Estranged from adult son

BrokenDad

It sounds like you have done the right things seeking counselling for yourself

Now you know you can be ready when your son comes to you.

The sad fact about infidelity and divorce is that no matter who is at fault or even if no one was at fault and the relationship just didn't work... it still impacts children deeply. I'm sure your counsellor has explained to you about attachment and abandonment issues in children which can happen no matter how involved parents are after divorce.

Remember that taking responsibility is not the same as blaming yourself.

Hopefully one day your son will be ready to take responsibility for his actions and move past blaming himself.

The difference in taking responsibility and the self harm/blame cycle is the difference between mental health and mental anguish. Positive and negative.

Remember that if he ever approaches you, it will help

You could be right that the root of his anger and addiction is the break down of your marriage brokendad. There maybe anger toward you for not dealing with your wife's lover the way he thinks you should have, and if he thinks your response should have been an act of violence, this shows how skewed his thought processes are.

I agree that your son needs counselling himself, before embarking on joint counselling with you especially as previous contact has resulted in a physical altercation. I'm assuming that when you became physical with him before, it was in self defence. Not a situation that any father wants to find himself in.

You say his mother's counselling with your son went well which might be an indication that when you're both ready, joint counselling could be beneficial. That said, he'll need to understand that part of the process will be finding ways to move forward together, and not just airing one's personal grievances. That's why counselling for himself needs to come first.

Anger is scary and I understand your feeling, Brokedad. None of us should have to be in a position where we feel physically threatened by anyone, especially not our own child.

Maybe it would be good to see if you could get some kind of online mediation (if that's a thing?) so you could work out your problems with a trained third party, but not physically in the same place?

I wish I knew what to do, myself. Even if we found a way and suggested it to them, they still have a choice whether to accept. Last time I talked to my son I could not reason with him because he was unreasonable.

I have been to counselling both for help dealing with the marital breakdown and for dealing with the ensuing estrangement from my son.

The marriage broke down because of infidelity. I tried to hold it together for over a year, but when I discovered that despite going through the motions, my ex was still seeing her affair partner, I was out. It was apparent that I was not ever going to be able to trust her anymore. Years later, she tried going with DS to counseling. That did go well. I think he was expecting it to be much more of a reveal of everything she had done wrong and less about what they could do to move forward together. He was and still is extremely bitter about the affair. To the point that he talks about wanting to kill the man. Something he thinks I should have done.

If I were the psychologist, I would say that at the core of his addictions is trauma he suffered as a child from the breakdown of the marriage.

He has been involved in a rehabilitation program (twice) but I don’t believe that this program offered the psychological services necessary for him to get to the root of his anger and addiction. These things may, in fact, run deeper than just the family breakdown.

I’m not optimistic that if I were to go to counselling with him, the result would be any better. My feeling is that he needs to work on himself first.

Part of the problem is that I am honestly afraid of what might happen if we are put together in the same room. I’m not a small man and can defend myself, but I don’t want to have to do that. I’ve gotten physical with him before and I never want to do that again, and have not, even when he has attacked me physically several times since.

My understanding is that brokendad is trying to come to terms with the estrangement and the reasons it's happened, rather than what he can do to bring about a reconciliation, and I can see how counselling could be advantageous in that respect.

As you say DL arguing with an addict is pointless and doesn't work, neither does trying to have a reasonable conversation about their addiction.

Adult relationships break down, parents divorce and the majority of those with children do their best to maintain a secure and loving environment for their children.

I agree Onward it's wrong to blame divorced parents for the choices their AC make,and it's wrong for an AC to blame his/her parents as that can result in one or both parents feeling responsible for something that was and remains out of their control.

Thankfully, it's DHs ex wife so I can stay well out of it. As can he. He gifted her his half of their house, as part of the divorce agreement, so nothing anyone has done is anything to do with him.😉

You're right Diamondlily.
So sorry about your Mother in law and family, it sounds stressful.

VioletSky

You misunderstand

Son has to take care of his responsibilities as an adult, as does Dad.

I've been to counselling and one thing I did do before estranging was take responsibility for my own faults and failures in my relationship with my mother. She could not so we are estranged.

Both parties must do this or the estrangement does not end and yes, support for that can be helpful if that is what others choose for themselves

However reconciliation seems to be a goal here so that's my advice unless support only is what is asked

It is up to BrokenDad if he takes it

Thanks VS, its such a shame your Mum did not. Also I can't (without a huge change of heart) imagine my son ever thinking he's behaved wrongly towards us.
I would love it if he faced his responsibilities as an adult as I have mine. But all he ever does is drag me over the coals while being cruel and acting like I deserve abuse, which is why it was me this time to break contact.
I hope it helps you Brokedad.

I agree -arguing with a drug addict or an alcoholic is like trying to knit jelly - pointless and it won't work.

If a couple are unhappily married, especially if they are warring, there are only two alternatives - the children grow up watching their parents arguing, or the couple get divorced.

