Do you send gifts to GC when estranged

It isn't a false hope AmberSpyglass. It does happen. We know of a GM who about 4 years ago was contacted by her GD, her D's child when she was 18.

They see one another on a fairly regular basis and have regular contact. I don't know if it's still the case but her GD's mother didn't know she was seeing her GM.

That's one of problems with estrangement, it can forge dishonesty and secrecy. It's not a good thing for a D to hide the fact she's seeing her maternal GM from her mother. No doubt, if she thought her mother would respect her right to make her own choices this wouldn't be an issue.

As for manipulation, well what about EP's who manipulate their children so as to make them not want to make contact with their GP's.

I find it rather offensive when EGP's talk of leaving memory boxes for their GC for it be deemed as "tit for tat", as wanting to have "the last word in an argument the poor children didn't start".

"Their last dying act" I'm sorry but that's a ridiculous statement. I started putting aside momentos for our EGC's memory box 8 years ago when I was 52; dying was the furthest thing from my mind.

Parents need to consider, that they denied their children their GP's due to an argument their children didn't start.

As far as I'm aware, the mother of the D I referred too in my previous post wasn't a bad mother. It's wrong IMO to assume that an adult GC would only seek out their GP's because they had bad parents.

The only way to be a part of your GC's lives is to have at the very least, a workable relationship with the parents but that's an impossibility when the parents estrange you.

My granddaughter won't be a child when she gets her box. Thats the difference.

We've got documents at present that would prove that lies are being told deliberately. That would destroy her and blow the whole disgusting mess up. But we'll take the flak instead because we love her and give her time to sort it out in her head....

But in time she'll need to be told the truth because its the truth .

Bad relationships harm children so the best way to be a part of grandchildren lives is to find a way to have a good relationship with the parents.

If children have a good relationship with their parents (and how could any good person hope otherwise) then as Amberspyglass said it will just be seen as a manipulation tactic.

If these parents aren't good parents then the grandchildren will hopefully be in touch while their grandparents still live and will be happy and grateful to have family who loves them. If it comes after the grandparents passing, they will just be devastated and feel a loss they may nit have otherwise.

I can't see any scenario where this is a win for grandchildren at all.

Bringing their parents choices into the argument has absolutely no baring on this at all. Unless it is tit for tat and people want to make their last dying act to be some sort of last word in an argument the poor grandchildren didn't start.

I'm speaking as someone who would have reached out to my nan had she been alive and I do actually have a letter from my nan chastising my mum for constantly shouting at me and wish I'd known her love and protection. I was also estranged and alienated from my own family members.

I don't speak from solely my experience as an EAC.

Amber at 16:36
I agree

I also admit it could be cases of abuse from the parents where the grandparents tried to intervene and got cut off.

Summerlove, you’re quoting from a post made a week ago. That ship has sailed. Smileless has already explained that baptism is not indoctrination. Indoctrination is insisting that someone accepts beliefs without criticism, i.e. questioning. That is not what mainstream Christianity is about.

The promises made by the parents and God parents are their pledges to God and do not include indoctrinating that child into the Christian faith. God wants us to love him freely which is why he gave us free will.

The parents And god parents promise to raise the child in the Christian denomination of their choice…..that’s exactly what indoctrination is??

Bridie22 Doubtful - for me personally, I’d trust the people who raised me and cared for me over the ‘side’ of strangers they didn’t like or trust.

There’s just a certain amount of false hope going on here that’s a little misplaced, that’s all.

I think one can have a good relationship with one's parents but still recognise that decisions they made may well have been right for them, but may not be right for oneself. Brought up to be independent minded I would wish to make my own mind up.

This fantasy about “well, when they’re grown they’ll be desperate to get in touch” or “after I’m dead they’ll see their parents are wrong” is honestly just weird

I don't think it's a fantasy. It's a recognition of a possibility

I also don't think it implies a desire for a strained relationship with parents. It's not about the parents. It's about the grandchildren! And the grandchildren can make their own choices.

I didn’t start a memory chest, really wished I had, but for those that did, well done. Grandchildren, when they become responsible adults, don’t ask parents permission for most things, that is what adults do, unless brainwashed and under the thumb. They will open the box, that’s when they find out how controlled they have been and hopefully allegiances will shift. It’s a long wait but time flies.

