So masks are to become optional, do you think this is a good idea?

effalump

It's a no brainer! If you're still petrified by the numbers spewed out by the government and the BBC, then wear a mask. That's entirely up to you but at a time when deaths are at an all time low and you sitll believe all the hype about 'cases' (which means nothing) then you, along with the government, are part of the problelm. If you have Spotify, Tunein or some other podcast app, have a listen to the second half of the ritchie allen show for Monday 5th July to listen to the interview with a very well respected funeral business owner.

How rude (and wrong)! People who "believe" the government's statistics on cases and see them in context aren't part of any problem. The majority of cases are now in younger people and it's downright selfish of people to think they don't matter.

Cases do matter. Thankfully, they're not being reflected in hospitalisations and deaths, but don't be fooled into thinking that all the cases are mild and will just resolve themselves. Some of those cases will result in long-term health issues (long Covid) and there is a very real possibility that more rapid mutations will result in at least one variant which is more deadly.

Thank you Growstuff. You were far more polite in your response than I felt like being.

JaneJudge

Chewbacca

Actually, I wonder if you realise how judgmental you're being about where I live! hmm

It was you who described it growstuff! You described your community as "more or less blacklisting a family who don't wear masks" to such an extent that the online comments on social media were bad enough for "an admin to close the thread down and remove some posts, but the damage had been done". You yourself admitted that "you wouldn't want to be in that child's shoes when he went back to school". That poor child.

Based entirely on the information that you've provided about that community; yes, I've judged.

A lot of local facebook pages are like this aren't they? I am members of a few and they all go on about teenagers, people smoking, parking, petty crime, so and so did this, everyone appalled, drunks, people swimming in the river, the overflowing bottle banks, our MP flytipping, gypsies...they've ran out of bags at asda, no potatoes in the co-op...the list seems the same everywhere. Oh and stray cats and dogs on the loose. Is this cat a stray? <links to photo of very well fed cat>

I can't say whether a lot are like this because I only belong to a couple, but one of mine certainly is. Most of the time, it's about sharing information, but every so often somebody lets off steam about something. Thank you for posting this and confirming that my small town isn't inhabited by some coven of gossiping witches.

The situation at the moment is that a couple of weeks ago, we had one of the lowest infection rates in the country, but that all changed when there was an outbreak in the secondary school. Everybody (except me it seems) knows the name of the first pupil to be infected and to bring the infection into school. Initially, there were seven further infections - all had been in contact with the same pupil - and now there are dozens of infections, including the headteacher. At least two of the pupils are seriously ill, including one who has been hospitalised and is in ICU. Other family members have been infected and have had to take time off work and had their lives disrupted - all from an original source. People wouldn't be human if they weren't angry.

We know the name of the first person to bring it into my sons school too growstuff both his parents are key workers. We are self isolating because of another son though the PCR test result still hasn't come through and it was picked up 3pm Saturday, I'd have thought we'd have had the result by now..

What is the difference between those who 'believe' in government statistics and those who place their trust in unsupported podcasts and unsubstantiated information on social media? For those in the community who are not yet vaccinated COVID is still a real and present risk.

growstuff I am horrified that a child who caught COVID is being victimised by the local community. I doubt they set out to get COVID deliberately and when at school would have been obeying school rules in relation to mask wearing. If they got it through their parent's behaviour, they are still the victim, not the perpetrator.

My local facebook page seems to be mainly about sharing information, an informal local freegle, and an occasional bitch about litter louts. Nome of the personal innuendo yours seems to suffer from.

Boris being Boris and handing us the keys to liberty but also telling us it is our responsibility to act sensibly. Therefore, absolving himself of all blame should the figures go into meltdown. Typical. Personally, I shall carry a few face masks with me and wear one if I feel it necessary, in the supermarket and cinema, for instance.

growstuff

Unfortunately, many of them are JaneJudge. My local secondary school doesn't enforce mask wearing, but pupils have told me that nearly all the pupils and all the staff still wear them. There was a serious outbreak a couple of weeks ago, seeded by a pupil whose family don't wear masks. The names couldn't be released, but just about everybody knows who it was and I've read some of the comments about the family on local social media. They've been more or less blacklisted. I wouldn't like to be in that child's shoes when he returns to school.

