Support and friendship for those whose lives have been affected by estrangement.

@yogi will be 11 years for us. And the worst thing we did was to try to fix things, to leave ourselves wide open to our daughters abuse, the more we tried the more she hurt us. It was a vicious circle, Smiles is indeed right, if your AC doesn’t want you there stay away for your own well-being. We didn’t get the message for way too long and it cost us dear.
Take care 🌹

I learnt so much on this forum about estrangement, that I had no idea about before. I wish I had known then what I know now, so I could have reacted in the right way.

But as I've said many times on here; I was proactive, whereas Smiles did as asked and stay away & stayed silent. We trod different paths, in all these years, yet ended in the same place, 12yrs on. Still, I wish I had done the same as Smiles, it's the only way

Morning all,
@whiff - you take gingerbread to craft classes!
I need to enrol 😂
But on a serious note I can’t get over what your DiL posted about you, it was beyond horrible to make such a low comment. My estranged daughter had an account on mumsnet and badmouthed us on there as well as twitter etc. I don’t know how anyone could support her when she used such foul language but she had plenty of foul mouthed supporters who hadn’t a clue who she was or who we were. Is a refuge for cowards.
Anyway is sunny here today so we will go for one of our walks. Have viewings of the house tomorrow so here’s hoping 🤞

Whiff so sad, I'm sure the same is said about me, when like you, I loved & adored them and did lots for them, always putting them before myself.

12yrs next month! Really cannot comprehend how a girl can cut out her loving mum and destroy the special & loving relationship I had with my GC.

Sparklygran & Babs My Joey waits on the towel laid down by the patio doors when it's wet & raining outside to have his paws wiped. If it's raining heavy first thing in the morning, when he obviously is in need of a wee, he pocks his head out and says no thanks, I give his little bottom a push, but he will not go out in the rain!

I'm so pleased he is all better now, I was so worried, no idea what it was, maybe doggie flu, as he wasn't sick or diarrhoea.
He is having a bath today sch........

Morning Whiff, lovely to see your morning rambles.
Agree, best to ignore the disruptive posters and get the thread back to supporting genuine Estranged parents .
Hope your tests results are ok and look forward to pics from your craft group .

Babs you are right that our estranged children think they have broken us and probably take joy in that thought . But I have not broken because of my sons estrangement I was already broken over my husband's death and what my son and daughter in law have done is nothing compared with losing half of myself. I was broken for a while because I couldn't understand why and, why I didn't see it coming . But with the help of Smiles and long term posters on this thread I got the help and support . Their openness about what happened to them made me realise I wasn't alone . I didn't even know it was called estrangement. This thread continues to help me and hopefully I have returned that help to others . Last year I gave up hope of every seeing or hearing from my son ever again and happy making that decision. My life is to full for what ifs or if onlies. Have no time for them . So I am not broken from my estrangement as my tolerance for my son and daughter in law's behaviour is at zero. Past is gone I live in the here and now and look forward to the future.

Smiles only been to see the ballet twice in the flesh . Once with my mom we went to see Giselle in my teens I love it but mom didn't. Few years ago my daughter took me to see Mathew Bournes Cinderella set in WW2 . It was wonderful but know understand why my jerks happened during it . Because of the loud bangs of gun fire and bombing plus at one point the scenery was set to collapse as a building got hit by a bomb.
There is the electric ballet here or coming can't remember which way it is where some of the dancers costumes will have lights in them and the theatre in darkness. But know I can't go. I do watch ballet and concerts on catch up TV . Saw a modern version of Copalia but they had used CGI for parts it was good but much rather what real people.

Mr S has done his brilliant job as usual and you have storage for your boxes. When I moved here made it a rule nothing was ever going into my loft . Especially not after all the stuff found in my old house loft. It's a wonder the ceiling hadn't caved in .

Glad everything is set for the first and you will have to stop paying bills for an empty house . You already know but don't forget to let your energy supplier when completion is through and you have taken and given them meter readings,cancelled your insurance ,let the council know who the new owner is etc.

Yogin hope Joey is fully well again and your neighbour is behaving himself.

SparklyGrandma you have have a watch cat as a pet and gives you comfort you give it in return . I don't have pets . But know friends who have dogs and cats and they all seemed to know when you need extra attention and comfort. That's why animals are so important helping people get over problems in their lives. At the Brain Charity they have assistance dogs that help at the centre with various neurological conditions and go into nursing homes for dementia and Alzheimer's patients and special schools . There are several people where I live with assistance dogs and have seen people walking cats on leads. I didn't know you could do that but the cats seem to enjoy it . My brother and sister in law's dog always remembers me ,we have to meet outside as she always she always wees usually on my hand as she lies on her back for a tummy rub.

