Putting up with the unacceptable

Ironflower My great aunt unfortunately is still going through this after 19 years. Her son (intellectual disability) married a lady and it was fine until they had kids. Her DIL demanded my great aunt fill their fridge, buy the kids school supplies, make their car payment etc. if she ever tried to say no DIL would respond with "I guess the kids can't come and see you then." She has given them everything. All of her money goes to them. Her husband (my uncle) passed away 13 years ago. Oldest GC is now 18 and so she can have a relationship outside of the parents but she still pays because she's afraid that the children will go without. She has a good bond with her gc but she has nothing to show for it

*Ironflower ...that is sad and difficult for your great aunt. An exact example of the original topic of this this thread.

I am wondering if her background has made her more vulnerable to such abuse, unable to find a way to deal with her DILs abuse? That is, if she comes from the awful experiences that you describe regarding your families background?
I suppose that as she has a good bond with her grandchildren, that is something to show for her suffering such abuse, but I wonder if she also fears losing that bond, if she stops paying?

Ironflower -- My thoughts are with You. Needless to say your story is 'as advertised' and I am not easily "triggered". After I have some time I hope I can give a more helpful reply...

May the Force Be With You.

I know my dad got some of his traits from his mother and father. Their 'neglect' is also likely a reason for his emotional problems. My dad and his brother were raised by their stepdad and their much younger half sister was very much the favourite and golden child.

The long story of my grandparents:
TRIGGER WARNING

My grandma was hungarian. She was also royalty technically. Her mum received a royalty pension (Austrian royal family). She was abused as a child, her mother would deliberately send her to men as a little girl for favours.
She met a man, married and had a baby. He was jewish. Her sister sold them out to the nazis and he was taken away, never to be seen again.

She met another man. He refused to raise another man's child. He forced her to send away her child, she gave him to her sister. They had two boys together. My uncle and then my dad. When my grandma was pregnant, he was in a motorcycle crash. When he realised that he wasn't going to make it, he tried to get someone to kill my grandma so she wouldn't live without him (yup this man is my biological grandfather). He didn't succeed. She remarried again, had a girl. This man, my grandpa, was wealthy and very opposed to communism. Unfortunately during the russian takeover he was a big enemy of russia and so they had to flee. They came to Australia and worked hard until they passed away (Oldest child stayed in Hungary with aunt).

My grandma was mean, arrogant and strong-willed (example she would constantly say she should just kill herself when someone wouldn't do what she wanted). I never enjoyed being around her, I don't think she ever hugged me or showed affection (she also didn't speak good english) but she went through so much that I really can't judge her. My dad treated her like a toddler, he made demands and she had to follow. She had zero control.

My dad and my uncle are not nice people. They were both extremely arrogant, stubborn with severe emotional issues and a superiority complex. My uncle passed away recently (his funeral was the exact day my baby girl was born in February). I don't think my dad and uncle were treated very well growing up. No affection or love so I guess that's why they could never show affection, also likely the genetics from their pos father. Overall I just feel really sorry for all of them, but I can't give up my happiness (and my kids) to try and make my dad happy.

MamaBear -- I admit, I didn't really grasp what Ironflower said until you highlighted it... Yes! I'm sure my grands would claim my 'mom' was a "woman who flies on a broom"!

They would have been/are correct there... That didn't/doesn't automatically make THEM not 'witches' themselves... My family dysfunction was top down and as a bonus for Me? Both sides of my biological 'family'...

But that's how my generational abuse 'worked'... My 'mom' -- "I love my kids better/more then my parents loved me!" Me -- "Well, that's fantastic and convenient for YOU. You jumped over a bar a turtle could leap."

Ironflower “ Toxic grandparents were once toxic adult children.“ What a great point! My MIL certainly had other problematic interpersonal relationships long before I came along. She had cut off her inlaws when my DH was a boy (FILs entire side of the family). She was very upset when DH and I facilitated a reconnection with them. When DH asked his uncle why the fall out, he said he really didn’t know. MIL had a long convoluted tale that painted herself as the victim.

MamaBear and Ironflower -- Me too. No Contact means they aren't giving anything and We aren't receiving or demanding anything... Expect respect as people and parents of course.

If 'parents' can't manage a mutual adult relationship with their AC (regardless of who is creating the issue) then there is little hope of a happy/healthy relationship with the grand-children.

As for your Great Aunt, what a horrible situation. I hate abuse and manipulation regardless of who is doing it. DiL should be ashamed of herself.

MamaBear20,
I'm in the exact same position as you except it's my parents. Cutting off toxic parents is a common occurrence, however it's not the only occurrence. Toxic grandparents were once toxic adult children.

