Letter to my mother

DiamondLily

Well, I don't blame her from finding a new space to heal.

If she needs certain things from a forum, and I understand this from disability, then some places are more help than others.

That's life. 🙂

A very pragmatic and sensible comment DL.

That's the awful thing about being estranged VS it can happen to anyone through no fault of their own.

I have said what needed to be said on this thread, there is no point remaining in a space that isn't welcoming to the people it was intended for

But I will always be thankful that I have learned how to handle relationships in a much more healthy way than what has been displayed here

Those who put their opinions and need for attention and to be heard before the feelings of others are doomed to become estranged

That's right DL if somewhere or something is detrimental to healing, it's the right thing to go else where.

It's not what is said but how it's said that's the problem. As far as I'm aware no one on the support thread is hurt by experiences shared by EAC. I've certainly never been hurt by them

We know that there are very good reasons for estranging and that doesn't invalidate our experiences, so why is it considered an invalidation by some EAC when we talk about our experiences that are different to theirs?

I would like you to give examples VS of where anyone took their pain out on the OP who said that the EP's posting here are abusers who were abusing her. Who told one poster who said the OP's letter to her mother could be her letter to her EAC that that was a lie.

Of course posters could have stayed away but if there's a thread of interest, why should they? What has blocking every new account the OP wants to make got to do with it? She decided to leave, no one blocked her.

What about the post from Rachel supported by you and the OP about how you can see why some people get estranged? Is that really in the spirit of support and a desire to have a mature and considered discussion? Have you any idea how hurtful that is for an EP to read?

Posters engaged by responding to the OP and others when and where they felt they had a contribution to make.

I too wish this thread had taken a different turn icanhandthemback, but it didn't get off to a very good start with the OP informing EP's in her OP that she wouldn't be debating her personal situation with them, and would ignore any attempts from them to invalidate her experiences.

I ask again, when and where were her experiences invalidated? Did anyone say they didn't believe her, that she must in some way have been responsible, that there are always two sides to the story?

Why even make the assumption that EP's would wish to invalidate her, why would we? That to me is tarring all EP's with the same brush and assuming they're your enemy because of what's happened with your own parent(s).

IMO these threads go astray when it appears that all EP's are the enemy because they've been estranged, because only the rotten ones ever are.

Well, I don't blame her from finding a new space to heal.

If she needs certain things from a forum, and I understand this from disability, then some places are more help than others.

That's life. 🙂

It's really quite easy to let someone else have space to heal

I remember asking for space from my mother before I estranged. I didn't get it and realised I needed to leave the relationship in order to have space to heal

Much like Helen has realised that there are those here who will not allow her space to heal, so she has left

Personal growth is such a wonderful thing, your needs, feelings and opinions matter but you do not need to share them everywhere, especially where someone else needs space to heal their own way

Urmstongran

^I will still share my experience of abuse, but it won't be here among my abusers. Because you are just like them. I know why your children cut you off, and it's why I'm leaving too^

Wow! That’s quite some level of high self regard and very judgemental of others - negating someone else’s experience just seems wrong. Talk about yourself by all means. Others wish to do the same. Fair play really.

I don't think I have abused or negated anyone, but, on an open forum, people have different experiences - no one experience trumps another.

I'm lucky, and much of it is luck - got a great relationship with my kids, but I have had wide experience of my adult step ACs and their behaviour.

I don't judge anyone for estranging (did it with my ex MIL) and never looked back.

The judgemental bit seems to come in when some ACs, not all, take the view that parents must know why they've been estranged, and they are just in denial.

Hmmm, if only life were that simple. 🙄

Eek! I wish this thread had taken a different turn. it was nice to see an EAC being able to speak.

I am sick to death of the "leave it in the past", and "what real abuse looks like" tropes thrown out here. With all due respect, why do you chose to post on threads such as these if you know that you wont agree with the topic? That is what I don't understand.

And for those who want to use my experience of reengaging with my estranged mother, don't jump the gun to much. We are reestranged and I have a diagnosis of C-PTSD and treatment resistant depression due to the combination of a lifetime of emotional abuse, which IS real abuse, and the added abuse of the last 8 years of trying to take care of my family with an open heart.