Went to craft group yesterday we made wooden pumpkins and witches brooms . They liked my gingerbread. Sadly no more classes until first Wednesday in December. Starting Monday they are having a new roof as they haven't been able to use some of the offices for a few years because of water damage but finally have the money to have a new roof.

Have it on my calendar to take an apron as our teacher said we will be using glitter . My pet hate but haven't used it since the children where young . Hopefully today's glitter isn't as sharp as it was . But will find something to do on a Wednesday still places I haven't visited yet.

Allsorts and DiamondLily hope you are both doing well . Sorry if I have missed anyone out.

Don't read for a day and more imposter posts on estrangement threads. There are some people who must be proper saddo's if that's what gives them joy. Their lives must be so void of love they like attacking others. But in real life they would never do it as they are cowards.
Reddit is a nasty place for nasty people.

June 2020 I didn't post openly on the support thread I PMed Smiles for long time before I found the courage to post on this thread. But I did post on the house and home forum the thread about the stress of buying and selling it's how I joined GN in March 2019 after my house sale fell through the second time.

I wrote about what my son had done there . June 2020 I was staying at my daughter's as having new shower room ,my bedroom ceiling and walls plastered , decorating etc done on my bungalow. Was with them for 4 years but we did our own thing and to give them allow time in the evening I went to my room . First time I did it my daughter checked on me to see if I was ok. I explained they need alone time and I was happy just cross stitching she did tell me they where fine with me staying . I knew they where but I hate imposing on people. She wouldn't have housekeeping off me so I knew where they keep some cash so put £50 on the bottom . I can't take and not give . Two weeks after I got home found the £50 under my clock . She said you are my mom I love you we don't need paying as you have always helped us out for years with your time and always been their for my whole life.

Veered off as usual 🤦. I was reading GN and a poster said her grandson had seen something on Reddit and thinks it was my daughter in law. I should have known better as it was a new poster and she put a link . I was in a pain flare and didn't use my normal caution so I pressed it . Yep it was my daughter in law after 2 sentences handed my phone to my daughter in tears. My daughter was fuming but she did think it hilarious that she had described her as unemployed. For all the vile things she wrote I still loved her until one sentence' FIL died to get away from MIL 'in that moment any love for her died . I thought how could someone who loves my son be so wicked about a man she never knew. But what was worse was the vile comments from other people about me . Never read Reddit since nor ever will.

I emailed GNHQ with all her details and she was banned and never posted again . She had done what she set out to do.

Technology has made my life easier. But it has given rise to the platform for small minded vile people to hide behind username names to attack people and hurt the vulnerable. How many times have there been cases of children commenting suicide because of cyber bullying? Unfortunately these cyber bullies grown up to be cyber adult bullies .

Better get of my soap box . But it has made us all aware to read the username name carefully before replying to it and reporting any imposters .

Jaffacake glad you had a wonderful time with your daughter at the spa . While it was upsetting for your daughter wanting to see the texts from her sister she saw exactly what you have been subjected to .

Glad see has a date for her operation and hope it goes ahead as planned . I assume they have given her all the facts and options if they see something that needs removing other than the original problem . Glad R coming over to support you .

Glad you where able to have a swim it must have boost your confidence. Last time I swam I was 16 ,😱50 years ago . Had enough trouble co ordinate my arms of legs then no chance now.

Waiting for tests results my view on it is if it's bad news then I would know straight away within days . Which has happened to me on few occasions and it's how we had my husband's cancer report. We saw his consultant 4 days after the tests.

Why is it your daughter always says you can see your grandchildren at physical events knowing full well what you mobility and health is like . Shows how uncaring she is. I can understand you going alone with it as you don't want to lose contact with your grandchildren . But it is costing your physical and mental health. And your daughter knows it and is doing it on purpose. Just make sure you rest and look after yourself.

Smileless2012

Feeling pretty awful with this cold but the good news is we've had confirmation that completion will be on November 1st; fingers crossed.

Is a lot of it about, make sure you have a duvet day to rest up and either read a trashy romance or watch something silly on netflix, works for me.
Glad that completion has been decided, about time!
xx

Hope it all goes well, and your cold goes. 🙂

Feeling pretty awful with this cold but the good news is we've had confirmation that completion will be on November 1st; fingers crossed.

