Christmas party at Downing Street last year

Alegrias, do stop pretending you’re working class. Like me you were born into a family which was, and always had been, working class. Like me you have done well in life. As had the lady on the factory floor, and well done her. Thanks in no small part to the policies of successive Conservative governments. Your voting choice is your hard-won prerogative but please don’t pretend that all who vote Labour do so from altruistic motives and that all who vote Conservative are ‘all right Jack’. During my working life I used my professional qualifications to help others less fortunate than me and I now make significant donations to charity which is a private matter that I mention simply to enlighten you and others who seem to think that people with my political leanings are only in it for themselves. I prefer to make my own philanthropic choices rather than have them made for me by government.

I can assure you with no fear of contradiction GSM, that me getting on in life had nothing whatsoever to do with successive Tory governments . How nice that you can make philanthropic choices though, just like Lady Bountiful. Me, I'd prefer a proper welfare state, but maybe that's just a not-tory thing.

Germanshepherdsmum

That’s a relief Calistemon. One doesn’t like to mention it, especially in front of the staff. So relieved that they are middle class too.?

Our gardener is far more middle class than us, Germanshepherdsmum!

As HM said about Princess Michael of Kent "She's far too grand for us"

???

Calistemon, it's hilarious how many now believe they're 'middle class' - not that we care. It just depends upon which criteria class is judged by

Isn't it a rather superior assumption, though, that those who work on the factory floor vote Labour?

To return to the OP

A tweet

Re No 10 parties, The Met have said they don't normally investigate retrospective breaches of the law. That will be good news if you murdered someone last year. But they've graciously said they'll read the letters sent to them.

I'm very puzzled now. Surely every breach of the law is investigated in retrospect?

Or does the Met have a crystal ball so that they can investigate breaches before they happen

See that's another thing a good education can give you.

The ability to read and understand posts on social media without completely getting the wrong end of the stick

lemongrove

Nothing sinister about recognising a certain writing style Gill ( note that I would never use an old name in case the poster didn’t want it.)
It’s also natural to wonder where posters have got to.

well you are obviously more perceptive than I am Lemongrove, I can never spot a new name.

Or does the Met have a crystal ball so that they can investigate breaches before they happen
?

lemongrove

Yes, of course, they all do it, which is why I was simply pointing that fact out, meaning it’s a nine day ( if that) wonder.
Starmer doesn’t think anything will come of it, but has probably been advised to go on the attack with every little thing that comes to hand.
The populace have more important things on their minds just at the moment though.

... and I would suggest that one of those things is the new variant of Covid which has now put the cat among the pigeons - at a very inopportune moment on the calendar. It's on virtually everyone's mind

And look at the reactions from the general public on being asked to wear masks at certain times - varying from mild grumblings to outright refusal. The government has not been consistent in its handling of the pandemic. So called 'red list' flights being banned in some instances, but not others... India - not banned at the same time as Pakistan and Bangladesh with something like 900 passengers arriving each day at one point, all being trusted to self-isolate on return. South Africa though, an almost immediate travel ban (which BTW, I agree with, even tho' it will prevent me from seeing my son at Christmas - again). And now murmurings of lockdowns not being ruled out, after being told they were unlikely. And people are getting hot under the collar, recalcitrant and uncooperative.

I get it that the pandemic is not an easy thing to deal with and I doubt any government would have been 100% on the ball - and would certainly have had to be re-active rather than pro-active at certain times. But it has to be consistent when it is demanding that the general public comply with rules that it puts in place, it cannot just flout those rules itself when it starts declaring that people can be fined for not complying, or wearing masks. And the 'party' episode is relevant - it might have been a while ago, but it's still part of the ongoing crisis. I'm not going to lecture on 'leadership', but Johnson is the leader and he and his government have got to show more gravitas and not simply try to pander to the various factions trying to appease and please them all to retain popularity. And definitely not make rules which they themselves will either decide to follow or not follow.

Please don’t call me Lady Bountiful Alegrias. I just try to do some good where I can with what it has been my good fortune to be able to accumulate over many years by the sweat of my brow, and mentioned that merely to show that my attitude is far from ‘I’m all right Jack’ or ‘s*d everyone else’. I’m not seeking either praise or sarcasm.

I don’t understand why you mentioned it at all though GSM, because it’s the norm to give to charity, and anybody with a social conscience tries to help others, I can’t think of anybody I know who doesn’t? Organisations which are essential to provide public services wouldn’t survive otherwise, like hospices and air ambulance for example.

Ok, fair enough GSM, I take it back.

However I defend my stance. Charity fills the gaps that ineffective government leaves behind. It is not enough to rely on generous benefactors. It is fantastic, for instance, that so many people provide services such as foodbanks, but in a country that is as well off as ours its can’t be acceptable that there is a need for foodbanks in the numbers we see today. And that is down to the policies of successive Tory governments.

