Denied contact with grandchildren

I think probably the first mistake, although at the time it probably seemed like a lovely idea, was living so close. Especially when issues like the septic tank arise, I don’t know if you share any garden, or have shared access, but all of these things are potential issues for arguments, some people can do it, but not many!

It seems they have taken advantage of you from day one, that’s okay if it’s appreciated, but in your case, it certainly hasn’t been

I should let them get on with their high flying careers, and see how was it is without a support system

But I do feel deeply sorry for you, and for little Freddie

You could be right Debcz. It sounds like you've done all you can for now. Perhaps steering clear of them all for a while is bestw. Let them resettle as a family unit. It could be your DGS saying stuff like "Grandma lets me do it" (even if you don't!) and she feels you've been undermining her, even if you haven't.

Also,is it likely that you DD as been having a moan and is being influenced by 'advise' from friends or colleagues?

It seems even more hurtful for the gc when I realise that the youngest has spent his entire life with us around and Freddie half of his.
How can they do that to them?

Reading all the posts has caused me to do a lot of thinking. Maybe too much!
Thank you for your support and suggestions.
My answer to the comment about what I would say to Freddie was that having worked with children who had been
Negatively affected by such actions for over 40 years I was only too aware of the damage that could be done and so would never do such a thing.
I think you are probably correct Pamgeo. They don’t see us as having any value apart from what they can use us for.
Yes. D has been abusive before when I think on it. It was when we tried to explain our borehole water and septic tank system, which they share, could not cope with the 5 gallons a minute shower heads they wanted in the conversion. So they couldn’t have them.
Star lady, I also think you have a valid point. I think she may resent the closeness between us and the gc.
Looking back over the last 6 months that they were living with us I can see we became the gc main carers to a large extent. As Pamgeo says, we didn’t notice at the time.
D and SIL were both concentrating on their careers. We were left to pick up the slack for the gc.
D was frequently away over this period SIL focused on trying to become MD.
We didn’t intend to become substitute parents but I think that’s what we became because they were in out home. We didn’t notice what was happening. It’s only now when I look back I can see it.
So maybe there is resentment and guilt on her part?
Or am I overthinking it?

I agree, living right across the yard from them must be the most terrible strain for you, sell up if you have to, but you really need to get some distance between you

I know what you mean, Smileless!

PamGeo, what a thought-provoking post! And my heart goes out to you!

Also, IMO, you make a very good point about Deb perhaps needing "some space." Bad enough to have your (genera GP) GC kept away from you, but to live right on top of the situation must be especially painful. I know Smileless and Mr. S. came to feel better when they weren't likely to bump into ES and family. Maybe it is time for a move, Deb? Would it be feasible?

I see what you're saying Starlady but if the OP wasn't sorry for going to the rehearsal without telling them before hand, and IMO why should she be, why isn't being sorry that they were upset about it not enough?

This is what bothers me about so many of the incidents we read about here on GN. A P/GP does something they don't like and there's a total OTT response; withdrawal of the GC and no contact because the "apology no matter how heartfelt, might not have hit the mark with them". It's utterly ridiculous.

My heart goes out to all P's and GP's in this position. I'm so grateful looking back that we never got to know our GC or have a relationship with them and that we never had to play this game.

Your post really sums things up PamGeo. With our ES's wife we didn't realise how low her opinion of us had become and for how long.

Thank goodness we are free of it. for all who are caught in this web of this awful behviour and cruelty.

Ok, I'm not sure what this means...

"I apologised for their upset at not telling them...." It SOUNDS as if you said something like, "I'm sorry you two were upset that I didn't tell you about going to the rehearsal." But perhaps Iv got that wrong?

If I'm right, they MIGHT feel as if that means you don't think you were actually wrong not to tell them, just that you're sorry they got upset over it, as if you're apologizing for their attitude rather than for your behavior. IDK. Maybe I'm looking too deeply into it.

But they also may feel you should have apologized for going at all since you didn't tell them about it. IOWs, your apology, no matter how heartfelt, might not have hit the mark w/ them.

But I know that's not what they said. They said “they don’t know what I might say to Freddie.” Thinking it over, maybe they really are afraid you might badmouth them to Freddie. If you don't mind sharing, what was your response to that concern?

Regardless, I think you're being treated very unfairly - and the GC, as well. I just hope D's heart softens over time. If Freddie asks for you - and I'm sure he will - maybe that will happen... Patience...

Really distressing situation for you and your husband Debz, my heart goes out to you. I was wondering if you considered that the school incident had nothing to do with your daughters attitude towards you and her dad, it's merely a reason for her to justify her behaviour to anyone and everyone that will listen to her.
It was when you said about your injured foot and the trouble you had getting around for 10 weeks as well as her texting or just sending her son across the yard to your home. Apart from when she needs something , such as the wine the previous night, she doesn't come and visit , she sounds as though she has stopped seeing you as her parents, as individuals, as people of any worth except for what she has already had.
I'm not saying this to be hurtful but as the focus of all your distress is on what you think you have done wrong ('cos that's what she's said is the heinous crime ) you haven't noticed that her low opinion and poor treatment of you has been going on much longer. This is exactly what my daughter and her partner did to me, I was so upset and confused at the perceived unforgivable crime that it took me a while to realise that no, it wasn't that she was in a bad relationship, it wasn't that it was all something that could be resolved if only we could talk etc etc etc
I've come to realise that my daughter and her partner are two of a kind and both want the same things in life, I'm not part of that life, I'm no longer an asset or a means to an end.
Perhaps you need some space, seriously consider moving home which will relieve the daily pain and turmoil that you are in. If your husband is right and they are going to sell up, goodness knows who you have living so close to you. Leave any monies to your grandchildren in a trust for when they are older and try to make a good life for you and your husband. I didn't intend to write a novel sorry

"SIL listened, daughter was rude and abusive.
Pretty much as expected really..."

