite follow the sentence but I guess non-vaccinators would make their own decisions about the smallpox vaccine as they did back then when it was new. Some who aren't getting the Covid vaccine have had other vaccines.

I think it’s to do with the individualism of our culture, when we are more concerned with ourselves. In a collectivist culture, such as in the East, people consider themselves more part of the whole, and are more likely to act as a group (for good or bad).