Governments that keep getting voted in, with people saying that they’ve done well personally so the Tories deserve their vote, even if the whole world can see that the Tories in charge today are contemptuous, incompetent and don’t really care about making the country a better place.

Casdon , only because I was being painted as someone who cared only about myself and didn’t give a stuff about anyone else. You are quite right that some essential services exist only because of donations and volunteers, and it’s sad that that is the case. Living near the coast I am very aware of the importance of the RNLI for instance, and just a few days ago the air ambulance landed nearby.

Thanks Alegrias, I appreciate that. I know things are very far from good in many ways. I know the extent of reliance on food banks in my area, where wealth and poverty exist side by side.
We will have to agree to disagree on the root cause of the extent of reliance on food banks and other charitable endeavours. I don’t believe there is a simple answer apart perhaps from huge rises in taxation and in benefits.

Your last sentence GSM. It doesn't have to be simple, it has to be effective. The answer is a competent government spending money on things that really improve people's quality of life, not on fast trains that nobody wants, fancy aircraft carriers with no planes and jobs for the boys. Its a choice the government makes. And we need to realise that most people don't want to live on benefits, they want a fair go.

I agree about the trains. The aircraft carriers (now with planes apart from the one that went into sea a few days ago at vast cost to the taxpayer) and other modern means of defence I believe are essential. China and Russia are credible threats.

I frankly don’t think any government would be elected on a manifesto of big tax increases, even if similarly increased benefits were also promised. It would not appeal to the City, which of course has huge influence. Therefore I doubt that manifesto would be written by a party serious about getting into or remaining in power. And frankly I don’t see any prospect of a Labour government in the foreseeable future. I find it amazing that so many people interviewed recently didn’t recognise Starmer or know who he is. If I hadn’t seen it for myself I wouldn’t have believed it. And if I dare say this, if I had to give them a political tag it would be Labour. Some gravitas has been added to the front bench with the reshuffle but as a whole it’s a ragbag shambles which can only criticise rather than coming up with intelligent suggestions, not the government in waiting that a credible opposition should be. I Chad thought that Starmer would be quick on his feet given his previous career but it’s proved not to be the case. Not a fighter.

It may be some time before the next GE, or we may have another snap election quite soon - which Sunak may be hinting at with his promise of tax cuts. Probably Starmer fears that, hence the reshuffle, but you can’t do much with the current raw material.

had not Chad. Maybe the autocorrect had gone into philanthropic mode.

MaizieD

To return to the OP

A tweet

Re No 10 parties, The Met have said they don't normally investigate retrospective breaches of the law. That will be good news if you murdered someone last year. But they've graciously said they'll read the letters sent to them.

I'm very puzzled now. Surely every breach of the law is investigated in retrospect?

Or does the Met have a crystal ball so that they can investigate breaches before they happen

Cresida Dick said they'd "look into it" if they received a complaint. They've received more than one apparently but aren't going to do anything.

Political pressure?

Waste of stretched police resources?

I care. Rules that were in place at the time were broken. I adhered to them, and cried the Saturday before Christmas when tighter measures announced meant I couldn't see my daughter and her family on Christmas Eve. Lots of people sacrificed much more. It's wrong, this is not about politics, it's about integrity.

Oh do get over it. I missed out on seeing my family too. Lots of us did. Lots of people are unable to see family yet again this Christmas. I adhered to the rules too. I know not everyone did but I’ve got more to think about than an office do a year ago. As have the Met.

That’s why Boris and co get away with this sort of thing.

“Oh do get over it” is the chorus from their supporters.

I have no objection obviously to how anyone votes, I object to the wholesale unquestioning acceptance of any behaviour by anyone they elect.

Following this and a similar thread I have come to the following conclusions
a) if you voted Tory you see nothing wrong with the occupants of No 10 having a party because you, your DH/DD/DS/DG did something similar and came to no harm
or
b) if you didn't vote Tory you are obviously a left leaning, Corbyn loving, Guardian reading Remainer who was silly enough to follow the rules and are now being pathetic by complaining about those who didn't.

Do we know if anyone ‘elected’ was there Lucca?
Dolphin, your powers of deduction need sharpening up. Very much off the mark in my case for one. And we don’t know that any occupant of No 10 was there. Johnson wasn’t.

Jeezy peeps, are you being intentionally obtuse?

All this squirming to say that it wasn't a party, Johnson wasn't there, it wasn't really illegal, it didn't make any difference...

If you have to make so many excuses, can you not just give in and agree that it was a bad idea? Even if Johnson wasn't there and knew nothing about it, if he had any cajones he would have come on TV the day after he found out about it and said that a group of this staff (or whatever) had had a party in contravention of the rules and he'd sacked them because he understood how important it was for people to see that the centre of government was unimpeachable.

That's not going to happen, is it?