SUPPORT for all living with estrangement

I hope all has gone well for you this morning Whiff.

We went to a service in our church this morning for thanksgiving and remembrance. Giving thanks for all who have worked so tirelessly and selflessly during the pandemic and for those we've lost.

I shed a few tears for my mum and m.i.l. as did Mr. S and we lit a candle for them.

Mr. S. said it has made him think about our ES. It's not only through bereavement that we can lose those we love.

When you come down to it if our adult children who no longer what us as their mom where as black as they paint us. Then any of our other children wouldn't want anything to do with us either we would have no relatives or friends who loved and cared for us.

But we do. My daughter who is 4 years older than her brother would move the earth for me. So would my relatives and friends.

We are not perfect but who is. And anyway being perfect would be boring. I have always told my children you are handed a baby and they don't come with a set of instructions . You just do the the very best you can. Giving unconditional love, attention and do everything in your power to protect and guide them to adulthood.

Being a parent is the hardest thing to do in the world but can be the most rewarding experience you can have.

It's not our fault our children decide we are surplus to requirement. They call us names, re write history to make themselves feel better about rejecting us.

They will make plenty of mistakes bring up their own children. And when their children are older they will be made to feel like dirt when their children point out all the things they did wrong bringing them up.

Our estranged children think they are perfect. They are far from it. My son forgets what a nightmare he was after his dad's funeral. How many times his sister told him off for his behaviour. We where all grieving . I know my daughter misses her dad still especially as she has children of her own. I can only hope my son feels the same.

We know we are good mom's,mother in law's,grandmothers and human beings. We know who we are. And I think we are awesome. No matter what life throws at us we battle our way through it.

Yes I miss my son and grandson's but I will not let it rule my life. My husband made me promise to live the best life I can and I do. Ok I have wobbles along the way.

But when it comes down to it I have made peace with my son's decision it's his choice. I had no say in it. He was cruel and cowardly how he did it. He was a better man than that.

All I have had is accusations with no way to reply to those accusations. If I had he would have had to back down as I would have soon put him right. It was accusation after accusation without any evidence to back them up.

Right change of subject. You will think I am an old fuddy duddy . But I love classic FM . Love all sorts of classical music. When I was younger I was a fan of the Osmond's,ELO ,David Essex and Queen.

We played Mr Blue sky by ELO as we left my husband's funeral. He was a big fan . He also liked David Bowie, Neil Diamond and Clifford T Ward.

Our song was send in the clowns by Judy Covington. For the life of me can't remember why. I know it's an odd choice. But then again we where an odd couple but we where eachother's world. Eachother's one and only. And feel very lucky to have him for as long as I did. All be it cut short.

Off to the AF clinic this morning. ECG and blood tests. Hopefully water tablets as my legs are like tree trunks I want my wrinkled legs back. My weight has gone up but been sticking to my calorie allowance I know it's water weight . It's annoying me and making me limp more. Good job I use a walking stick.

Didn't slow me down yesterday chasing after my grandson's. He's a fast crawler. He will soon be pulling himself up on the furniture. Tried using my trousers to pull himself up on. Had fun playing with his brother and as usual he gave me instructions before they went swimming to change his brothers nappy and to give him his bottle. After what he eat at lunchtime I was surprised he had room for his milk.

Better get up now sat in bed long enough.

Have a good day my friends ?

Your words are true Derbyshirelass. Hurt people hurt people. I don’t think they care how their victim feel. It’s hard to think of someone you lived so much turning our like that. You push it away, but every now and then the enormity of what’s happens consumes you. It’s not about hoping they will change, they won’t, it’s not hoping for the impossible, it’s too late, but we’ve all lost such a lot and you wouldn’t be normal if you find yourself mourning what you’ve lost.
Thank you all for you for support, which I want to give to others too, when things get extra tough for you.

Allsorts.......you may have been made to feel worthless but it doesn't mean you are. It's just the way you have been made to feel. It's not a truth written in stone, it's just someone's else opinion.

It may be extremely painful to think that your own flesh and blood could feel that you are unworthy of their attention and love and that they feel they can just cast you aside like an unwanted toy, but it does not mean that you are worthless. It really is more about them than you, their skewed, twisted thought processes.