There’s almost a whiff of schadenfreude in this post.
Your talking about a child for goodness sake!!!

growstuff what wonderful people who know who seeded the infection without any genomic testing data! They obviously are totally ignorant of asymptomatic cases who can infect others willy nilly, nasty vigilante types, and to do this to a child!

Oh and that child caught it from someone else, maybe even one of those heading the hunt!

MerylStreep

growstuff

Unfortunately, many of them are JaneJudge. My local secondary school doesn't enforce mask wearing, but pupils have told me that nearly all the pupils and all the staff still wear them. There was a serious outbreak a couple of weeks ago, seeded by a pupil whose family don't wear masks. The names couldn't be released, but just about everybody knows who it was and I've read some of the comments about the family on local social media. They've been more or less blacklisted. I wouldn't like to be in that child's shoes when he returns to school.

There’s almost a whiff of schadenfreude in this post.
Your talking about a child for goodness sake!!!

What about the child that’s in ICU because the other child’s family decided covid rules weren’t for them? I’m afraid that’s where my sympathy lies. As for our local Facebook page it’s always been full of people pouncing on and sneering at anyone complaining about people not wearing masks or not socially distancing. Most of the comments when someone complained that a local pub was flaunting the rules was ‘just don’t go there then’ and people were constantly referred to as the ‘covid police’.

Having read all the comments, it is apparent that there will be quite a few customers who, despite a sign requesting the wearing of masks, will not be doing so. Yes, we do have a protective screen around the pay desk but we often have to assist customers. We also limit customers to four. We are not “frightened” as has been suggested by a couple of posters, we are just being sensible and trying to avoid catching Covid. Most of our customers are lovely but there’s always one and I’d rather avoid getting into an argument with them about not wearing a mask. We may lose a few customers if we insist on mask wearing, but if that is the case, then so be it. As I stated originally, I don’t want to have to wear masks forever, just until we have a higher percentage of the population vaccinated.

What about the child that’s in ICU because the other child’s family decided covid rules weren’t for them?

Has it been proved that the one child infected the other by genomic sequencing? Is it at all possible that the ICU child caught the infection from somebody else? Judge, jury and executioner comes to mind!

I have kept every rule and guidance and will continue to wear a mask in populated areas, but these trials by gossip turn my stomach.

Rosie51

growstuff what wonderful people who know who seeded the infection without any genomic testing data! They obviously are totally ignorant of asymptomatic cases who can infect others willy nilly, nasty vigilante types, and to do this to a child!

No, I don't know these people at all - well, only a couple of them. My original post was actually about peer pressure and how it works in communities.

Many people, so it seems, are ignorant about how Covid-19 is transmitted. Nobody needs genomic testing to know who was the first case in a community where community cases were almost down to zero.

I'm not a mask denier but I'm not convinced of their assumed effectiveness because of the way we use them, but I'll keep wearing them until the government allows me not to. Which, because I'm in a country not headed by a populist oaf, will be a few months yet.

But I do take great exception to people telling me its not a great imposition and making fun of the fact that they are disorienting. The government are telling me what I should wear on my body. It's an imposition, no ifs or buts.

Upthread, the comment about learning from Taiwan, where they still wear masks on the bus. Taiwan have 10% of their population vaccinated with the 1st dose. At that stage, we were still wearing masks on the bus.

Finally, the only BBC reporter who has made any sense at all throughout this whole affair is Nick Triggle. Read this and realise that maybe its a wee bit more complicated than you think it is.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57678942

Finally, Dr Chris Smith on the radio this morning about variants. About 7 billion people in the world haven't been vaccinated. About 20 million unvaccinated in the UK. Lets guess where the next VoC is going to originate. Hint: Its probably not Bolton.