So there's a history of D behaving this way towards you? Regardless, I'm so deeply sorry.

"... now we still can’t have contact as “they don’t know what I might say to Freddie.” "

Hmmm... SIL must be (privately) upset and embarrassed as he told you an apology would make a difference. It sounds as if D is just coming up w/ excuses to keep you away from Freddie. Maybe she has resented your closeness for a while, but didn't feel free to try to change it while she was living on your property? Still, I agree w/ PPs that her behavior is very selfish. My heart is aching for you.

I'm surprised your apology wasn't accepted and you were actually bullied....
Well let's hope in time they realize the error of their ways. Maybe they'll get fed up with the school run and miss all your other child care too.
The ball is really in their court now. Hopefully your daughter's anger will die down and they will both realize what they've walked away from.
I think you should plan some nice things to do and leave them to themselves for a while.

They are not loving parents who care about how their child feels. They're more interested in bullying you. Absolutely despicable, they dont deserve you.

I am so sorry OP. She sounds like a right spoilt cow.
You have been beyond kind and supportive and unfortunately it looks like you’ve been taken for granted.

I now like Pp suggestion of having a for sale sign up.

Completely unreasonable. Even if they felt you should have spoken to them about the rehearsal, its not exctly a mortal sin to have not done so, and absolutely no valid reason for their behaviour ever since. Your GC is clearly not the main focus of their thinking either!1 I feel very sorry for you Debcz not that that helps you. I think writing a brief note is a good idea, just saying that it would be good to talk things through.

I apologised for their upset at not telling them.. now we still can’t have contact as “they don’t know what I might say to Freddie.”
SIL listened, daughter was rude and abusive.
Pretty much as expected really...

I must say that I'm shocked at the revelation that it is your Daughter who is the instigator of the problem.
Did she give you chance to apologize for upsetting her by attending the play rehearsal without informing her?
If not, I would wait until I next see the Sil and tell him that you can see that you overstepped the line by not telling them about the rehearsal and that at the time, you just didn't think but you are truly sorry for the upset it has caused between you all.
Hopefully, you might be able to see the Gc again after this heartfelt apology.
Btw, I think their reaction has been absolutely ridiculous, over the top and hurtful to you and their children, who no doubt miss their Grandparents a lot but in your position I would definitely eat humble pie, just to see my dear Gc again.
So sorry for you!

Dolcelatte...when the sting of seeing them mock us (as we felt) had died down a bit, I wondered if it was embarrassment or a rush of emotion, just as you suggested.
That’s the trouble when people draw a line in the sand, there is no way to discuss anything without lighting the touch paper and watching the melt down! (Sorry I’ve suddenly become mrs malaprop!!).

Sometimes people laugh out of embarrassment. Also, that is the action of someone who hates you and love and hate are opposite sides of the same coin. So my conclusion is that there are deep feelings there and I wouldn’t give up but I would give it time.

Oh wait, perhaps I misunderstood, Nams. You say you try your best "so I can see gc." But then you say you're afraid they won't remember you, etc. So maybe you don't have contact w/ your GC at the moment and are just trying to regain it? I admit, I'm a little confused.

Namsnanny, I missed the post where you said your and DH's feelings were laughed at, too. How can AC be so cruel? Hugs!

Apparently, you still have access to your GC though. I'm glad to hear that. The contact may be reduced, sadly, but it's there. You seem focused on maintaining and enjoying that, and I'm glad you are. Hope you have many more delightful visits w/ your GC!

Thanks Smileless….Yes the laughing over the phone was horrific, and when we tried to explain why we were so hurt resulted in this inexplicable reaction.
Really did shock me. It made my blood run cold as it showed a blatant disregard for any feelings we had.

Joyfulnanna …….Such lovely encouraging words and so true.
Hopefully the op's gc will remember as they are a little older.

Just feel that my gc wont remember much about me and their gf because they are so young. Plus if they hear negative things being said, they will more than likely fall in line with their parents opinions. For the foreseeable anyway.
sorry for the hijack!

Lots of support from our lovely Gransnetters here. It warms my heart and I hope it helps you to know we're thinking about you at this very sad time. Your shock at your DD reaction will take its toll on your health, it did for me but I am slowly recovering 9 months down the line. You will too, please be kind to yourself. The love and care you provided will be remembered by your GC, no one can take that away from them and I'm sure they think fondly of you for it, despite what the parents say. Schools teach compassion towards others so they will form their own opinions based on their experiences with you.

Yes, Smileless2012 I just feel so sorry for anyone going through this. You make some very valid points that I agree with. There just doesn’t seem any logic to this situation at all. It is truly dreadful that family can behave like this. Very sad for this poster and anyone else going through similar situations.

Debcz how can it go from 'I don't not what I'd ever do with you mum' to 'you are no longer a part of my life and are to stay away'?

I'm sure you are in a state of shock, who wouldn't be in your position. The trouble is of course, we try to apply logic to an illogical situation. We try to apply reason where there is none. We try to apply maturity to those who possess none.

Laughing at our pain no, we never had that, well at least not to our faces thank God, but who knows what's gone on behind our backs. I can't imagine how that must have been for you and Namsnanny; horrible, just horrible.

As you say Boosgran let them get on with the school run, they may come to see that the favour was from you to them and not the other way around.

6 years for you Namsnanny of reduced contact and 6.5 for us with none at all. It must be so stressful for you.