Western Australia bans unvaccinated parents from visiting their sick children in hospitals

There’s a big difference though actually isn’t there? They have a slightly higher percentage of the population fully vaccinated than the UK, and 32% have had the booster to date. They have missed Alpha and Delta, so if they do now get large numbers they are more likely to get Omicron which is less serious, but no indication yet that that is happening imminently. And only 9 deaths to date, with two years of freedom to live normally that we haven’t had.

Once the borders are opened, which they will be, unfortunately they will go through the pain we have gone through.

The only difference is that a fair few of the population will have been jabbed

People will have to learn to live with CV19 ?

And as the transmission rates are much poorer for AZ than Pfizer from what I understand I assume those who have had the AZ vaccine should also be banned.

Your case sounds distressing Doodledog especially with such a tiny infant.

In 2020 before vaccines and people weren't allowed to visit patients at all, does anyone know what the ruling was here in the UK for parents of young children in hospital?

I suppose that depends on whether they were vulnerable in the first place, like the babies on the SCU when my son was born.

But how many children in WA would actually die even if they got covid? I think someone came up with a figure on here a few months back that in the whole of the UK deaths amongst the under 12s with covid, I assume omicron, were negligible.
Though, of course, one child's death is one too many.

Callistemon21

^If people complaining about illiberality had a grandchild in hospital (particularly a clinically vulnerable grandchild) would they be happy to have unvaccinated visitors around them?^

The parents - if they have been tested before going in and/or had had Covid and recovered - are not just any visitors.

I know, and it’s a difficult situation, although to others in the ward they are just ‘any visitors’. My feelings are based on how I felt when my own baby was put at risk by an unvaccinated person, and much as I understand the civil rights issue, that is difficult to shake off.

An unvisited child will, I hope, get better and go home to her parents - a child who dies as a result of contact with an unvaccinated visitor won’t.

Surely, unvaccinated parents would be having a change of mind - and getting their vaccines pdq - if they had a child in hospital.

Hospitals have a duty of care to keep their patients safe. So many in the UK have caught Covid in hospital - and died. I'm all in favour of all staff and visitors being required to be vaccinated.

This is not about children being vaccinated - it's about children being taken into hospital fr whatever reason and unvaccinated parents being banned from visiting them.

my siblings in WA say that covid is already in the community and talk is that real numbers are being witheld. Their vaccination levels are not brilliant and they have no herd immunity as we have in the uk. Right from the beginning, they were fed media information that was sneering at the uk and covid, now they are pretty scared. One sister, medic, says that their health service cannot cope even pre-covid

WA has a tinpot dictatorship and I am with the OP, keeping unvaccinated parents from children is downright cruel

It is certainly complex. Few of us would say that JWs who refuse blood donations for their children, when it could have their lives, are free and fair to do so.

What about Measles vaccination- a big come back of Measles due to so many children un-vaccinated- are the parents responsible when children can seriously sick?

If people complaining about illiberality had a grandchild in hospital (particularly a clinically vulnerable grandchild) would they be happy to have unvaccinated visitors around them?

The parents - if they have been tested before going in and/or had had Covid and recovered - are not just any visitors.

Elaine1 I fear that could happen (is happening) but hope that, by the time it does spread in Australia, as it surely will, it will be a much milder variant.

Not just the state of WA, the whole of Australia

Our relatives in Western Australia do not have a single clue what the last 2 years have been like in the UK (or much of the world). They moan bitterly if they have to wear masks for a week!!!!!
I hope when things do open up more for them that the state hasn't been so protected that covid spreads rapidly as no one will have natural immunity whether or not they have have been triple jagged.

This is one of those difficult situations where one person's rights conflict with another's.

If people complaining about illiberality had a grandchild in hospital (particularly a clinically vulnerable grandchild) would they be happy to have unvaccinated visitors around them?

