Your money or your grandsons

Haha! If reminding my son of a birthday is my biggest problem or the cause, well then I don't want to be part of that kind of unrealistic or reasonable relationship anyway. Way too minor and it was always appreciated and thanked...even by his father even though he didn't know that I had to remind his son. It made him happy. That's much more important in my book.

"I also always remind him of his father's birthday given that his father lives in Canada and a reminder is helpful."

Coordinating staff is helpful and needed.

Reminding your adult son of a bday is crossing the line.

Yes, Smileless2012;

I feel like the fear may be the trigger to the reaction. Now, I'm not saying that his reaction is valid, just that it may have been the trigger to his reaction. I do also feel that a few people have gotten in his ear.

Taking away the house and kicking them out is not a way to solve the issue, only make it worse.

Yes, if he were solely reliant on my reminding him of things, it would be unhealthy, but out of necessity I did review daily responsibilities with all of my staff to be sure we are always on the same page. It was literally an important part of my job. I also always remind him of his father's birthday given that his father lives in Canada and a reminder is helpful.

Please hang on tightly to your home. I am concerned that you should be treated this way. You do need to talk this over with who can help with elderly abuse. Once I had that support I would seek advice on how to respond to him. With that support I would want to tell him that unless you see your grandchildren regularly, you will not leave the house to him! You could always leave it to the grandchildren and cut your son out

"It is way better than a 401k that can lose 80% of it's value in a single day"

Not true, it all depends how that 401k is invested and the risk portfolio that is chosen.

If you are very aggressive and go for the riskiest option - yes, you can lose 80% but also earn 100%
If you pick the least risky option, it is steady growth , very little loss but also very little yearly growth

It must have been a dreadfully frightening time for you and your son Jgran. I can understand how you struggling with your memory would have enforced his fear of Alzheimer's especially as his GF died with it and his father has been diagnosed, having shown signs at the age your son is now.

I can understand how all of this may have been too much for your son to deal with, too much to handle so he had to 'get away'.

Where as this can be explained, his estrangement of you and now his threat that you'll never see your GC again unless you give him what he wants is unfathomable.

I agree about the mixed message Hithere, but remember that when this change took place I was barely able to keep a sip of water down and make it to kitchen sink. I had to focus on a renovation that was near completion and get that property on the market as that is my retirement income. I buy the uglies and make em pretties. It is way better than a 401k that can lose 80% of it's value in a single day. A flip done well can make me 40-100k in just a few months. I wish my parents had left me anything but they died with very little a long time ago. Both my mother and my step father died at 53....I'm 56 now. Both to cancer. As did my grandmother at 53...of cancer.

Sounds like your son stopped being able to take care of you?
Not everybody is cut out to be a care giver, it is so hard to see a loved one suffer and caregiver burn out syndrome is very real

Maybe your expectations were also unrealistic?
You were receiving treatment for cancer, a renovation, dogs, chickens, etc, - all at the same time.
Could it have been too much according to the circumtances?

You also say you reminded your son for him to do things.
That's another example of enabling and enmeshment.
It is your son who has to remind himself of what he has to do, he is an adult and he is responsible for his own actions.

I am not saying your son is not reasonable in his demand

That demand is only the tip of the iceberg.

I'd also like to give a bit more detail on the time specific to his quitting. So, in March 2018 I was diagnosed with Stage 3, Grade 3, -3X breast cancer. Scary stuff!!!

I found an amazing oncologist and learned as much as I could to understand what I had so that I could make educated decisions about my situation. My son also did some research, but most of what he found was very dire. I found a mix. He went with me to many of my Dr. appts and we found that it wasn't as dire as he had originally thought, but it was going to be a tough fight.

Part of my thoughts is that he still hasn't let go of his dire research.

