Red flags

Indigo8

When somebody accepts and expects generosity without ever it occurring to them that they should give or do anything in return.

I think I agree with all of the suggestions on here, but this one is probably the biggest one for me.

I’ll leave aside any behaviors I just find unpleasant or unlikeable—most of them have been covered by other commenters anyway!

My red flags for genuinely unsafe persons include:

• Inability to accept boundaries or understand what they are (lines we draw for ourselves and our lives, not project onto others/use to control their behavior.)

• Refusal to ever admit they’re wrong or to apologize

• Racism, homophobia, misogyny, transphobia, etc. I especially cannot abide when such bigotry is couched in “political or religious differences” so as not to be too specific or alarming to the listener, or to be easily rug-swept as “not personal”. For most ideologies, the political is personal, and I won’t spend time with someone who thinks my friends’ and family members’ existence is something to be squashed.

Fortunately I’ve gotten quite good at identifying these traits pretty quickly and keeping them out of my life!

poshpaws

If they think practical jokes are acceptable. To me practical jokes are unkind, and usually humiliating, to the victim and I would question the entire character of someone who found them funny.

Could bot agree more uts bullying.

I know Smileless and it must be so much worse for people who don't have a partner or a pet. So sorry Diamond Lily

We also won't have GC and will be missing people, but we'll try to make it a nice day, eat some nice food and wine and try to get through it. It's only one day, but I remember feeling a huge sense of relief last year when it was all over. Yes it is all you can do.

I hate hearing about it so early. I haven't had the TV on much since they started going on about mince pies in August.

Does anyone have any good ideas for games to get/play with elderly people? I like Scrabble, but we'll have our parents with us and they find it hard to keep up now, so I was wondering about something that might keep the attention better? Perhaps if we all threw ourselves into a game it might make the afternoon go faster.

If the weather is nice there's walks with the dog to break up the day. Perhaps we should make a coping post and add as many ideas to pass the day well as possible.

Christmas is difficult with a lot of things. Adverts and build up is all about happy couples/happy families.

All fine - but I found it incredibly hard last year without DH. I had the family but no DH.

I just staggered through, reminding myself it was only one day.

Which is all you can do, whatever the circumstances. 🤷‍♀️

The issue with Christmas is all the advertising. It's all about families being together and when you can't have that, and estrangement is one of many reasons why it isn't possible for everyone, it makes it particularly difficult.

Our DS is in Aus. Our ES's children are our only GC. From the outset, we were and remain determined to make the most of who and what we have but it isn't always easy and for us, Christmas remains particularly hard.

It's true that all of us here would have more fun and peace on our own than with someone whose behaviour is distressing. I empathise too.

I listened to a video about coping with Christmas, yesterday, on the Stand Alone charity website. It advised us to treat it like any other Bank Holiday, get some nice food in and do things we want to do.

It's a shame that the website is all out of date , dated 2023 for workshops - no updates. I was hopeful when the Estrangement charity started up and now I don't know of another one.

VioletSky

Oopsodia It was the most stressful time honestly

It is very stressful isn't it. Been involved several times similarly, so I empathise.

Smileless2012

I think there comes a point when you have to put your own welfare first 00opsidia, when you have to put to one side who is abusing you because this is abuse, and take whatever steps you need too to protect yourself.

I suppose it doesn't matter who it is, abuse is abuse. You're right Smileless

So sorry VioletSky I can imagine! Not done anything the same, but been involved with child neglect cases which were super upsetting.

Oh dear Skydancer How awful and boring. You'd probably have more fun alone than with someone like that. So sorry you had that experience.

Good grief Skydancer, I have no idea how long this 'friendship' lasted but glad you're no longer in touch.

Oopsodia It was the most stressful time honestly

I had a "friend" who I used to travel several miles to see. She never came to see me. When I arrived her first question was always what time would I be leaving. Then we would go to shops she wanted to go to, often to buy cards for her friends (I never got cards from her). Then sometimes back to her house where she would (reluctantly I think) make me a sandwich. Once she even drove us to the tip as she needed to get rid of some stuff. She never asked me anything about my life and did not remember much about me or my family. Needless to say, we are no longer in touch.