I too was made to feel worthless when I read the abusive texts I was sent, the truly vile abusive things that my DIL said about me. I was knocked for 6 and in total shock. At first I couldn't understand why someone could feel such vitriol towards me, especially when I knew that I had done nothing to deserve it.

But I came to see that it was part of my DILs master plan. She needed to undermine my confidence and to make me feel unworthy so that she could manipulate me and bend me to her will. It's just what narcs do. It was what my father used to try to do. It's another form of gaslighting.

It's about their own feelings of inadequacy and self loathing. As the saying goes "hurt people, hurt people".

People who are happy in their own skin and at peace with themselves have no need to lash out at others. It is those who are consumed with hatred, bile, jealousy and rage who go around hurting others. They are the ones who really feel worthless but they would never admit it, they are usually the ones who try to cover their feelings of inadequacy and low self esteem by being grandiose, arrogant and full of their own self importance.

They are to be pitied because they will never achieve the success and happiness. They crave nothing less than adulation.

They might seem as if they are living a fantastic life but more often than not this is just a deliberately cultivated image they try to project. But, at their core there is nothing, just an empty void which nothing can ever fill.

You say your daughter is happier than ever and living a fantastic life. Maybe she is but I'm guessing it's more likely that either that is what she wants you to think or that she's delusional.

My DIL regularly posts pictures of their "perfect life" on Instagram........even to the point of using photoshop to enhance her looks. (She has no need she is beautiful as it is). But it's all smoke and mirrors. I know she's filled with rage and hate, jealous of everyone she purports to despise.

If she was truly happy then why would she need to despise others. She wouldn't be measuring herself against them.

You ask if love can turn to hate, I think it can when a heart is full of bitterness and rage. I didn't think love can survive in such a toxic environment.

I don't know about karma. I don't know if there are time limits, I do know that after my mother died, my father was tortured by remorse for all the terrible things he'd said and done to his family. It was pitiful to witness. But even on his deathbed he was still vile to me so he never really changed. I don't think they can.

True narcs just can't help themselves. They are what they are.

Anyway time to get the Chinese red nail polish out.....

I know what you mean alsorts about karma. People rarely get what they truly deserve or else there wouldnt be any burglars and theives' their hands would drop off the first time they went thieving! But you are certainly not worthless. Some people are so convinced they are right even when their behaviour is anything but. You too did your best and dont feel bad about it. Like what's been said by our other friends on here they too may end up on the receiving end of estrangement when their child does the same to them.

Well hello gorgeous and fellow Bowie fan 'Chinese red' ooh la la DerbyshireLass. Sounds like a terrific plan and also that you've got off to a good start

We've got friends coming for a meal tomorrow evening so I've just got my sweet corn and red pepper soup on the go and the cheese cake we're having for desert.

You're not worthless Allsorts. None of us know what's around the corner good or bad so we need to take each day as it comes. With so many incidents where AC are estranging their parents, often taking away their GC and saying some really terrible things too an about them, maybe a child turning from love to hate isn't as usual as we think.

It’s very early days for you Derbyshire lass , plent6 of time for things to work out. I am so pleased you are making the most of your life despite your problems, I used to believe in Karma, but no more. My case it hasn’t been so. My d has never been happier lots of friends and a fantastic life. Doubt she ever thinks of me. If they love you, sure they do come back, in my case there’s no love, I do think it’s unusual for a child to turn from love to hate and it’s always made me feel worthless which I’ve had to work on.

Another David Bowie fan here. So talented and clever, so intelligent, a real visionary. And such an elegant man. Oddly enough my mother adored him too. She said he had "class".

Speaking of elegance.... I have decided to take myself in hand......No more wallowing in self pity, looking for all the world like a bag lady.

I have got a hair cut this afternoon and I've booked a massage for Monday, (my poor old body needs it, after 4 days painting the outside of my bungalow). This morning I tidied my eyebrows, and gave myself a facial. Tonight I shall paint my toenails.....Chinese red ....so decadent. ?

And over the next few days I am going to continue decluttering my wardrobe, getting rid of anything that makes me feel or look dowdy. Then maybe a shopping trip. ? although to be honest I have a wardrobe of nice clothes just waiting for me if I shed some weight.