Rosie51

^What about the child that’s in ICU because the other child’s family decided covid rules weren’t for them?^

Has it been proved that the one child infected the other by genomic sequencing? Is it at all possible that the ICU child caught the infection from somebody else? Judge, jury and executioner comes to mind!

I have kept every rule and guidance and will continue to wear a mask in populated areas, but these trials by gossip turn my stomach.

You're incredibly naive if you don't think community peer pressure works like that, which was actually the point of my original post.

Rosie51

growstuff what wonderful people who know who seeded the infection without any genomic testing data! They obviously are totally ignorant of asymptomatic cases who can infect others willy nilly, nasty vigilante types, and to do this to a child!

Thank you for some common sense Rosie51
There are the beginnings of victimisation, witch hunts, even of hysteria in accounts such as this especially when spread on social media. To read of
more or less blacklisting a family who don't wear masks" to such an extent that the online comments on social media were bad enough for "an admin to close the thread down and remove some posts, but the damage had been done “ is dystopian and not the sort of society I choose to live in.
Let’s show some common sense - wear a mask if you want, don’t feel threatened or browbeaten by those who will choose not to - but the opposite also applies.
Only last month, a man was sentenced to 10 years for beating up a fellow shopper who asked him to pull up his face mask, gouging his eye in the process. As his victim lay on the ground the perpetrator spat at him and shouted: “If I have it, you have it.
Panic? Hysteria? Let’s not feed into it.

Rosie51
They read this stuff because it confirms everything they say and believe.
Rather sad, really.

Two "finallys"....sorry!

Lucca, I didn't say that I believed that they had no effect did I? Standard surgical masks do have a limited role in protecting others when worn correctly. My point is rather that, following news of a date for removing a variety of legal restrictions, people seem to be fixated on mask wearing ( across social media) and make no mention of say, testing and isolating after a positive test result, not attending large scale events etc etc.
If you think that my argument is silly then so be it.

I am self isolating as my son is waiting for a PCR result, I suspect you'd all be horrified if I said I was off to B&Q - with or without a mask but I'll be able to do that on the 19th.

Many people, so it seems, are ignorant about how Covid-19 is transmitted. Nobody needs genomic testing to know who was the first case in a community where community cases were almost down to zero.

Ah the oracle has spoken! I do know how the disease is transmitted and I don't appreciate your condescension. I wonder where the original child caught the infection? Obviously must have been the only one who ventured outside the community to catch it. Absolutely zero asymptomatic cases in that community, they really should enlighten the scientific world how they recognise their absence.

I'm not naive, I'm allowed to be disgusted and appalled by nasty vigilante behaviour, not just accept it because it feeds my inner bully.

I will still wear mine inside shops etc, outside I am comfortable without but if somewhere was very busy then I will wear one. I am not comfortable discarding my mask completely just yet. I think the shop owners should have the final say, your shop, your rules and they should be respected after all they have a greater degree of footfall and therefore more at risk.

^ The government are telling me what I should wear on my body. It's an imposition, no ifs or buts. ^

Well the government tell you to wear clothes otherwise you’d be arrested for public indecency and in a car you must wear a seatbelt.....

I do not understand people’s resistance to wearing something that keeps others safe. It’s sensible and other cultures have been doing it for years.

I think the dismantling of the NHS app, test and trace (even if it was pretty crap) and masks is ludicrous and will be another of boris’s monumental cock ups.

I do not understand people’s resistance to wearing something that keeps others safe. It’s sensible and other cultures have been doing it for years.

Maybe our PM needs to take this advice on board too

“ I do not understand people’s resistance to wearing something that keeps others safe. It’s sensible and other cultures have been doing it for years. ”

Exactly. So many people saying it hasn’t been proved to help, well it hasn’t been proved NOT to help so why not just stop whingeing and do it.
I have yet to hear an answer from this posters who are exultant about the relaxing of the mask rule as to their reasons