Just to see the children

Let the past go

I would agree with this advice but, for some people, it seems to be impossible to do and they just can't move forward.

You cannot replicate the same gp-gc relationship with different generations and people.

Sweep,

Your mother, grandmother, daughter and gd are different people.

Projecting your childhood and your relationship with your gm wont do you any favours.

Your gc is not you

You could be a different gm than the one you had

Your daughter's idea of a gm may be different than the one you can provide or you think she wants

Let the past go - that relationship you had with your gm is yours only.

I agree with Whiff.

It's a slippery slope taking your own child to court for access to their child. Where does it stop? Are Aunts and Uncles allowed to do the same?
What happens if grandparents don't want to be involved? Can the parents take them to court for access?
What if the grandparents aren't happy with the amount of time they spend with their GC? Can they take them to court for access?
Some people have 4 sets of grandparents!

It just gets too messy and there's lots to consider. The child will then be pulled from pillar to post on access days, can't do afterschool clubs or see friends. What happens if access days fall on Christmas?

It's too much. There are some not very nice people out there, not all, but some will take full advantage of it.

Smiles my grandson's are 5, 3, and 1 at the only moment the only rights they have are what their parents give them.

If they want to know me when they are older it will be their choice and I will be here. But until then as much as it hurts me they are lost to me.

My only hope is my son tells them about his dad who died when he was 16. My husband was 47. Unfortunately the 2 I know will have forgotten me by now. But children ask questions and what my son and daughter in law tells them about me I have no idea. They might say I am dead . Only time will tell.

I was lucky I was brought up to know all my family even great aunts and uncles and second cousins. My nan was a very large part of my life . My grandad died when I was 9 but I remember him. But times change and unfortunately grandparents seem to be as disposal as rubbish.

It hurts but until it happened to me didn't realise it was so common.

I have with your help and others on the support thread made peace with it. Still hurts be I will not let it consume me. My husband dieing hurts more than anything my son has done.

I’m thinking back in my relationship with my grandmother and the pleasure she gave me. The stories she had to tell. How she saw Queen Victoria and how her face appeared to be enamelled. How she had to send her 18 year old son back to the WW1 trenches although he was crying to stay at home. She knew he would be shot as a deserter if he didn’t return. Eventually, she lost her sight and my mother regularly took me to the cinema. I would return to grandma and relate the story of the film. If it was funny we would laugh together. If sad we would cry together. I enjoyed bringing pleasure into her life as she gave me so much pleasure. What I would have missed if I had been denied access..

Smileless2012

Oh I see, well I don't think that's a very likely outcome.

I'm sure there is an exception to this somewhere but I agree, highly unlikely.

Oh I see, well I don't think that's a very likely outcome.

Smileless2012

IMO it needs to be thought through very carefully CafeAuLait and I wonder if those who decide on the legal route often consider their relationship with their AC to be over anyway, so they've nothing to lose.

Yes I would expect so. I was responding to the poster who thought it might heal the relationship.

Yes, I agree. The children should have the right to know their family tree, where they came from, their family history. I know that they will want to know about their GP and probably be against their parents for saying bad things about us. I know that's how I felt when my parents used to mock my GP and say horrid things about them.

IMO it needs to be thought through very carefully CafeAuLait and I wonder if those who decide on the legal route often consider their relationship with their AC to be over anyway, so they've nothing to lose.

No, not a good idea no matter how much you want to see them. It would be like stalking and would make matters much worse.

I've read the posts agnurse and know the story.

It's the children who have the rights Whiff, the right to know their extended family, a right that is denied them by their own parents.

Sweep my heart goes out to you. I hope that the authorities will recognise that you've acted out of love for your GC, the pain of your loss and that what you've done hasn't been done out of malice.

Sweep123

Are other countries and the EU wrong to allow grandparents the right to see their grandchildren? I would never tell parents how to bring up their children. “Demanding” access sounds much harsher than “I am so happy that I am now allowed to see my grandchildren and hope this may lead to a better relationship between us as I’ve missed you too”

I think taking your child to court for access to their children is more likely to result in the end of the relationship. I know, for me, there would be no coming back from that.

Sweep123

I didn’t mean to change the law with regard to harassment. I meant to change the law with regards to grandparents rights. Just after we left the EU they granted grandparents rights to see their grandchildren.
Dr Max Pemberton NHS psychiatrist and journalist wrote
“Grandparents deserve access to their grandchildren just as a parent does and children have a right to see their grandparents. To often in family feuds this important relationship is overlooked. Grandparents have a connection to the past that makes them feel grounded, offers reassurance and helps develop a sense of belonging. Yet grandparents still have no rights in the UK. How is this right?”
Yes I am guilty of harassment, as the law stands, and am prepared for any punishment but not to see my darling grandchildren for the rest of my life. No punishment could be greater. To be able to claim that you have never had a moment of weakness is very honourable.
Actually, I am in poor health but I do have wonderful support from life long friends and family who just wish they could help.