I have never been physically abused, yet I wish I had been. In my eyes, it would be easier than 50+ years of emotional abuse that I am trying to recover from right now.

I am back off to deal with my damage and wont be back often as things never seem to change around here. Good job to the OP who tried to open a discussion for the EAC on GN.

Helen simply read many other threads here and watched the same people take over EAC threads by:

1. Invalidating them

2. Telling them they should just get over it

3. Turning the discussion to be about their own situations and having a conversation over the heads of EAC who are in the minority here

It happens on every thread and I have pointed that out so many times. But it will never stop. I expect to see it now

Helen didn't take her pain out on any of you, you guys came and took your pain out on her while pretending not too. You could stay away as easily as I stay away from your support thread because I know what I have to say * even though it is about my situation* hurts people there

Yes we can block every new account she makes but we can't stop her making more

I will still share my experience of abuse, but it won't be here among my abusers. Because you are just like them. I know why your children cut you off, and it's why I'm leaving too

Wow! That’s quite some level of high self regard and very judgemental of others - negating someone else’s experience just seems wrong. Talk about yourself by all means. Others wish to do the same. Fair play really.

I do have empathy for others in pain VS but being in pain is no excuse to lash out at others who are also in pain.

I'm sorry your mum's still doing that, is there no way of blocking her?

Well I wish my mother would reach that stage and stop stalking my minor children online...

Helen is gone, so probably won't be reading

Try and have some empathy for another human in pain. We could have helped her

Similar to you VS when we're asked if we have children we tend to say we have one son and no GC but there's sometimes that longing when we see GP's with their GC.

You don't know us helenwaspushed. Had you been on GN for sometime you'd have known more about the circumstances that resulted in those of us who have been, being estranged but even then it would be wrong for you to say it's easy to see why some people are estranged this is thoughtless and cruel, and rather ironic coming from someone who accuses others of being the same.

I know why your children cut you off, no you only see what you want to see which includes seeing any responses that are not about you as invalidating your experience. To say that there are posters here who are among your abusers is extremely offensive, especially when some you are referring too are also victims of abuse.

No one's invalidated your experience even though you've attempted to invalidate others. I've had no problem with what you've shared here in terms of how that's made me feel, apart from how you've addressed EP's.

I hope you find somewhere more in keeping with what you're looking for.

Smileless - yes, elder abuse, along with spousal abuse, can be as damaging as child abuse. They are all horrible. It's all bullying, and I'm glad the law is being tightened up around it.

I am fully convinced that my DH, as he got older and more poorly, health wise, would at some point been subject to abuse from his younger son.

At it was, he had to confine the abuse to texts and phone calls.

Simply because he knew exactly what would happen if he came round here. I was the barrier to him really getting out of control with DH.

Like most people, of that ilk, he knew exactly who to try and take on, and who to avoid lol 😉

I am genuinely sorry Helen

I am so used to it it no longer bothers me

Everyone on this site proving who they are right now.

If you're an abuse victim, you don't have to move on. You can talk about it as much as as little as you want. Telling people to move on is furthering the very deep and damaging dismissive behavior that we are already used to. It's cruel, and some of you continue to do so despite being told.

I shouldn't be surprised at the ignorance of others, but I continually am. The same people who take over every conversation to make it about them have done it again. But you don't know why you're estranged either,magically.

I agree with Rachel that it's easy to tell why some people are estranged. So many people here being thoughtless and cruel because they just HAVE to give their opinion.

You have to make room for others or they will leave you and find someone who will. And no, making it about you is not making room for others.

I'm quite upset which I didn't expect. Many of you here are exactly like the people in my life I want to avoid.

I will still share my experience of abuse, but it won't be here among my abusers. Because you are just like them. I know why your children cut you off, and it's why I'm leaving too. I hope you feel like you've won and you cling to the fact that you pushed a well meaning and deeply hurt person away from an outlet because you couldn't handle how it made YOU feel.

Toodles. Have a nice life.

Peace and happiness is the goal

When you can talk about the situation without it to ruining your peace you know you have achieved that

I simply say I do not have a mother when asked about family now... the need to justify or explain my situation has gone. I no longer look at other mother figures with longing... I have learnt to parent myself

I don't think anyone can completely put it behind them. Some of the decisions we make are because of what we've experienced.

