Stats on the up

Growstuff I agree with most of what you say but it will vary from person to person. Nothing is clear cut. Some people are just plain fed up and want to get on with their lives, others believe the vaccine has given them complete protection and if their name is on the bullet so be it. A lot of others, myself included are more cautious and have to be more cautious still because of those that aren’t. Even then there will be varying degrees.

I for one have not set foot inside a super market for over a year, and nor do I intend to. Not just because there is a risk but because I no longer want to spend a couple of hours trekking around the shelves when I can order online so much quicker and have it delivered to the door. It may cost a little more but to me it’s worth it. My priorities have changed.

I don’t mind my own company. I have chats with delivery drivers, and people and friends in my village when I am out walking, I visit dd and gc but social distance, other dd visits to exercise her dogs, we WhatsApp, and I have a business to run. This is fine for now but I accept I will want to get out and about more as time goes on but at present cases are higher than average here. Having said that Alegrias is right there will always be some cases and we will have to get used to it. For me that’s not just yet. Bit like having a car crash where it takes ages not to be jumpy every time you get in a car.

lemongrove

Hospitals were not overwhelmed at any time in the last 18 months, so considering how many people are double jabbed, as the saying goes, and there may be a booster jab coming up, it’s an unlikely scenario that hospitals won’t be coping in a few months.
Unfortunately some people are imprisoning themselves for no good reason, hiding in their houses still.Others are going out and about with a bit of caution ( sensible) and others are living life entirely normally.

I know someone who has waited for 28 hours to get a bed! It’s literally one in one out at the University hospital in Coventry, some of them ARE overwhelmed!

I used to work in the Warrington Hospital for many years and Creamfields festival has always been extra pressure and at 2021 they must be dreading it. A and E has been running at full capacity for a very long time and the staff have had to just get on with it and cope so don't need all these needless and selfish extra influx. Drugs play a large part of it and these will always be smuggled in no matter how strict the security is. Alcohol another evil. Don't get me wrong I love hearing people enjoying themselves but do you honestly need drugs and alcohol to sustain happiness? I suppose each to their own, but it should not add pressure and stress to others.

Is everyone going about with a bit of caution? Maybe you and I are but I know a lot aren't.
At least 5+ cases of Covid in the double vaccinated in our area in the last few weeks.
The Public Health Officer for Cumbria pleaded on TV for people to test before visiting, yet the next day on TV someone from the Tourist Board said everything was fine. The shores of Ullswater look like Blackpool beach are they all socially spacing and being cautious?
Of course, life has to go on but we still have to take care or we will never get this covid and there are quite a few more under control so that a yearly vaccine of that year's variant will keep us fit.

The rates are bound to rise with music festivals, football matches, etc, starting up again.

My daughter and her family live near the Reading Festival site and have stocked up with food for at least 10 days so they don’t have to go to the local shops until the infection has ‘gone’.

I may be wrong but I believe that here in Britain we have the highest rates of covid infection in the whole of Europe. Its time for a full lockdown.

Yammy
And what has happened to the 5+ cases of people who have been double jabbed?
Are they in hospital or are they at at home feeling a little poorly. Or is it just the case that they have been tested positive.

lemongrove - hospitals definitely were overwhelmed during the last 18 months. Hospitals are establishments to treat the sick and that includes those requiring outpatient treatment and minor/major surgery. Covid squeezed out much of this type of treatment so hospitals were overwhelmed. They were unable to function as they were intended and instead became fire-fighting organisations dealing only with covid infection and they were unable to do that in a compassionate way as relatives were not able to visit. In northern Ireland, the waiting lists for some hospital treatment are as long as 4 years - that was the subject of a TV documentary last night - this testifies to the fact that hospitals were overwhelmed even before covid, so the idea that they miraculously recovered during the biggest pandemic in my lifetime is quite wrong.

lemongrove

Hospitals were not overwhelmed at any time in the last 18 months, so considering how many people are double jabbed, as the saying goes, and there may be a booster jab coming up, it’s an unlikely scenario that hospitals won’t be coping in a few months.
Unfortunately some people are imprisoning themselves for no good reason, hiding in their houses still.Others are going out and about with a bit of caution ( sensible) and others are living life entirely normally.

lemon grove - you said: "Hospitals were not overwhelmed at any time in the last 18 months...."