So.........It's Goodbye Frump and Hello Gorgeous. (Well sort of, you get the idea??). I'll do the best I can with what I've got.

I really do need to lose some weight and get fitter. I've set myself a target to lose 1 stone by Christmas. It's only 1lb per week so should be doable. Need to get my blood sugar levels down too.

It's 5 weeks today, since it all kicked off. It's been grim at times but I'm moving forward now. Not going to wait around, wishing and hoping. That's no way to live.

Are they thinking about me, of course not. So I'm not going to waste any more of my time ruminating and dwelling on what could have been or what might be in the future.

Just going to enjoy the now....and start putting my plans for a better future into practice. Just need to get fit, strong and healthy first,

Sounds like you d.i.l. and mine could be sisters DerbyshireLass and the way you describe your son "stumbling down the same path" and being "bled dry by an emotional vampire" is a perfect description of ours.

It's good that you have support from your youngest Socksandsocks we need that love, support and validation that we're not the horrible people we're being portrayed as.

Now ladies, if you are feeling a bit low put on some music that you love. I love music and am playing Bowie's 'Young Americans' which is accompanying me as I do some house work.

Mr. S. has gone out for a bike ride, maybe it is rather loud no, can't be. You have to play him loud to really appreciate it.

I love this album because I love the sax; that's sax as in saxophone just in case you get the wrong idea.

Thank you all. Of course you're right and we need to take back control of our lives' emotions and health. My youngest has been so gentle and supportive throughout. Like chalk and cheese they are. I appreciate all of you x

Tbh my DIL is already playing a version of Solitaire. At the moment she genuinely seems prefer it that way.

She has no female friends of her own, she is at loggerheads with her neighbours, she has turned against my youngest son and myself, she despises her female work colleagues. She alienates just about everyone. I am beginning to suspect that even her own parents are happy with the distance between them,

She is a stranger in a stranger land - literally. Her own family live half way across the world. She now has no one other than my son and now her own babies. She obviously thinks that's all she needs but as anyone with a half a brain knows we all need a support network. We need a safety net and back up systems.

Life isn't all rainbows and unicorns and when the chips are down we need love, support and encouragement from friends but especially from family. We need to know that someone has our back when things get rough.

I think she is being both extremely foolish and short sighted. Cutting off her nose to spite her face - all so that she can feed her monstrous ego, and alleviate her insecurities and low self esteem by being "in control,". As well of course, as denying herself the pleasures and joys to be found from friendship and kinship.

As well all know, no one can ever be in complete control and isn't life much sweeter when there is co-operation and shared goals.

I hate to say it but one day, as sure is eggs is eggs, she will reap what she has sown. She will find herself in need of love and support and there will be no one there for her.

But as they say.....it's no longer my problem. Her choice. I can live with that. I also have to now accept that she has sucked the very life blood out of my son and that he no longer seems to have a mind of his own. He is blindly stumbling down the same path. Until he wakes up and asserts himself my other son and I are powerless. We can't "rescue" him if he doesn't want to be rescued.

What saddens me is how quickly and how drastically he has changed. He is but a shadow of his former self, bled dry by an emotional vampire.

Hey ho.....there's nothing more I can do except protect myself and make the best of a bad job.

I'm so sorry Socksandsocks. So, you've been told you were a horrible mother by a father who has turned his D's against his own mother. Well it's blatantly obvious who the horrible parents are in this scenario isn't it, and it isn't you.

We've all done it, especially in the early days. Relived the smallest of memories, desperately trying to see where we 'went wrong', what we did/said that we shouldn't have done and what we didn't do/say that we should have done.

We loved them and did our best. We weren't perfect but who is? I always say that we were imperfect people who became imperfect parents to our imperfect children. Maybe one day your son and his wife will find themselves estranged from one of their D's and have their GC turned against them despite having bent over backwards to help and support them, despite how they were being made to feel.

I don't wish this on him, our ES or anyone but there's a lesson being taught here isn't there. No one is indispensable not even in the parent/child relationship.