Well we've certainly had a run of vindictive and nasty posts Babs.

So cruel. This poster posing as Allsorts then showed a post on Reddit saying dreadful things about her. I thought she had seen it and had posted it because she was upset but it appears it was the imposter making sure she knew about the venom posted about her.
So vindictive and nasty 😡

I reported a poster called Grumty (M), posing as Grunty (N).

The post has now been removed as a banned poster by GNHQ. 🙄

Allsorts name is being used in a similar way to Babs. A closer look shows AIIsorts instead of Allsorts so thanks to AskAlice for pointing this out; I've reported the posts on the other thread.

Just to let you know that apparently there's someone on Reddit posting as FlyingFloatingFree saying that Violet has been 'banned unfairly thanks to sheer numbers of reports from bullies'.

I have had my suspicions about the attempted disruption we've been having, and this would seem to confirm them.

@whiff I only ever had my nana on my mums side the others died either before I was born or soon after, and she wasn’t a very loving nana, rather the sort that would complain that I had trodden on her corns but every week my mum took us over there and we helped her polish her brasses or to make biscuits/cakes and she would tell us about the old days when she worked in a corset factory as a seamstress, and her dad didn’t talk to her for weeks because she had her hair cut in a bob which was all the rage in the early 1920s, or of how all around the house she lived in was countryside and farms back then. I loved it. She died when I was 11 and I really missed her.
My children also had a good relationship with my mum and my DHs mum, as with your DH my father and my husbands father had died early. As often as we could we took the children to see their grandparents and they loved it even though my husband never forgave his mum for doing nothing when his father abused him physically, often taking his belt off.
Our ACs are robbing their children of a loving and enriching relationship with their grandparents, which is unforgivable in my book.

@Smiles what a lovely night out. We saw The Nutcracker ballet performed a couple of Christmases ago. Is such a treat!
@Sparkly we still have those painful moments when we think of our daughter and GCs, birthdays and Xmas are always a sticking point, and sometimes I just have a bit of a cry for what could have been. This is normal and will never go away no matter how much we accept what has happened and move on. As has been said is like a living bereavement and I can still shed a tear for my old mum and dad though they have been dead many years.
🌹

Babs03 ah you will miss your trees when you move. Whiff there is a paragraph on the GN website, on an info page. I will cut and paste tomorrow.

Smileless thank you.

I think acceptance is worthwhile but hard speaking as myself as an example, if I let my feelings grow and get very upset about the estrangement, become depressed badly even about it, I can imagine a GP telling me to try and live with it, put it out of my mind as much as I can, and get on with life.
Waiting to fall asleep here, I have one of my cats curled up around my feet.
Allegedly, can’t remember where I read it, a cat sleeping by your feet means they are guarding you, or think they are.
Anyway, it feels lovely and comfy. A bit over warm buy lovely…

Just got back from the ballet, 'Swan Lake' my favourite.

Mr. S. enjoyed it too, bless him we only go because I want too but he always enjoys it too. Great seats, central to the stage and on the front row.

Just enjoying a coffee with some brandy in it. Mr. S. has given me his cold but it is just a cold thank goodness. May have to cancel Friday's appointment at the dentist but will see how I feel Thursday afternoon.

He did a great job boarding out the attic and all the boxes are now stored in there so we've been able to dump the two old and rather shabby outside storage seats, we had at our old lodge.

No news about the house so we'll contact our solicitor on Monday and see if the 1st of November's going to be the date or not.

I'll catch up with today's posts tomorrow when hopefully my head wont feel like it's been stuffed with cotton wool.

Pleasant dreams dear friends x

@smiles I remember her saying exactly what we keep banging on about that grandparents should have the right to see their grandchildren as long as there are no questions regarding their personal safety which in the majority of cases there aren’t.
And was heartbreaking that some grandchildren spoke about how they missed their grandparents.
Well done you and Mr S for helping highlight this issue 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

@Jaffa, love that saying - ‘don’t jump over the seas for someone who wouldn’t jump over a puddle for you’.
So true in our situation.
And am so glad you had a break at the spa with your daughter, hold those memories close, and memories of time spent with your GCs, that will give you the strength you need right now. Don’t dwell on negative thoughts about your other daughter, that will only diminish you, keep your distance and enjoy the calm that will help you heal.
Take care 🌹