Well amberspyglass, that mild curiosity might enable you to look and realise ,especially as an adult there are always two sides to every story.

If you can bring yourself to do it I would apologise about the photo, daft as it seems to me. I doubt the small child involved even remembers being shown now. Definitely keep your AC as separate families, it seems to me there is a lot of jealousy here.As for the desire to pick the children up later I guess your son was looking forward to having a lazy morning with his wife! Strange thing to get annoyed with mum about. Is there any chance of seeing him face to face and talking to him, not about the GC but about him and how wonderful he is. As for presents, how about an actual small toy, keep money out of it.

If my mother, for example, had been estranged from my grandparents - even if I’d met them or been close to them at one point - I can’t imagine any scenario where I’d feel more than mild curiosity about what was in the box.

More likely, I’d feel like they were trying to emotionally manipulate me from beyond the grave and it would confirm that my parent had made the right decision.

If I had a good relationship with my parents (which I did) then I wouldn’t even consider reuniting with or wanting to hear from someone they considered so unpleasant they cut them off.

This fantasy about “well, when they’re grown they’ll be desperate to get in touch” or “after I’m dead they’ll see their parents are wrong” is honestly just weird. And frankly implies a hope that they’ll have a strained relationship with your EAC.

Exactly Bridie at least we're giving them the choice which is something their parents never did.

I to have a box to be forwarded, its my way of ensuring that they 100% know how much they are loved and missed.
It will be up to them whether they open it or not.

Well is seems to be OK for the EAC of non abusive parents to take away their children's choice to know their GP's and to take away the GP's choice to know their GC.

An adult can choose whether or not to see the contents of a memory box left to them by their GP's.

If the parents of the adult GC have throughout their children's life time been honest about why they never got to see their GP's, why should receiving anything the GP leaves put a strain on that relationship?

The only reason I can see for causing problems is if the EAC had not been honest, had fabricated reasons for estranging their parents and seeing what had been left by the GP would be evidence of this.

I would have thought that careful consideration would have been given before the decision to estrange was taken. That the fact that children grow up and can and will make decisions for themselves is inevitable. That one day they may track down their GP's during their life time because they want to know what their GP's have to say.

As I posted previously, why should our GC go through life thinking we never cared, when we did?

I think that in these circumstances individuals just have to make their own choice and others also make their own choices based on those. . Grandchildren (as adults) can be told they have been left a box or whatever by estranged grandparents. They can choose to receive it or not.

They can explain whatever their choice is to their parents who hopefully would allow them as adults to make their own choice without tensions or whatever. If parents don't then that's a bigger issue anyway.

We all have to make choices for ourselves, based on the actions of others. That's life!

People can choose to send things after their sad passing but the grandchildren won't get a choice about whether to receive them.

They also won't get a choice about any feelings that come up or any strain it places on their relationship with their parents.

They certainly won't have the choice to be able to act on what they learn through messages or cards and make any real connection.

Is it ok to take those choices away and not have to feel or deal with the impact it has?

I don't agree it's OK and hope it will be considered more carefully in time.

We have a wooden toy chest with our GC's names engraved on the front which is left to them in my will Granniesunite.

For us it's important that one day they'll know that even though we never knew them, we loved them, we were their GP's and always thought of them on their birthdays and at Christmas.

I don't agree that eventually receiving these would cause them guilt, why should it. If there's any guilt to be felt that would be for their parents as they're the ones who kept us from them.

They may be upset that they never got to know us but that's something that their parents will have to explain.

Why should they go through life thinking we never cared, when we did.

When my grandchild is older ive got a memory box full of the love we have for her.

Neen I would say to be cautious saving cards and messages or things like that to pass on later and only give them if grandchildren come to you in later life wanting to establish a relationship.

If those sorts of things were received otherwise, it would probably cause a lot of upset and guilt to the grandchild receiving them.

Good you cleared that up Neen

Pop not poo

What a tricky hurtful situation for you. A suggestion would be to open a seperate savings account and every birthday Christmas and few extra pennies poo it in there. Along with in a box for each donation a card or letter dated saying thinking of you. There will be a time you can give it to the grandchildren .

If you do, I'll respond.

No, it's not my duty or responsibility not to reply to you Caleo. If that's what you want, then don't post directly to me.