Chemo was hard....vey hard. I lost more than 100 lbs (ok, I needed to lose it anyway) Losing 20lbs a week though was really tough on my body and I ended up in ER several times due to nausea and lose stools that were uncontrollable. The end of my chemo cut short my treatment as my Oncologist felt that it was taking too much out of me and the negative side affects caused partial sight loss (temporary according to the ophthalmologist) and some nerve damage (minor stuff).

It was during this time that my son quit while we were right in the last weeks of a major house renovation on an investment property. He also stopped helping me with my chickens. I was barely able to walk from my bed to the bath, much less take care of the chickens. Even feeding my dogs was a struggle, but I hired help. He liked the chickens as did my youngest grandson, but he felt like I wasn't trying to take care of things. I really was. I ended up having to get a transfusion three times because of my anemia. YES! Another JW no no. Thankfully, I have an amazing gardener that really pitched in with the dogs and my garden in exchange for some tomatoes, onions and ginger. He always filled their outdoor water for me.

December I had my mastectomy and he was sitting at the end of my bed in the hospital when I woke up. He asked how I was feeling and then left. He fed the dogs for two days while I was in the hospital.

When I got out of the hospital two of my friends alternated coming by to see if I needed anything. Its been a slow recovery in my opinion, but I've never been physically challenged so it is hard not to be as able as before but I'm working on it. I can now walk a full mile (with rests) and my memory is coming back just recently. I'm excited about that.

My memory was really irritating to my son for some reason. I don't know why other than the fact that he leaned on me to remind him of things sometimes. His grandfather died with Alzheimer's and his father has been diagnosed and showed signs of it at the same age my son is now. So, maybe my memory struggles were too much emotionally? IDK...

Yes I agree MrsW and yet later we will be blamed for destroying this thread as we are on others.

We are all individuals here.

OP

Do you also have a 401k?
That is a safer bet for retirement in the US vs real estate property as the latter is not liquid right away and its value changes a lot.

You describe having a lot of properties (awesome!) AND taxes and maintenance cost a lot of money.
Are these properties paid off? If still have mortgage on them, it would not work very well if you need that money for your retirement.
CA is notorious for how expensive real estate is.
You dont have to answer my questions. It is just food for thought.

Honestly, you are giving mixed messages.
You are cutting off your son off your will but allow them to live in one of your properties.
Enmeshment continues and it has to stop

I live in the US too and I don't buy your properties are your retirement plan. Not the way the US works.

If your son is this bad with money, you are enabling him.
He needs to sink or swim and he will only do it when he has to face adult life without mommy's subsidized allowance.

Nobody needs a condo to start in adult life.
Could your gc affort taxes and maintenance on the property?
Please do not make the same mistakes you are making with your son with the next generation.

It is very nice you dont want them to suffer the way you did but you do not need to overcompensate for your difficulties in your life.

I don't have the answer to that question MrsWarren but I know what you mean for example I'd suggest ignoring the strong anti EAC rhetoric across many threads at the moment and not let it influence you away from all thoughts and advice.

TBH the worse thing for any poster, especially a new one it to have their account questioned to the extent that it comes across as if they're not being believed.

All too often they leave but thankfully JGran is still here.

Can you imagine the shock, horror and outrage if a poster ever told an EAC they were making things up about their abusive childhoods to garner sympathy, or had misinterpreted how they were treated?

Why does every thread need to be turned into us v them?

EPs v EAC.

It’s not helpful. It derails threads. It causes divides and forces the new poster to chose a “side”.

Jgran

I'd suggest just ignoring the strong anti EAC rhetoric across many threads at the moment and not let it influence you away from all thoughts and advice.

I'm sorry but I am struggling to keep up with everything you are saying so I have nothing to add really. Perhaps I'll try and read through it all again another time.

Hope things work out between you and your son.

You ask how you can salvage this relationship JGran. I'm sorry to say from what you've told us that the only way you can do so is to totally capitulate and give your ES exactly what he wants.

If you do, whose to say this wont happen again in the future?

There are of course parents who want a relationship with there AC and GC at whatever the cost. There's no right or wrong; you need to do what you believe is in your best interests.