You say "I really wish I could help others with the pain of estrangement" Allsorts well you do. By sharing your experiences here and supporting everyone who shares theirs. That's the best help anyone can give and anyone could wish for.

You were called "vindictive and manipulative" Whiff I was called manipulative and an emotional blackmailer. It's awful not knowing the name of the youngest GC or the day they were born.

We know the name of our youngest and his birthday. ES is never going to be able to 'forget' when his dad's birthday is as his youngest was born on the same day!!!

You're spot on DerbyshireLass there's nothing to be gained by beating yourself up over things you cannot change, and whose to say any of us ever did anything so terrible that that is why we've been estranged, and if things had been different we wouldn't have been?

We know that our estrangement is not of our making and just in case there are any of you here who have been guilt tripped into thinking differently, just remind yourselves of the decent and loving parents you were and always will be.

"The may hold all the cars but we don't have to play their nasty evil games" exactly DerbyshireLass and I wonder how many will end up playing Solitaire because one day, they'll be no one who wants to play with them anymore.

Socks.......So sorry to read your sad post. How devastating to have your son poison your GDD against you. How cruel and selfish.

I am going to say something now which I do hope doesn't upset anyone but I agree with Allsorts, don't waste time torturing yourself, continually ruminating over what might have been done or said differently.

It does us no good, none of us should be sacrificing our health and possibly shortening our lives for the sake of trying to keep a relationship going.

I got a terrible shock yesterday. My friend who is 10 years younger than me and who is struggling to maintain a relationship with her adult children had a recent mammogram that highlighted that there might be something nasty going on.......

Who knows, hopefully it's nothing too sinister but for me it really rammed home that none of us knows what's lurking round the corner. Time is not on our side,

In my own case, since my problems blew up a few weeks ago my blood sugar levels have risen, I have had some mild anxiety issues, stomach problems, difficulty sleeping. OK nothing too major but a sure sign that my body is paying the price for the emotional turmoil I have been suffering. But I to take back control and reclaim my health before things escalate and I really do get sick.

So I really do think that there comes a time when we just have to take a step back to protect ourselves.

I have decided to draw a line under it all and concentrate on my own health and well being from now on. I am taking back control of my own life and will build a future free from the stress and anxiety that have been my constant companions for the last few years.

I am reminded that whilst we have no control over whether or not our children estrange us we can have control over how we respond. They may hold all the cards but we don't have to play their nasty evil games.

Socksandsocks01 I am sorry to read your post. Unfortunately it is to familiar.

I hope your granddaughter accepts your gift and doesn't do what my son did last year when I sent presents for his and his second son's birthday , birth presents for my new grandson and for their older brother. Everything came back the day after their birthday all unopened . It looked like someone had crushed the presents in their hands before sending them back. My son put in vile letter stating zero contact. So that has what he has got.

If you have read any of this thread you can see you are not alone. Smiles has given us a safe place to come and be with others who understand what you are going through.

You can pour your heart out here and get help and support. I know how much everyone here has helped me find peace with the loss of my son and 3 grandson's. The youngest is now 1 I don't know his name or date of birth but knew he was due in July last year.

You can write anything and know you are not alone. And hopefully you can find peace and move on with your life. It's not easy but by the sound of it it's early days for you yet.

Smiles and others can put it better than I can but stay with us. You can get through it . I was called vindictive and manipulative which I have never been. You know your own worth and by the sound of it you aren't a horrible mother.

Look forward to knowing you better. ?

I am so sorry to hear that Socksandsocks01. Don’t waste time as I did wondering what you did or didn’t do, put yourself first, treat yourself. Make the rest of your life what’s best for you, you can’t change them, you can alter how you deal with it I regret the time I broke my heart over things I had no power of.
Really wish I could help others with the pain of estrangement, it’s like a hidden taboo, shameful, but it’s so common if you scratch the surface, people won’t talk if it as it makes them feel they have failed.