That's because Johnson & Hancock shipped elderly patients out of hospitals into care homes without testing - this was a deliberate act, so that they could say hospitals were not 'overwhelmed'. The deaths in care homes would have looked much worse had they been in NHS Hospitals, corridors, or elsewhere.

The book below covers the details if you fancy a read - to be honest, for Times journalists, this is brilliantly written, and gobsmacking. It shows the true level of incompetence and deliberate actions taken that created the worst case and death rates in Europe.

25Avalon I don't disagree with anything you've written. I realise everybody is different. I don't enjoy socialising for the sake of it and never have. I have a few close and real friends, some of whom don't live nearby, so we communicate online anyway. I rarely go out and seriously object to being told I'm "scared" because I've never been happier. It really isn't anybody else's business if other people choose to live a different lifestyle from them. I don't think anybody has the right to shame anybody else into being more adventurous and risk-averse.

Nevertheless, people are different. My concern is that, without any rules and/or willingness to be aware of infection trends, some people seem to think that life can go back to normal and throw all caution to the wind. Vaccines have had a massively positive effect, but they won't give 100% protection, nor will frequent testing.

The last thing anybody needs is another lockdown, which is why it's so important that people continue being cautious, not only for their own protection, but to reduce community transmission. I'm extremely relieved that it's been decided to vaccinate teenagers because there has been almost no attempt to mitigate transmission effectively in schools.

Yes, we do need to "live with it", but that doesn't mean ignoring the risks, which is what I sometimes think people mean. I wish people who repeat trite mantras would explain what they mean because I don't know. People need to know the limitations of being vaccinated and LFT tests. They also need to know the most risky situations and avoid them.

"Failures of State" should be a required text for students doing politics, economics and sociology at university.

It demonstrates very clearly HOW NOT to run a country's crisis management systems.

PS. I object to the implication that people who are cautious aren't living life normally ie. that somehow they aren't normal. It seems that the people who say this kind of thing are the ones who lack the ability to adapt and be resilient.

Living with it for me is : Continuing to wear my mask (despite the looks I get) I am keeping my distance from people. Going out only when I need to and picking quiet times. Washing my hands. My family taking tests if they are coming to see me. My OH getting nagged about social distancing, masks etc when he goes out. I want to see my grand-daughter when she is born and to see her grow up. I, like many others are considered CEV. I wish 'people' would just be considerate of others. No matter how fit and strong some believe they are, there is still a risk of Covid. End of.

growstuff

PS. I object to the implication that people who are cautious aren't living life normally ie. that somehow they aren't normal. It seems that the people who say this kind of thing are the ones who lack the ability to adapt and be resilient.

I'm cautious and I'm not living life normally. "Normal" for me means going to the cinema, dance classes, events at the Edinburgh Fringe, evening classes. Its not the end of the world but I'm not living life "normally". But I'm getting on without it all and I miss it all like blazes, I don't know if that makes me resilient or not, but it makes me sad.

So people telling me I need to be adaptable and resilient are pretty objectionable to me.

Living at this present time has not changed that much I no longer go to the supermarket not because of Covid but because I have found it easier to get deliveries. I still see my family and grandchildren very regularly and look after my granddaughter one day a week
My husband still goes to the pub we may eat out occasionally
We still go away when we can that has been curtailed at the moment because hotels are fully booked and charging over the top rates. We have been more picky where we choose to go would like to go to Brighton but not appealing at the moment due to the narrow streets and can be very crowded
So nothing that different or particularly risky

I agree with Alegrias. Normal life for me meant going to cinemas, theatres and concerts. It meant afternoon tea in nice hotels, it meant eating out in restaurants regularly. It meant going to the north west to see my family and my husband’s family ( we haven’t seen his 94 year old parents for almost two years) and it meant seeing friends a lot. Normal life was having friends to stay in my house for long weekends, and seeing my very dear friend who I have known for over fifty years when we visited the north. Normal life meant city breaks in the UK and abroad, it meant travelling all over the world to see and experience different cultures (something we were unable to do in our earlier life.) Most importantly normal life meant seeing my daughter and her three children regularly, which we now can’t do as she went with her husband and children to New Zealand to work because they’d had enough of the stresses of working in the NHS during Covid. Our contact with them now is through WhatsApp video, texts, and photographs, which is better than nothing, but just isn’t the same.
If people say their life hasn’t changed much and they’re perfectly happy, that’s fine for them. It’s not fine for many others, and understanding would be in order. Lots of people are missing their former lives and in our case this includes elderly parents and a beloved daughter and her family.