We've been estranged from our youngest son and only GC for nearly 8 years so I do understand how painful this is for you.
We were never given an ultimatum but if we had been, I wouldn't have given in to emotional blackmail regardless of how much I loved them and still do.

Take some time, perhaps think about counselling before making a final decision. In the meantime take care of yourself.

OceanMama

You are mistaken MrsWarren. In my post today at 12.16 I said to OceanMama what JGran's d.i.l. and friends had said to her was a "nasty thing to say"; it was not too or about you.

Soooooo..... back on topic here.

My big goal here was to figure out if there may be a way to salvage my relationship. I was really hoping for some ideas and have a few here from a few individuals. Thank you!

As to the house, not selling it in the near future anyway. I also bought a condo that I've been setting aside the income from for my eldest grandson to use for college. That does not change and he is left the property when he turns 25. He also has the option of living there when he starts college and can then opt to rent the second bedroom for college money. His mother did hate that I left this option open as she does not want him to consider moving out of their home.

The house they live in will now go to my youngest grandson. Both boys will be given a leg up in life that I never had.

I grew up with an elder sister in a one bedroom house and a single mom until I was 8. Worked very hard all my life so far and now have a very comfortable estate to do as I will with it.

I recognized several years ago that my son does not have a good relationship with money. Neither does his wife. That is when I changed to my baby sister as Trustee. She has always been very good with money and is extremely organized. She is in full agreement with this responsibility.

The only time I ever stood up to both of the kids, happened long before the estrangement. I babysat while they went to a wedding. When they came home they were VERY drunk. In fact, she was ill almost the moment she walked in the house. I did not want to leave while they were so drunk and since they didn't get in until wee hours in the morning, I suggested that I stay a few hours before going home so that my son could focus on holding his wife's hair. This was not taken very poorly (as far as I can tell) as she decided the next day that she would no longer drink. She recognizes that she is not good at recognizing where her limit is. My son still drinks, but not excessively to my knowledge. Although, he has in the past. Her not drinking has had a positive influence on him.

Jgran, from what I've seen you're right and marrying someone who is not a fellow believer is very uncommon. As you said, you know you're a good person and sometimes we just have to hold onto that no matter what others believe about us.

Smileless2012

I have accused you of being judgemental because I think you are but I have not accused you of being nasty.

You said it was a “nasty thing to say”.

So (using the same logic you applied when you came to the conclusion that I called JGran a liar) you have insinuated that I am nasty.

Smileless2012

You haven't "simply (said) that she's interpreted what was said as meaning hell" OceanMama. You posted today at 12.12 "This detail does come across as trying to garner sympathy by creating a situation that couldn't have happened".

If you tell someone they are maybe "trying to garner sympathy by creating a situation that couldn't have happened", when they have said it did happen, you are saying that they are lying.

Feel free to interpret it how you want. It did come across that way in my reading, but I also stated that I thought it was a misinterpretation. I'm sure something was said. Peace out.

I have accused you of being judgemental because I think you are but I have not accused you of being nasty.

Well IMO your posts speak for themselves MrsWarren.

No, you can say something doesn't make sense and/or in your opinion is "glaringly inconsistent", but you didn't say either of those MrsWarren, you said "that never happened".

If someone tells you something has occurred and you weren't there to witness the event, by telling them it never happened, you are in effect calling them a liar.

Given that my DIL has twice married outside of her beliefs which are also not approved. Even her mother refused to go to the wedding. I find it actually funny that someone would rather accuse me of misinterpreting, or that she didn't use those words, or that I'm somehow using it for sympathy...of course I still don't know how that would garner any as telling me that I'm going to Hell will only mean something to me when I get to the pearly gates. I know in my soul I am not as I have always been a good person, so her belief is her training, not mine.

Smileless2012, you have come at me very aggressively, accusing me of being nasty, judgemental, saying that I am calling the OP a liar. I really don’t appreciate it.