My adult granddaughter has been brainwashed by her dad(my son) and she too has cut me out. Her 21st birthday is in November. I dont think things will change by then. I'm going to post a gift so she knows I still care and I'm not the nasty mother she has been told I am. I wonder what I could have changed and what to do next. I'm putting a brave face on it. I think their whole household look on things differently to us in general. DIL knows everything ' a proper know all. I've put my feelings to one side for years' ignored the flippant hurtful remarks to keep relationships alive. I feel now I'm not needed for money or babysitting I've been tossed to one side. I miss my granddaughters and thought I was close to the eldest one. Its hurtful all the years I've bent over backwards at their back and call to try and help. Only to be told I was a horrible mother. I pray every day for them to change their ways.

I agree Whiff claiming an illness of any kind can be used as an excuse for unacceptable behaviour. Your nephew is a shining example that with determination and courage, anything is possible.

I'm so pleased that you don't have any worries about how your GC are being raised. I wish we didn't but sadly we do.

"My heart has a strong beat which is good" no, Whiff that isn't good that's brilliant.

Sounds like you have a lovely day planned for tomorrow; enjoy, enjoy, enjoy.

DerbyshireLass love the mantra . Both great posts from you and Smiles.

Mind you do think mental health problems can be an easy cop out for some people to excuse their behaviour. Unless it is medically proven of course. My nephew has mental health problems but lives a normal life . He works and had never turned his back on anyone. His mother is a nightmare and I always blame her for his problems. She was ok when the children where babies but once they became little people she was controlling. His sister's fought back but my nephew is a gentle man . She eroded his confidence along with being bullied at school didn't help him. When my brother and ex sister in law spilt he and the older of his sister's went with my brother. My youngest niece was only 8. But as much as she belittled him he still visited her weekly took he to hospital appointment etc . Even after she remarried.

He has made his flat into a lovely home and I loved going there.
He used to visit me every Monday after work. It was lovely when I visited my brother and sister in law because he came to dinner. Still calls me fossil. If anyone should turn his back on his mother it's him but he hasn't but he is single so things might have been different if he had a partner.

Smiles and DerbyshireLass we know we are good mother's,mother in law's and grandmothers. Unfortunately it's the women our sons fell in love with. But saying that my son could always talk to me. So why did he take the cruel and cowardly way out. I wonder if he had said it to my face he couldn't have done it. But I will never know. But I am at peace with his decision . I like the no contact as I couldn't put up with constant haressment some here have to put up with.

I know my grandson's are well looked after and loved. So I don't worry about that. But miss them very much. I have named their youngest so I can say a name and not just think of him as grandson. I have called him Oliver. Weird I know but it helps me cope.

We all have to cope in our own way. Otherwise it would drive us mad.

Change of subject. After my exercise class yesterday had a called from the hospital for an appointment to see a cardiologist this morning. He was very nice. He is arranging for a MRI scan on my heart to find out what the defect is and whether it has any bearing on my AF. I will be in the machine for 45 mins. I hate enclosed spaces so lots of deep breathing to get through that . Been in one for that long before wasn't much fun. But it's for my own good. He was pleased I can take the blood thinners and tablets to regulate my heart beat. My heart has a strong beat which is good. But AF puts you at risk of stroke. But not worried. Will do everything they tell me to do. They are helping me and for that am grateful. At AF clinic on Saturday for another ECG and blood tests.

Tomorrow lunch at my daughter's play time and baby sitting. Will be fun as her youngest is crawling now. Think nannie will be having a work out while she takes her oldest for his swimming lesson. Mind you nannie has a sweet treat when they come back from swimming. Yum.

WOW what an fabulous inspiring post Derbyshirelassjust the thing to get off to a good start for the day ahead.

I love the 3 birds mantra, it's perfect and is such a simple yet all encompassing summary of how we have and continue to live with our estrangements.

The duck comes first doesn't it. When the silence comes we no longer have to envisage the nasty things that are said and done, running off us like water off a duck's back.

The swan, I really like that one. "Graceful and serene" paddling like crazy beneath the surface just trying to keep our heads above the water.

Before we moved, when I was walking our little dog around the village, I'd make a point of holding my head high and when I saw them or one of their friends who'd turned against us coming toward me, my head would be a little higher and my back a little straighter.

I think we're all at the early phoenix stage, as we brush off the ashes of our painful past, are beginning to heal and moving on so that we can live the best and happiest lives we can.