Divorce done properly shouldn't harm the kids. Plenty of couples I know have divorced, and the children aren't addicts.

But, they kept their strife, with each other, away from the children, and the parent with custody kept up full contact with both sides of the extended family.

The addict has to be the one to get free of the addiction. No one else can do it.

They can throw up all sort of excuses as to why they do what do, but they are adults, and they can change if they want to.

I don't know why counselling would help the non addict family members - my DH wouldn't do it. It's not him necking down excess alcohol, and it's not him gambling himself into debt with online poker/roulette games.🤔

It will all come-a-tumble soon anyway. Stepson bled his mother dry, with cash, second mortgages, equity release etc. but, she was admitted to hospital then a care home 6 months ago. While she's been away, he has drawn out money from her account every week and spent it on his addictions.

Now the council are trying to organise her funding her own care, (she owns a property and the council want control of her finances etc), and so are asking questions as to where all this money has gone.🙄

DiamondLily

Brokendad - you also need to take into account that regular drug taking can alter the character and perceptions of the user.

In an ideal world, children would grow up in happy households with two loving parents, but life isn't always like that. Marriages break up every day of the week.

It sounds as though you and your ex did it the best way possible, in both remaining committed parents.

He's an adult, he's choosing to continue to take drugs, That's his choice, and only he can make the decision to seek help to try to get off of them.

You cannot reason with an addict - whatever their addiction.🙁

No one should ever be threatened or abused by a family member, or anyone else, whatever the "excuse".

I would try to build a happy life for yourself, accept the situation for now, and hope that he deals with his addiction, as things might change at that point.

Best wishes, 💐

It's so sad, but yes drugs do change them. My son's personality is so different since he started taking DMT as well as other drugs.

People who have parents that aren't divorced still take drugs and people who have parents that are divorced don't always take drugs. I hate that people blame the divorced parents or that the divorced parents blame themselves because there is always a choice to take drugs.

These kids are adults. They make a choice every time they get high or whatever. They are addicted, but until they choose to get help for their addiction there is not much anyone can do for them. I agree, you cannot reason with an addict. They have an answer for everything, at least my son does.

I agree, no one should be threatened or abused by a family member. This is why we cannot have contact, but I do think of him every day.

You misunderstand

Son has to take care of his responsibilities as an adult, as does Dad.

I've been to counselling and one thing I did do before estranging was take responsibility for my own faults and failures in my relationship with my mother. She could not so we are estranged.

Both parties must do this or the estrangement does not end and yes, support for that can be helpful if that is what others choose for themselves

However reconciliation seems to be a goal here so that's my advice unless support only is what is asked

It is up to BrokenDad if he takes it

Yes you have come to a good place for support brokendad and I hope you wont be put off by any suggestion that you failed to parent your son effectively.

There is nothing in your posts to suggest that you've washed your hands of any responsibility, and the fact that some who have responded are estranged from an AC as I am, does not negate the advice or support that you've been given.

As well as estranged parents here, there are also those who estranged their parents, remain estranged and are as likely to remain estranged on a permanent basis, as the estranged parents who've responded.

As you say Onward if only it was as easy as a parent taking responsibility for everything, whether or not it's their fault.

Hi Brokendad. So sorry to read your struggles but you came to a good place for support. I'm also estranged from a son who is taking drugs (in his own home) and estranged from his Dad several years before estranging me.
I find it most hard to be around happy families with babies and toddlers as my GC were those ages when I lost them due to his estrangement.

You have laid a boundary and well done for that. VS I have taken responsibilty for years even for things that were out of my control and not my fault, just to keep the peace- and it hasn't helped. I wish it was as easy as that, but hope it works for you Brokendad.

Brokendad

If you want any kind of reconciliation one day when your son is ready to get help, then you will have to take responsibility for how your decisions and choices affected your ability to parent effectively.

As I said, your son has to choose to fix himself but you also have choices to make.

Washing your hands of any responsibility from advice here is never a good choice and it doesn't lead to reconciliation and the future healthy relationship you admire.

Unfortunately this is the estrangement forum. People here are estranged, usually on a permanent basis.

I'd advise you to go to counselling and talk this through with someone who can help you be strong and whole yourself

Brokendad - you also need to take into account that regular drug taking can alter the character and perceptions of the user.

In an ideal world, children would grow up in happy households with two loving parents, but life isn't always like that. Marriages break up every day of the week.

It sounds as though you and your ex did it the best way possible, in both remaining committed parents.

He's an adult, he's choosing to continue to take drugs, That's his choice, and only he can make the decision to seek help to try to get off of them.

You cannot reason with an addict - whatever their addiction.🙁

No one should ever be threatened or abused by a family member, or anyone else, whatever the "excuse".

I would try to build a happy life for yourself, accept the situation for now, and hope that he deals with his addiction, as things might change at that point.

Best wishes, 💐

He was going to do what he was going to do sometimes we forget this brokendad, because we simply don't know if we'd done things differently, if they'd have made different life choices.

