Letter to my Estranged Child

I haven't been given any reasons why there would be no correlation between the two.

Just a no, no discussion.

This is why I like the organisation that Onward posted as they do tend to have an unbiased approach.

Although personally I do believe that not supporting your own child in their sexuality or religion etc is in itself, abusive and at very least neglectful of their needs and rights

Yes, you get it Smileless. A statistical link has to be based on data collected by an unbiased and verifiable method.

Otherwise it is nothing but a collection of related experiences and no conclusions can be drawn from it.

Obviously it’s emotive subject for anyone involved and that makes any attempt to collect verifiable data very difficult.

It's a shame when people don't listen to what is actually being said and make it about themselves but I personally know and understand that I have to step out of my own experience to understand it fully

There are EAC posting on GN who estranged because of abuse, but the majority of posts here are from EP's who are not abusive. However, I wouldn't say that statistically the majority of estrangements are not due to abuse as there is no statistical evidence to support that, just as there is no statistical evidence to suggest that the majority of estrangements are due to abuse.

The stories I have read on estrangement do not involve abuse by a parent but as an EP reading about other EP's situations, I wouldn't expect there to be.

Likewise if I were an EAC reading about the estrangements of other EAC I wouldn't expect to read about non abusive parents being estranged.

Some AC who experienced childhood abuse, and that abuse continuing in adulthood don't estrange. Some AC who never experienced abuse do estrange.

That is often due to mental illness or their partners coercive controlling behaviour.

I agree Peasblossom that attempting to make a statistical link isn't valid due to the lack of available evidence.

Onward it sounds like your son may have MH issues from the drug use. My son's best friend ended up in a psych unit due to drug use. He has recovered and is back to being the lovely young man we all knew.

I don't know but maybe it would help you to look at it that way, that it is an illness. If it was a physical illness you'd care for him, you'd do your best even if he was grumpy and miserable and this is basically the same. Hopefully he will recover and you will be able to put this behind you.

I used to work for an organisation that cared for adults with MH issues. It makes me angry when people justify drug taking, it can do the most terrible damage.

I think we will have to agree to disagree.

The majority of stories I read on estrangements involve abuse by a parent, mental illness or alienation (coersive control) by an abusive third party.

It would seem that most estrangements have their foundations in abuse or poor mental health and why that is happening matters.

OnwardandUpward, I am unsure as to why or what is the purpose of your thread , I do not mean this unkindly, but perhaps you are holding back from making contact with your child , when it is perhaps what you really would like to do. So maybe go for it & see how it pans out. Best wishes ,… ps
Isn’t it that we should challenge one’s behaviour, not punish the person without understanding of of it .

Yes, individually abuse is a casual link of estrangement. But not statistically until, as you say, further research is done. Because estrangement is not always caused by abuse and we don’t know what the proportions are.

Even then, because it is subjective, it would be difficult to quantify. If the EAC said they were abused and the parent said they were not, where would you place that statistically. You would need to have outside verification of abuse to make anything statistically valid.

I wouldn’t deny anybody’s individual feelings or experiences but your post making a link, other than for any specific individual, was simply not valid.

Peasblossom we already know the links in a lot of cases, read about ACEs, it's very interesting. We live in an age where incredible amounts of research has been done into addiction, mental health and adverse childhood experiences.

There are incredible amounts of research into adults traumatic experiences and their impacts.

Yet many deny these links and call younger generations snowflakes etc without wondering if the reasons why these things happen matter. They do

OnwardandUpward,
I can relate with you as how you describe your son is like describing my son, the only difference between us is we are not estranged but have come very close, he knows he needs me more than I need him for my GS's. I have often thought about writing him a letter but to be honest it wouldn't make any difference. You have wrote your letter but are not going to send it, but I think sometimes something like this might make them think differently? Luckily I have the support of my OH and family and do feel sad the way son has turned out.

We may in future understand why people drink to excess and be able to prevent accidents caused by drinking. proven link between accidents and drunken behaviour.

We may in future understand why people drink to excess and as a result the birth rate will be fall. No proven link between drunkenness and birth rates. Though we might all have an opinion about it.

We can base future planning on the first and be reasonably sure our hypothesis will stand.

If we base our planning on the second we could be seriously up the creek.

Can you see the difference?

You absolutely cannot say no link, I'm happy to compromise and say that more research needs to be done into why estrangement happens but there are EC posting here who were abused by their parents... Unless you deny that, it's a link.

Ha, ha. You’ve just made the link again where none (to our knowledge) exists.?

Peasblossom I hope it is something we will understand in future and that incidences of ACEs and estrangement will fall.

Thank you Chewbaca, that means a lot to me.

I don’t dispute the accounts.

It’s just that statistically there is no link.

I’m a bit pedantic, I know, but I couldn’t let such an inaccurate statement pass.

Even thinking a link is obvious doesn’t actually count as a correlation. It is, as you said, just an opinion.

There is an incredible amount of literature on the subject Peasblossom from the origins of why people repeat past trauma in relationships to how there are links between addiction and ACES.

Obviously the statistics being the same doesn't automatically explain the many situations that lead to estrangement but there is a link between the two in my opinion and from what I have read on the subject.

This is why if my children ever estranged me I would be more worried about what they could be going through that I might not know.

VioletSky

Actually, you aren't looking at the full picture Chewbacca

There is a strong link between those statistics but many children/adult children do not talk about abuse and stay silent.

There are adult children who cannot talk about what their other family members did so they may distance from the whole family to avoid a sibling or an uncle or someone else.

There are children who are traumatised outside the family and that may result in mental illness or other mental health issues that leads them to abusive relationships in the future.

I've talked about this at length before

I don’t usually post on estrangement threads. I’ve seen it from both sides.

But violetsky statistically (statistics as a mathematical science)the two figures you quote are not linked. They prove nothing.

Just because two figures are the same doesn’t mean there is a link between them.

Whatever.

Actually, you aren't looking at the full picture Chewbacca

There is a strong link between those statistics but many children/adult children do not talk about abuse and stay silent.

There are adult children who cannot talk about what their other family members did so they may distance from the whole family to avoid a sibling or an uncle or someone else.

There are children who are traumatised outside the family and that may result in mental illness or other mental health issues that leads them to abusive relationships in the future.

I've talked about this at length before

And if ALL estrangements were due to child abuse VioletSky your reference to the NSPCC & ONS websites would be relevant.

freedomfromthepast your post @ 23.28 was just about the best, most intelligent and well balanced post I've ever seen on any of the estrangement threads. You conveyed exactly my own feelings on this subject, without resorting to passive aggression, drama or blaming any one party over another. Thank you for such a mature and well balanced post.

From the Office for National Statistics

Smileless you should also look into the research around children by the government or organisations like the NSPCC

research