Like you, I worry about our GC. I continuously hope that there is still enough of the lovely young man he used to be for them to see and be inspired by.

As did you, we raised our boys to know that nothing was out of bounds to be talked about. To be strong for themselves and others. To treat others with respect, love and kindness and to always value themselves.

Knowing that we did, and did our very best means that our conscious is clear.

"Fighting talk" it certainly is and truly inspirational too.

Some interesting questions there Smileless. I have asked myself the same questions over and over again,

Is their behaviour intentional, do they have MH issues, or are they just lacking emotional intelligence. Is it immaturity - although as so many of them are in their mid 30s one would hope for a certain level of maturity by now.

I can only speak for my situation but I think in DILs case it's down to MH issues, no such excuse for my son. I just have to admit that he seems like a stranger to me now, just not the man I thought he was.

So like you I have no answers.?‍♀️

But, whatever the reasoning behind it all I have to say I am becoming increasingly irritated by the way they have behaved like sulky stroppy teenagers rather than dealing with problems head on like fully fledged adults.

I do find it very cowardly the way they have hidden behind texts rather than have an adult face to face conversation.

If this is the way they are going to handle their relationships then I really can't see much happiness in their marriage or their relationships with work colleagues etc. It doesn't bode well for them that they are incapable of sitting down and discussing problems in a timely and adult manner.

I don't know why my son has gone down that route because it's not something he learned from his father and I. He was brought up to be able to discuss anything with us, no subject was taboo. He was taught that old adage "never let the sun go down on your anger", to resolve differences and not let them fester.

My main concern now is for the psychological damage they might cause their own children...........it doesn't bode well for them having emotionally immature parents. They will be the real victims, not me. I have had a long, happy and emotionally fulfilling life. I know I can live with estrangement if I have to and still have a joyful future.

I have dreamt up a little mantra that I use whenever I find myself ruminating and need to redirect my thoughts. It's called "three birds - duck, swan and Phoenix".

I shall shrug off all the insults, the pain and all the sorrow - they shall be as water off a ducks back.

I shall not let my errant son or DIL know just how ill and upset I I have been over this. I will not give away my power or hand my DIL a weapon she can use against me. I will be as graceful and serene as a swan, gliding effortlessly, all the work concealed under the water line.

Finally, like a Phoenix I shall rise from the ashes. Healed and restored, ready to live my best life ever.

With or without my errant son, I shall build myself a new life. Bigger and better than the one I had before.

I have decided that whatever happens I shall be the bigger person. That their behaviour and actions say more about them than it does about me. I most certainly won't sink to their level, nor will I cave in to emotional blackmail,

No more eggshells, no more bending over backwards, no more appeasement. From now I just get to be my authentic self because when all is said and done I think we have to be true to ourselves.

My conscience is clear. I know I have been a good mother and grandmother. If that's not good enough for my ungrateful son and DIL, well that's just too bad.

I am happy in my own skin and I'm not going to let estrangement define me. I will not wallow in self pity or put my life on hold on the off chance that they condescend to allow me back into their orbit.

I will reconcile if that is what they want but it will be on a very different basis going forwards. It's a whole new ball game now.

Fighting talk?? You Betcha. ?

It's been a strange 24 hours and has reminded me how physically exhausting emotional stress and upset can cause.

Yesterday Mr. S's mum's ashes were interred in his dad's grave. It was both moving, sad and comforting. I know that comforting sounds rather odd, but as I stood there and cried I was comforted by the fact that despite the difficulties for the first let's say 12 years of our marriage, we eventually bonded, and the love I felt for her was genuine, as I believe was her love for me.

An entirely different experience has made me realise just how complex human nature can be. That there are some who simply have no comprehension of how relationships work on any level.

It's hard to know whether the distress and suffering that they inflict is intentional. If that's the sole reason that they behave the way they do, or if they really don't know any better and don't know what effect they're having on you.

Then again, if you're telling someone that you are hurting because of what they're doing and they carry on regardless, what other reason could there be.

A time of reflection for me but still no answers.

"Funny how sometimes good things come out of bad". I've been thinking the same thing this morning DerbyshireLass.

What horrified, shocked and deeply upset me yesterday I can now see is perhaps a blessing in disguise.