It is hard to be in some environments when estrangement has affected our lives. We still avoid events, especially around Christmas where there are families with small children because we've lost our only GC due to our estrangement.

The willingness of others to share their own experiences is so important as there are so many similarities, and when it happens to you, thinking you're the only one makes it even harder to talk about it.

I still remember how relieved I was when I found the first support thread for estranged parents and GP's here on GN, even though that was almost 10 years ago.

This is so true. Walking the fine line between enabling and helping is a tightrope act. It can be tremendously stressful.

I really appreciate all of the support I have received here. Sometimes I feel very isolated and alone.

It is really hard for me sometimes to be around happy families where the children are well adjusted, and have good relationships with their parents. It is difficult not to feel like something is wrong with YOU, even if you know it's not just you.

The holidays can be especially hard, of course.

One of the hardest things about the breakdown in my relationship with my son is that I really don't understand why he hates me so much. I established hard boundaries, but not before trying to change things with a loving approach. Nothing really seemed to work. He was going to do what he was going to do.

I take no pleasure in reading about the difficulties that others are having with their families, but I do appreciate the willingness to share those trials.

Thank you.

a child is for life,not just for Christmas quite trueDL but at some point that child needs to grow up and take some responsibility.

So awful that you, and in particular your DH have had to go through this and that your DH in the end had to tell him that enough was enough. It can be a fine line between being supportive or enabling.

I think you need to go easy on yourself - those with addictions, and those ACs who aren't happy with their lives (for whatever reason) often try to shift the blame onto their parents.

My youngest step-son (mid 40's) is addicted to alcohol and gambling. We had 18 years of him bouncing us in and out of estrangement, simply because we wouldn't meet his endless financial demands to subsidise his poor life choices.

He then resorted to endless threatening, demanding, abusive texts and messages.

Even when my DH was desperately ill in hospital, he sent endless texts demanding money and (to top it all) demanding to know what was in the Will if he died...😗

Luckily enough, I'd already bought the phone home as my DH was unconscious and I was concerned in case it got lost/stolen.

I took screen shots, and wiped the texts before I gave DH back the phone - it was weeks later before I showed him.

There was no childhood traumas of divorce etc., - he was married with a family of his own before DH split with his ex.

He once said to me (and I quote) that we both needed to remember that "a child is for life, not just for Christmas"....what can you say to that? 🙄

Finally, DH told him he no longer wanted to know him. We still get the odd abusive texts, but we just delete and ignore.

It has upset DH a great deal. He feels that you always love your children, regardless of how they believe, as blood is thicker than water.

But, we cannot and will not, subsidise alcohol or gambling abuse, so there's no compromise to be had.

If step-son ever sorts himself out, then that might be different, but I can't see it happening, and his dad isn't getting any younger.

It's sad all round when children turn out this way as adults, but we are all responsible for our own adult lives, and can't keep blaming others.

Just protect yourself, and live the best life you can. There is no point in anyone being in your life who makes you unhappy or feeling threatened.

Best wishes. 💐

VioletSky I don't know if it quite fits here but I read a really good saying the other day. Never trust an adult who can't apologise to a child.

Words to live by, fits anywhere!

brokendad

Thank you to all of those who have replied and offered their thoughts.

It is hard for me to stop feeling at least somewhat responsible for the way things have gone between my son and me. I haven’t been the best or the worst father. I just wish I could know if things would be different if I had been a more present dad.

I know that I have to accept the possibility that we may never have a good relationship or even any relationship. Right now I just don’t see that being possible, but I haven’t given up hope yet.

Well, you ARE somewhat responsible, you are his father. The responsibility is inherent, so it's correct you feel somewhat responsible. There will always be regrets, things to hold up your hands and apologise for, because we're all human. Most adult children react negatively to 'I'm human, i made mistakes, stop dwelling on it' type statements because if you reread, there's not actually an apology there?

You talk about being more present. If you were at 9 football games out of 10 - your being hard on yourself. If you were at none - yeah, you mucked up there.

Regardless, i think you need to let go of trying to be the one to fix it for a while. Your son is an adult now, he needs to take responsibility for his own healing.

You accept your share of the responsiblity for the fact that you and your son are estranged - well and good.

But please, do not go on beating yourself up about this.

Of course, you still love him and it hurts that things are as they are.

Have you tried counselling for yourself? I honestly do not think any one of us could get through, or be expected to get through this kind of trauma unaided.

And please do remember too, that your son is an adult and responsible for his own behaviour, whatever happened or did not happen during his childhood.

But what really hit me between the eyes in your post was you admission that you do not feel safe if or when your son visits and from what you say, you have good grounds for feeling unsafe.

Please DO NOT put yourself at risk. If you agree to see your son at any time in the future, whether he is still abusing drugs or maintains he is clean, do so in public and where there is at least one person who is in your confidence and whom you trust to either handle the situation if your son turns agressive again, or to call the police.

Are you disappointed in him?
That would affect him too.

Are you sure your son knows that you still love him?