" Don't jump over the sea for someone who wouldn't jump a puddle for you "
I have just read this on another estrangement thread and thought of the oceans I have jumped for my eldest daughter since she was born 41_years ago. No she will never jump that puddle for me, even being in hospital having brain scans. All I had from her were unpleasant texts saying how unkind and unsupportable I have been. No more jumping over the seas.
I met up with my younger daughter in Oxford last week for a 2 night spa break. We had a lovely time together with tears and laughter. She wanted to see the texts her sister had sent me but only managed to read one as she became upset at how I have been treated. So we didn't talk about her and focused on our own happy times. Managed to have a swim which boosted my confidence as still having mobility problems. Her surgery is scheduled provisionally for November and R is flying over from Ireland to support us all.
I had nerve conduction tests done on my leg which is still numb yesterday at local hospital. Not painful but definitely unpleasant. Waiting on brain mri results from 3 weeks ago,maybe will be told once all results together.
Have had only one message saying I could see the children next weekend at the leisure centre when they are at a roller disco. Breadcrumbs being thrown at me without any consideration of my current health.
Take care all and have a nice day,clear skies here.

Yogin forgot to say great news about your being able to park outside your home . Just hope him next door doesn't start up again .

I loved my nan and grandad very much unfortunately grandad died when I was 9 he was 64. Those where mom's parents . My dad's dad died not long after I was born . Only knew dad's stepmother but never called her nan because of what she did to dad and his brothers and sisters. She was a horrible person. The only good thing dad's dad and her did was to keep my uncle who was born with Down's in 1950 . He was cherished by all the family he hero worshipped my dad his big brother . It was mom's side of the family I knew more about and knew all my great aunts and uncles 2nd and even 3rd cousins as they where older than me . Mom was all family and through her dad had the family he always wanted. Even though my husband's parents where nightmares we always went every week . In my father in laws eyes having the children was the best thing we ever did . He died in 1988 . When I told our daughter grandad had died she said he told her off for picking up my brother. She doesn't remember him . But both the children remembered their great grandmother. I spent lots of time with my nan . My grandsons don't know eachother. So my daughter's boys only think they have 2 cousins their dad's sisters children . Even if my daughter in laws brother and sister have children now they will never see them as they live other side of the world.

We never forced our children to have a relationship with their grandparents but they loved being with my parents and going out for the day with them. As they got older we didn't force them to see their other nan but they wanted to. They knew what a nightmare she was but didn't give up on her even after their dad died. So I will never understand my son and daughter in law as they both knew and spent time with her and knew what she was like . And yet they are treating me like she treated us.

Smiles I know Mr S will do a good job boarding out your loft . At least the sun is shining today and the autumn colours look brighter. Hope you hear about your completion soon as the 1st is fast approaching your deadline before you put your house back in the market.

Babs bad behaviour from children wasn't put up with when they where young but as adults they think they can do what they want . They don't realise there will be consequences for their actions . But one day they will learn.

Morning everyone.

It's a lovely morning here which is a good thing as Mr. S. needs to cut the wood for the attic floor outside.

I do think that accepting there's nothing you can do to resolve an estrangement is important when it comes to moving on with your life Sparkly; it was for me. When you you're constantly thinking about that you can do, and trying to do something it makes it extremely difficult, if not impossible to let go.

Cats are great aren't they, not as fiercely independent as they like to pretend. I do miss not having a cat in my life, especially as I had Sphynx which are very sociable and affectionate but am resisting the temptation.

I remember Esther Rantzen championing GP's and the important role they can have in their GC's lives Babs. It was because I responded to an article of her's in the Daily Mail which they published, that I ended up on ITV's 'This Morning'.

Looking forward to the ballet this evening; 'Swan Lake' my favourite and it always makes me cry .

@whiff we don’t know why but we do know that even a mother and grandmother has to draw a line under what is an irreconcilable situation and get on with life, the only other alternative is to give up on ourselves in the same way they have.
Realising this has helped us move forwards and enjoy life again. Perhaps our estranged ACs would rather think of us broken and pitiful, if they think of us at all, but to be honest I pity them for kicking their families to the curb and no longer having a loving family around them.
Their loss really.
But of course in all of this our GCs are innocent and have missed out on a loving relationship with their grandparents. Which speaks volumes about their parenting. I remember Esther Rantzen championing grandparents rights but sadly in cases like this we have no rights.
Take care 🌹