Support for all who are living with estrangement

I can't wait to go back to my classroom and spend time with some less complex people.

Diclamer: This is a statement, not a response to anything.

Your response is very confusing. Are you disagreeing that people were passive aggressive to him? Or are you saying that the passive aggressive to him was acceptable because he was aggressive

No one said twenty twenty was passive aggressive, Why bring up if his comments were aggressive?

Everyone who is human here cannot possibly be perfect all the time.

It definitely was a joke Mad lol

I didn't say that she did Summerlove. I was using GoodMama's criticisms of responses to TwentyTwenty as a critique of his posts. GoodMama said some of those responses were passive aggressive and I responded that calling a poster a liar, which he did was aggressive, not just passive aggressive.

GoodMama Didn’t say that twentytwenty was passive aggressive, she said posters replying to him were passive aggressive.

It was actually an accident! And I am not sure if your comment was a joke or not really

Oh gosh, please don't do that with exclamation marks Mad! One is strong emotion, 2 is slightly unhinged and 3 is just.... Mad

GoodMama Why on Earth not?! If a poster is upset about something and it’s causing them pain and they explain it and it’s clear to you and/or other posters that their behaviour is what’s causing them pain why would you not tell them?!

The point is not to not say anything, it is how its said, if trying to get a helpful message over to an emotional. hurting poster. A comment like "its easy to see why your AC estranged themselves" is unnecessarily unkind and also vague; it does not help someone to consider their own part in a problem atall!! ! A comment that says "Have you thought about how you doing/saying …..might look/feel to your AC" is not cruel or unkind, it is asking a valid question and opening a line of potentially useful communication. That second statement is encouraging someone to consider the impact etc of their behaviour within the situation that they find themselves. The first statement tells them nothing - by someone who has never actually met them!!

Yes, thank you

As it's no where near a raw

There's a huge difference when having an on line conversation with a poster, establishing a connection however small and then respectfully pointing out to them where you think they've done or said the wrong thing, then making a blanket statement that you can see why, as you posted GoodMama some EP's are estranged.

Recently on this thread for example I advised a GM not to buy her GC expensive weekly gifts just so she'd receive a 'thank you' telephone call from her GC. I also advised her to refuse to give her all but estranged D the money she'd asked for as that, by the posters own admission, was the only time her D contacted her.

I rarely speak of my own pain on here these days as after more than 6 years it's no where as raw as it used to be, and only refer to my own story if I think it's of relevance.

GoodMama, well said! Sometimes, an outsider can see exactly how a person causes harm and they need to be told.

Smileless, you said something that struck me.

“I would never dream of saying on a thread for posters estranged from their parents that it's easy to see why their parents have treated them the way they have.”

Why on Earth not?! If a poster is upset about something and it’s causing them pain and they explain it and it’s clear to you and/or other posters that their behavior is what’s causing them pain why would you not tell them?!

After all, changing one’s own behavior is a lot easier than changing someone else’s behavior.

You would rather just tell them your story and describe your own pain rather than advise them of a better course of action so they may solve their problem and alleviate their own suffering?

Take emotional pain out of it for a moment.

Say a poster comes here and says “I hurt so much, it’s just unbearable.” Instead of telling them about your pain, too, you ask “why do you hurt? Tell me about it”.

So they tell you that every morning they wake up and stab themselves in the leg. It bleeds and starts to heal then they do it again.

Why would you not tell them to put the knife down, stop stabbing themselves and see a doctor?

Why wouldn’t you dream of telling them that? Why would you offer “support” by telling them it’s not their fault and that you, too have pain from hitting yourself in the head everyday and everyday it hurts.

I know that will seem extreme and you’ll likely ridicule me for that example, but it’s an analogy.

If someone wanted help to fix a problem and you could see the problem why wouldn’t you offer it up?

I hope the clarification has helped. It would probably have been better if I'd posted 'I would never dream of responding to a poster who is an AC estranged from their parent(s) .......'

You said "I would never dream of saying on a thread for posters estranged from their parents" which was why I wanted clarification that this thread was open support for both.

I agree with both of you. Sniping and spiteful criticism disrupts the thread and is off putting for some who then feel uncomfortable posting.

Just a few days a regular poster who has been contributing to these discussions for a year, announced that she was leaving due to some of the responses she received.

I would tend to agree Hetty but I do believe that if differing views are expressed unkindly, cruelly, highly insensitively then people should be called out on that. Differing views and hard messages can be expressed with kindness and can then be heard.

There shouldn't be any rules, even unwritten. There should be the opportunity for people to freely give their opinions and advice, compare their experiences and comment as they wish.

Otherwise, it boils down to just one 'acceptable' reaction and any others are subject to sniping and spiteful criticism. It gets quite tedious to see how these posts develop, time after time.

Yes it is support for all who are living with estrangement Razzmatazz and there is nothing in any of my posts to suggest that it is only for EP's.

In fact I referred to the contributions we've had over the years from AC who have estranged their parents.

Are there rules to this topic I was unaware of? Because you make it sound Smile as if this post is for EPs and we are intruding. The thread is entitled "Support for all who are living with estrangement".

I don't agree with your opinion although of course I respect your right to have it GoodMama.

TwentyTwenty was himself "rude, snarky, dismissive" and far from being passive aggressive was simply aggressive. There is nothing passive aggressive about calling another poster a liar.

For more than 6 years of posting on the estrangement threads here on GN, I have seen numerous occasions where posters have talked about the reasons for going no contact with their parents, and have received support and empathy from those of us whose own AC have cut them out.

I have seen plenty where EP's and EGP's have been ridiculed and insulted because they say they don't know why they've been estranged. Just as many that say as you have just done that "it's easy to see how some posters ended up estranged from their adult children".

We do not claim to give compassion and support on this thread we do. I would never dream of saying on a thread for posters estranged from their parents that it's easy to see why their parents have treated them the way they have. Yet for all your criticism of the way a particular poster was responded too, politely IMO bearing in mind some of the content of his posts, you feel it appropriate to make a post of that nature here on a support thread.

In therapy I did a lot of panicking about my parenting. I have made mistakes and screwed up and forgotten important things and snapped in a bad mood. I have done things my mother did because I thought it was normal and had to learn from the expression on my children's faces that no, it's not normal. My therapist said to me that children don't want or need perfect parents. They need parents who show them it is OK to make mistakes and show them how to a handle negative emotions. The caveat is that the parent must be accountable and must apologise. Even if the parent thinks they are right, if the child is hurt, those feelings are genuine and deserve to be heard and validated. I learnt that my children aren't my friends and should not carry my burdens. My actual friends are for that. I am and always will be their mother. I had naturally been doing things the right way, feeling it out slowly, but therapy speeded it up and with help I was finally able to stop punishing myself. I also learnt to stop blaming myself for the way my mother treated me and learn that I was not "bad". Therapy helped me, but it could not help my relationship with my mother, no matter how hard I tried to find ways with my therapist. She just didn't want what I wanted, a good and loving relationship. My relationship with my children and my husband is everything I could have hoped for though. Cutting off their grandparent was absolutely the right choice. Hard as it was.

*has openly admitted to being estranged from their mother

TwentyTwenty’s posting on here was a missed opportunity for a lot of posters.

Here is a person who hasn’t openly admitted they are estranged from their mother because of her behavior.

Instead of inquiring and wanting to learn more from TwentyTwenty posters were rude, snarky, dismissive and passive aggressive.

Posters showed who they are when faced with a challenge from an “adult child”. With interactions like these it’s easy to see how some posters ended up estranged from their “adult children”.

TwentyTwenty deserves compassion and support, just like you all claim you give on this board.