Being a psychiatrist doesn't make someone right and I don't believe this one is right in this instance. There are good reasons a child might not have access to a GP. I say this as a gc who is very sad not to have known their GPs at all, but that was my parents' decision to make.

Yes, you are demanding something the other person is not willing to give you

Adults have the right to make decisions for themselves and others to respect those decisions

Are other countries and the EU wrong to allow grandparents the right to see their grandchildren? I would never tell parents how to bring up their children. “Demanding” access sounds much harsher than “I am so happy that I am now allowed to see my grandchildren and hope this may lead to a better relationship between us as I’ve missed you too”

Harassment sorry

Sweep

You played with fire and you got burnt.
Harrassment is harassment.

Could you find another reason for living? Placing your happiness in other people's hands, out of your control, is a recipe for disaster

So sorry to read these very sad stories… my heart goes out to you all ???????

I don't believe grandparents have rights . How our grandchildren are brought up is their parents. I don't believe just because you become a grandparent you have an automatic right to see your grandchildren.

And before anyone jumps on me. I am an estranged grandmother. My son decided last year he never wants anything to do with me again . I not only lost him but 3 grandson's. He wants zero contact he has it. And before anyone believes I am at fault I haven't done anything wrong. I had no idea this was going to happen.

When you become a parent you set the rules . We did when our daughter was born. My mom over stepped the mark once . And I told she is our daughter and we are bringing her up our way. My mom never said anything again. Both sets of grandparents saw our children weekly . Even though my husband's parents where horrible. He would never give up on them. But that's besides the point.

Luckily I have a daughter and see my 2 grandson's weekly.

Since becoming a grandmother long after my husband died. I have always waited for invites to my children's homes before and after the grandchildren where born. How they bring their children up and who they intact with is their choice. Not a grandparents.

I miss my son and grandson's very much. But will never contact him . He's choice. I only know the 2 elder grandsons as the third was born after the estrangement I don't even know his name or exact date of his birth only know he was due in July last year.

Taking legal action or trying to get the government to give grandparents rights is only going to end in tears.

How many estranged grandparents would put up with our own parents telling us how to bring up our children. And demanding access to our children. I suspect none. May be wrong.

Estrangement is heart breaking and hard to believe it could happen to you. But it does more than I ever thought.

If you try fighting what your estranged child or children decide you are the only one who looses . Not them it gives them extra ammunition to hold against you.

You have to make peace with their decision and it's so hard but you have to for your own sake .

I didn’t mean to change the law with regard to harassment. I meant to change the law with regards to grandparents rights. Just after we left the EU they granted grandparents rights to see their grandchildren.
Dr Max Pemberton NHS psychiatrist and journalist wrote
“Grandparents deserve access to their grandchildren just as a parent does and children have a right to see their grandparents. To often in family feuds this important relationship is overlooked. Grandparents have a connection to the past that makes them feel grounded, offers reassurance and helps develop a sense of belonging. Yet grandparents still have no rights in the UK. How is this right?”
Yes I am guilty of harassment, as the law stands, and am prepared for any punishment but not to see my darling grandchildren for the rest of my life. No punishment could be greater. To be able to claim that you have never had a moment of weakness is very honourable.
Actually, I am in poor health but I do have wonderful support from life long friends and family who just wish they could help.

Mercury Queen, this lady is 86, she needs help not a charge for harassment, this daughter and sil were quick enough to take her money, now she is if no use. People of this age need help and understanding can you imagine how hard it’s been for her on her own through lockdown? This is an age when people do have additional needs and some kindness.
Unfortunately Heartwrenched, you are not on your own, many if us will end up later in your position. It’s hard to comprehend that in your sixties. Please try not to make contact, it would cause trouble for you, I can understand your need, but you would feel worse afterwards, you really would. Meet other people if you can as I suggested

Agreeing with agnurse. Age, health status nor familial relationship makes someone above the law.

After having been warned, Sweep says that she still couldn’t stop herself. No matter how badly someone feels, or how much they want something, they can’t ignore the law.

And I don’t see how changing laws to allow harassment benefits anyone. So many people have a nightmare of a time getting police to take stalking and harassment seriously as it is.

And if the law change being referred to is for third party visitation, I can’t see having a record for harassment helping anyone’s case.

Smiles

She contacted them TWICE after she'd been told not to. That's harassment. Her daughter has every right to call the police on her.

Just because someone is older, doesn't necessarily mean they are in poor health. It also doesn't mean that they can disrespect boundaries and expect there to be no consequences. She said she "couldn't help herself". If she has poor self-control, then I would question whether she's suitable to be around children.