My parents sound a lot like your in-laws. Constant tantrums and silent treatments when they don't get their way. I also get accused of keeping my kids away from loving grandparents (lol)

My MIL has accused me of using my kids as pawns against her, but from my perspective I’m keeping them safe from a toxic and abusive grandparent. I’ve never asked her for anything other than to stop behaving so badly with the tantrums she throws when she doesn’t get her way. How could she interpret that as me using my kids as pawns?

My great aunt unfortunately is still going through this after 19 years. Her son (intellectual disability) married a lady and it was fine until they had kids. Her DIL demanded my great aunt fill their fridge, buy the kids school supplies, make their car payment etc. if she ever tried to say no DIL would respond with "I guess the kids can't come and see you then." She has given them everything. All of her money goes to them. Her husband (my uncle) passed away 13 years ago. Oldest GC is now 18 and so she can have a relationship outside of the parents but she still pays because she's afraid that the children will go without. She has a good bond with her gc but she has nothing to show for her money.

You never fail to make MissA!

Again, fair point gagajo.
I'll shut me gob.

Each to their own MissAdventure. I couldn’t look back in 10/20 years time and bear the thought that I hadn’t done everything I could to stay in my grandsons life. For reasons of love and duty.

Fair point, yes.
These things usually build up over time, too, so you kind of get desensitised, bit by bit.

No, nor me MissA but I've always had a good relationship with DS and family and, whilst I can't imagine them ever using me as an ATM cash point or using the GC as a "weapon" or tool in any dispute, I don't suppose those who are going through it could ever imagine it either.

You're right GagaJo; in reading it back, I should have said could rather than would. And yes, I agree that having less time on our hands to ruminate on things is definitely beneficial and helps to disperse intrusive introspective thoughts. I do hope everything works out for you in the long term.

I'm not very good at playing doormat, neither do I think it's necessary or healthy.

I couldn't/wouldn't tolerate it for long

Chewbacca

^i mean those who do not have a partner/close companion for support at home, to resist the^ emotional blackmail

That's a good point welbeck. I suppose, logically, a single GP would invest more of their time and attention on their only child and their family and so possibly expects more from the relationship than a GP who has a life partner. It would make an interesting study to see what the statistics are on that.

While I think a single GP COULD be more vulnerable to accepting poor treatment, I think it’s important to remember that not all GPs are retired with time to brood.

I’m very distracted with my work most of the time. I even worked through a lot of my cancer treatment and in between surgeries. Teaching is such a ‘throw yourself in’ job, it blocks out the world so I could easily use it to distract myself from family trauma, and have done in the past. It’s great to be able to switch off from it.

I’ve made a conscious choice to tolerate what I believe is unreasonable behaviour in order to maintain a relationship with my GS. Nothing to do with having an empty life at all.

It is as you say Urmstongran horrid. It was our estrangement that first brought me to GN, to a thread started by an EP/EGP.

Although reading the sad and painful experiences of other EP's/EGP's there was some comfort in the knowledge that we were not alone and to begin with, that's what you think.

Toxic relationships are awful to deal with day to day which is why at least for us, despite the pain of losing our son and only GC, we are thankful that that is something we no longer have to live with.

With regard to parents/GP's putting up with unacceptable behaviour, being emotionally blackmailed to dance to their AC's tune, it seems to me that as long as this is working and the AC is getting what they want, there's no need for them to change their behaviour.

i mean those who do not have a partner/close companion for support at home, to resist the emotional blackmail

That's a good point welbeck. I suppose, logically, a single GP would invest more of their time and attention on their only child and their family and so possibly expects more from the relationship than a GP who has a life partner. It would make an interesting study to see what the statistics are on that.

Urmstongran -- Yes. Toxic families and relations are brutal to navigate and often never get resolved.

Unfortunately mismatched perceptions and expectations often lead to conflict. It takes two sides to make a healthy relationship work. It only takes one side being 'bad' to destroy any hope of fixing things.

That said, when abuse is flowing both ways? That's where it gets harder to fix things. Both sides have to accept there is an issue and work from both their 'sides' to rebuild a new bridge.

Accepting that the "old bridge" is broken and the need for a new one exists is certainly a challenge I have faced.

Until I joined GN about 4 years ago I didn’t even realise ‘estrangement’ was a thing.

It’s horrid. Toxic relationships in some family groups must be awful day to day. I truly don’t know how some families come to this/learn to navigate it.

I think that's a good point welbeck. It must be much harder if you live alone and also if the AC in question is an only child.

i mean those who do not have a partner/close companion for support at home, to resist the emotional blackmail.

i wonder if those GPs who are living alone, are more susceptible to this of manipulation perhaps.

Shows that 'great minds think alike' Madgran