We are lucky in that we still see our sons and their families, including our one grandchild still in the UK. We are making the best of it, but remain desperately saddened that we cannot see, as a direct consequence of Covid, some beloved members of our families.

I heard on news earlier 1 in 40 people in N.Ireland have Covid, 1 in 80 in England. The kids are back to school this week over here so infections will probably go up shortly. We have also the worst waiting lists in the 4 nations for operations, etc. I don't know how this will ever get sorted. There might not be as many deaths, but the bed occupancy for Covid patients is very high and surgeries are getting cancelled daily.

Just caught train from Ipswich to Peterborough on my way back to leeds ! So many on the train minus backs and it was full!
Very worrying attitude to CoVID now I think! Too much complacency !

Masks

Jillyjosie

250,000+ with Long Covid... more women than men and often the young are affected. Interesting discussion on yesterday's Woman's Hour.
Learn to live with it? Maybe, easy to say when it doesn't affect you or your family and you don't stop to think about an already beleaguered NHS.

I spoke to a friend the other day that has long covid. Her husband has it, too, and are both struggling as they both run their own business. No sense of taste or smell either which must be awful.Tim Spector said today that rates of long covid are going up especially amongst the young. Having had friends that have suffered from ME for years I’m terribly aware of what a devastating effect on someone’s life something like this can have.

I agree with Alegrias here.

I think most people - because they had no choice and because they understood the severity - adapted well during lockdowns. However, once we had complied with everything and been doubled jabbed, we feel sad when things are taken away from us for what feels like a lifetime.
If you love art for example no amount of looking a paintings and sculptures online can replace the feeling of standing in front of an exhibit in a gallery and viewing it from all angles.
Likewise singing along to the sound track of Les Mis in ones lounge is nothing like being in the theatre with a full audience. And going out for a meal while pursing these pastimes is appealing too. My normal also involves holidays abroad.
My life has changed drastically, I was happy to comply with all restrictions, but my normal sadly seems a long way off and I don't wish to curtail my pleasures any longer. I am getting on with it, but I cannot force myself to adapt to what I consider a poorer, unhappier quality of life.

I spoke to a friend the other day that has long covid. Her husband has it, too, and are both struggling as they both run their own business. No sense of taste or smell either which must be awful.Tim Spector said today that rates of long covid are going up especially amongst the young. Having had friends that have suffered from ME for years I’m terribly aware of what a devastating effect on someone’s life something like this can have.

I have had M.E. for 32 years since my husband and I both caught an unknown virus - he got better and I never did. For 2 years I couldn't get out of bed. I lost my job and have never worked since or been able to do all the sports and dancing that I used to do.

Those of us with M.E. are very aware of Long Covid and, speaking for myself, it makes me extremely cautious.

I’m getting on with it too tippytipsy. We have been out for meals and we socialise with family. Occasionally I see a friend, usually outside, and we chat, get coffee or lunch, but I don’t do this as often I did before. It is occasionally. We went on holiday to Somerset, but didn’t stay in a hotel, and God willing, we are going to Zakinthos in a couple of weeks. We’re staying in a rental, in a tiny village, and will not be going to any bars. We’ll probably have some meals out in quiet restaurants, sitting outside. It’s all vastly different to my previous life.
We just have to be thankful for small mercies. We don’t live in Afghanistan, I recovered from a serious bout of Covid, my family are safe even if some of them are so far away, and we can engage in some enjoyable activities, even if not all the ones we would like to engage in.

maddyone, you said "I’m feeling a bit nervous about what is happening, having had serious Covid in January. It’s the waning of the protection that our vaccinations give us that worries me." (Thursday, 10:09:49)

Apparently it has been found that those who have had covid and then had both doses of a vaccine have much better immunity even than those who have just had the vaccine, so I hope you can take some comfort from that!