We'd never have moved nearly 7 years ago if we hadn't been estranged. We've never regretted that decision but will always regret the reason we had to move. Depending on one's own childhood experiences, decisions are made when we have children of our own not to place them on our own children, or to give them the childhood we were blessed to have had.

Discussing it can be beneficial to us and to others who are going through it too and have felt unable to talk openly. Feeling of guilt and shame can make it difficult as well as finding a place to do so.

Estrangement is one aspect of who we are and as you say Sara we shouldn't be defined by it, by ourselves or by others.

I've said that to myself countless times over the years DL, that the abuse could have been worse, a lot worse and knowing what some survived really does help to put things into perspective.

It's the abuse of power and position within a religious institution that is wrong, rather than the religion itself and the same applies to the family. Parents have power over their children and sometimes that power shifts when the children themselves become adults.

In addition to child abuse, there are cases of elder abuse as well as domestic, financial emotional and coercive control abuse, this being a fairly recently deemed illegal act punishable by law.

I think unless there's mental illness that abusers are aware of what they're doing, especially when looking back you can see the planning that went into bringing about a particular situation. The length of time before the desired result was finally achieved and the cover up that was so meticulously orchestrated that when you realised what was happening, it was too late to stop it.

Parents and others who abuse children go to great lengths to cover up what's happening because they know what they're doing is wrong. Diminished responsibility is only accepted when there's medical evidence to support it.

We're glad to be out of our relationship with our ES and his wife even though it's not what we'd have ever initiated because although it was over pretty quickly, we can see now that it was inevitable and we were spared the pain and anxiety of a long drawn out affair.

It's heartwarming to see how many EAC and EP's are eventually able to move on and make a life for themselves where they can be at peace and be happy.

I would probably spend 0 seconds thinking about my own mother a day if the behaviour of others didn't remind me of her.. That leads me to spend probably about 10 minutes a day being highly interested by how abusive people cannot see the issues with their own behaviour and feeling very glad I am out of that relationship... It is very validating

Add a further 5 minutes wondering why anyone would gladly sit and spend their time telling someone else to "get over it" rather than show any sort of kindness and empathy

I have all the time in the world for people interested in self reflection and personal growth to support them to achieve peace and happiness

Sara1954

DiamondLily
Same, I had my problems with my dad as I got older, but I always loved him, and have very happy memories of when I was little.

They're the memories to hang onto. Those that make you smile.😉

Smileless2012

Oh yes I agree that religion can be an abusive experience. We only have to look at what's happened with the Catholic church to know that that's the case.

My only experience of Buddhism was in hospital years ago. One of the ladies on our ward was a Buddhist and she seemed to exude peace and tranquillity, an experience I've never forgotten.

I don't know what you mean by that Rachel and I hope it wasn't intended for any of the EP's who have posted here. It would be rather cruel if it was.

I've got an American friend who's a Buddhist, and very calm and chilled he is. 🙂

I don't think religion itself is evil or dangerous - I think the problem is that some, within a religion (any religion), use any power they have, often to abuse. But, obviously, they aren't really following the guidance and rules of their religion.

But, I don't think priests/vicars/any religious leaders have the powers they used to have anyway. Society is becoming more secular in many countries.

DiamondLily
Same, I had my problems with my dad as I got older, but I always loved him, and have very happy memories of when I was little.

Well, as an adult, I just decided to make my own life, unhindered by thoughts of the past.

I bought my own kids up very differently, so the saga ended with me and my mother.

Years later, I worked in a Child Protection dept with kids that had really been abused, in ways I couldn't comprehend, and I think that also gave me more perspective as well - it could have been a whole lot worse!😗

I was lucky - I had a lovely dad, and a wholly supportive Nan.🙂

The past is gone - it's the future that matters,😉

I’ve been watching this intermittently without commenting, just wanted to say I think DiamondLily has the most sensible approach.
I’ve said before, if we really could put it all completely behind us, we wouldn’t constantly be discussing it, but we shouldn’t let it define our lives.
I also feel that probably, in many cases of estrangement, there is a certain amount of fault on both sides.
So leave it all in the past.