This wonderful thread, the bonds and friendships that have been made is a prime example too. Strangers coming together sharing their pain, their care and their support for one another.

It's an honour to be a part of it.

Life does indeed have a funny way of turning out.

Oddly enough covid was good for me too in the sense that it gave me the opportunity to really grieve for my husband properly. Sounds crazy I know, but the lockdowns gave me space and time to just step off the treadmill and really have some time to myself.

It's an ill wind as they say.......?. Funny how sometimes good things come out of bad.

Bravo DerbyshireLass. We only have one life we have to live it to the full. My husband said live the best life you can. And I do. Not easy but when I look at all I have achieved in the 2 years here I am proud. I have done things I never thought I could do.

I found new friends, new skills I didn't know I had. My brother calls me an inspiration. But my nephew calls me fossil his name for me.

Feeling better today and writing this sitting in my garden. Which I had completely stripped and re planted. Did the same with the front.

In a weird way Covid lockdown was good for me. Otherwise I might not have done it . Also in a weird way my son not wanting was also good. Otherwise I would never have found all of you. And found courage I never knew I had.

Life has a funny way turning out.

So many sad stories on here. I am of course very sorry for all the GPs who are suffering the loss of their ACs and GCs but it's the children I feel for. They are used as pawns and it is just too shocking for words. Makes my blood boil when children are used as leverage in the nasty control games their parents play.

Worriedwell.....your poor grandsons, especially the 13 year old, such a terrible burden on such young shoulders. The mother and step father should hang their heads In shame.

Whiff......found it really interesting what you were saying about how you have now "found" yourself again. I had this feeling in a blinding flash a few days ago. It suddenly occurred to me I was as free as a bird.

My husbands last dying words were "look after the boys". I have tried my utmost to fulfil his wishes. DS2 has been wonderful, grateful for my care, DS1 has basically thrown it all in my face.

Over the last few days I have been thinking a great deal about the differences between them. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but I can now see quite clearly DS2 has always been the kinder, nicer man.

He was far more supportive during my husbands illness and subsequent death, his elder brother didn't really help much, he was too busy doing his own thing.

Caring for my husband for 9 years wrecked my health and it has taken me a long time to get back on my feet again. My youngest son has been kind and loving, nothing is too much trouble, (although I'm very independent and don't ask for help, he just offers). DS1 just comes over as being dismissive and impatient when I have been ill or grieving. In fact his charming wife has even accused me of inventing illness.

Don't know why I didn't spot it before - a mother's blind love I suppose. I guess I saw what I wanted to see.

But after the way I've been treated the scales have now fallen from my eyes and I now see my eldest son is not the man I thought he was. And he certainly isn't the man his father brought him up to be. My husband would be appalled that a son of his could possess such a cruel and mean streak.

And the truth shall set you free........

One thing is for sure I will never be able to see my son in the same light again, and I will never, never trust either of them.

I am finding that the longer this "silent treatment" goes on the more I despise the pair of them for their weakness, their immaturity, their selfishness and their sense of entitlement. I have no idea how I shall respond when they come crawling out of the woodwork. I say when because I'm pretty certain they will. They will expect to just breeze back into my life as if nothing has happened. That I will be so grateful to have them grace me with their presence that I will go running to them like a whipped dog.

Are they in for a shock........

Like you Whiff, I am rediscovering the real me and its heady stuff. I had hidden my light under a bushel for so long. 15 years buried under sorrow and grief. Well it's over now. Yes I will miss my husband until the day I die but I am ready to rebuild my life now.

In a funny way my eldest son and DIL have done me quite the favour. They have made me sit up and take notice, and my life will change direction as a result. I am making plans and taking action.

Like you Whiff I have definitely decided I will move house, probably put it on the market within the next 12 to 18 months, maybe sooner if it takes my fancy.

I have just spent the last four days painting the outside of my house. The decorator let me down so I thought sod this for a game of soldiers and set to. Saved myself a small fortune. I will make it beautiful and sell at a healthy profit, downsize to something more manageable, somewhere I can lock up and leave so I can go travelling whilst I'm still fit enough.

A new life beckons and I will carpe that diem.....with both hands.