00opsidia

Smileless2012

I suppose it depends on which family member the red flag person is Tuaim, the nature of the relationship and whether the red flag person is a family member of the partner of a family member.

For me, it's never been a case of making up reasons to excuse the behaviour but finding a way of dealing with it without alienating the family member, in our case our son who estranged us in the end anyway, because of the influence of his wife.

Bouncing estrangements seem like a good way of putting it. Terrible situation.

Yes, when it's family , the shock of how I've been treated is so severe, I haven't even been able to talk about it all. I would never tolerate it from anyone else. I have months of abuse (in writing) and voice messages too, full of hatred. Trying to decide what to do with them.

Well, it was easier for me, with my step-children, after DH had died, because I was so furious over what they’d put my husband through, when he was alive.

They agreed he had been a lovely Dad, but their tantrums were all about them and their wants and needs.

I had to put up with it when DH was alive- I certainly didn’t have to after he’d died.

As they found out…😷

Any adult can be unreasonable -it’s not all about older/estranged parents.

I think you need to, first and foremost, look after you. Think about what you need,

Best wishes. 💐

I think there comes a point when you have to put your own welfare first 00opsidia, when you have to put to one side who is abusing you because this is abuse, and take whatever steps you need too to protect yourself.

Smileless2012

I suppose it depends on which family member the red flag person is Tuaim, the nature of the relationship and whether the red flag person is a family member of the partner of a family member.

For me, it's never been a case of making up reasons to excuse the behaviour but finding a way of dealing with it without alienating the family member, in our case our son who estranged us in the end anyway, because of the influence of his wife.

Bouncing estrangements seem like a good way of putting it. Terrible situation.

Yes, when it's family , the shock of how I've been treated is so severe, I haven't even been able to talk about it all. I would never tolerate it from anyone else. I have months of abuse (in writing) and voice messages too, full of hatred. Trying to decide what to do with them.

VioletSky

I wish I could say that every adult in charge of safeguarding children were safe people themselves but unfortunately I can't and was involved in whistle blowing myself recently

Eeek that must have been so awful VS.

It wasn’t good. But, I’ve outed them now from my life. 🙂

Watching your DH being abused by his own children must have been heartbreaking DL.

From the behaviour of my adult step-children, they were the abusers. 🤷‍♀️

I finally drew a line under their nonsense, when DH died - but, for 18 years, I had to put up with “bouncing estrangements” with their whims and tantrums. ☹️

I suppose it depends on which family member the red flag person is Tuaim, the nature of the relationship and whether the red flag person is a family member of the partner of a family member.

For me, it's never been a case of making up reasons to excuse the behaviour but finding a way of dealing with it without alienating the family member, in our case our son who estranged us in the end anyway, because of the influence of his wife.

I think sometimes we make too many reasons up to excuse vile people. If your gut goes 'punch', then it is probably right. Why permit semi vile behaviour, comments, just because the red flag person is close family. I think the word 'no' delivered in as many ways as possible does toughen your personal boundaries. Be on your guard when you first meet someone, don't get carried away into their orbit because you think they are marvellous, until they prove themselves to be trustworthy.

If only they did have it tattooed on their foreheads DL then we'd know who to avoid .

Abuse isn't the sole reason for estrangement or necessarily the most common, it's a factor in some of course but not all.

Yes, abusers don’t have it tattooed on their foreheads. They usually come across, in general, as “nice” people, which is why people are fooled.

Having said that, the vast majority of people are not abusers, even if estranged from other family members.

Family fall-outs and estrangements happen for a variety of reasons.🙂

Child abusers often are, or appear to be 'decent' around adults which is how they too often go undetected.

Red flag really, if a person can't be decent around other adults, then they aren't safe around children either

Abusive people just don't become magically non abusive around children