I've posted this story before, but when my son was born he spent his first few days on a special care unit because it was a difficult birth. He was a strong baby, but others in the unit were tiny premature babies or had other problems. One of the doctors on the SCU had come from abroad, and claimed to have had TB vaccinations. This wasn't true, and it turned out that the doctor was infected. All the special care babies, including my son, were brought in for regular X rays, blood tests and prophylactic medicine. He was less than a month old.

I will never forget how helpless we felt, and how awful it was to know that if the doctor had had a vaccination we would not be going through the weeks of worry we had. As it turned out my son was ok, but that was down to luck.

I am pretty hard line about vaccinations, probably because of that incident, as I really wouldn't want any parents to have to go through it. If that means that those who have opted out of the vaccination programme can't see their children, that might be a price worth paying so that other, arguably more responsible, parents don't lose theirs altogether.

History is not going to look at any of this kindly in my view.

Pammie1

Josieann

Pammie1

Josieann

That is so sad, and in my mind the wrong thing to do. It could set child against parent, feeling rejected at a time when they need them most.
Very frightening and scarred for life.

Why ? I had all my childhood vaccinations and dont remember ever being scared.

Have I misunderstood? I didn't think it had anything to do with the child being vaccinated, but the parents themselves?
And scarred isn't the same as scared.

You said frightened. And I was referring to the poster referencing children not being allowed to start school without vaccinations.

A tangled reply then
I actually said "frightening", meaning the distress of separation and alienation for the sick child from the parent who is banned from visiting. Nowhere did I mention being frightened about being vaccinated. I wanted to view the child's understanding from an emotional angle.

Callistemon21

Peasblossom

Does a parent have the right to put their child at risk of serious illness?

We’d remove children who were at risk of serious accident.

Where does the difference lie?

Are you saying children should be removed from parents who are not vaccinated?

I'm out.

No. I’m just raising a question about the difference between the two risks.

Alegrias1

^Australia is not as liberal as many think.^

This. 100 times this. ??????

Ask any refugee or asylum seeker how liberal Aus is, while they're incarcerated on Nauru.

Surely a covid pass means you are vaccinated ?
A Covid recovery certificate.

Why ? I had all my childhood vaccinations and dont remember ever being scared

That is not the point of the OP at all.

Josieann

Pammie1

Josieann

That is so sad, and in my mind the wrong thing to do. It could set child against parent, feeling rejected at a time when they need them most.
Very frightening and scarred for life.

Why ? I had all my childhood vaccinations and dont remember ever being scared.

Have I misunderstood? I didn't think it had anything to do with the child being vaccinated, but the parents themselves?
And scarred isn't the same as scared.

You said frightened. And I was referring to the poster referencing children not being allowed to start school without vaccinations.

Callistemon21

I agree, GrannyGravy
Having a Covid pass and regular negative test result should be enough, surely? Together with masks.
If someone has had Covid. and recovered are they less likely to have antibodies than a vaccinated person?

In Australia, even before Covid, children and grandchildren of elderly people in care homes were not allowed to visit them without having a flu vaccination.
Children are not allowed to start school without having all vaccines.
As soon as a baby is born, someone is there with a Hep B vaccine ready to inject them.
Some children were given Covid and other vaccines in school without parental permission.

Australia is not as liberal as many think.

Surely a covid pass means you are vaccinated ? These parents arent ?

Pammie1

Josieann

That is so sad, and in my mind the wrong thing to do. It could set child against parent, feeling rejected at a time when they need them most.
Very frightening and scarred for life.

Why ? I had all my childhood vaccinations and dont remember ever being scared.

Have I misunderstood? I didn't think it had anything to do with the child being vaccinated, but the parents themselves?
And scarred isn't the same as scared.

Josieann

That is so sad, and in my mind the wrong thing to do. It could set child against parent, feeling rejected at a time when they need them most.
Very frightening and scarred for life.

Why ? I had all my childhood vaccinations and dont remember ever being scared.

Callistemon21

So do you think compulsory vaccinations are the right way to go, Pammiel1?

Or vaccinating without parental consent?

No. Just asking for a bit of common sense - which seems to have gone out of the window lately.