Support and friendship for those whose lives have been affected by estrangement.

Sorry beginning of that post was a reply to Whiff x

You are spot on letting go of hope is not terrible as some might think but actually a positive for those clinging painfully to hope for many years when estranged. And it doesn’t mean we let go of hope with regard to other things in our lives. For us our main hope going into the new year will be a healthier and less bumpy ride in our new home going into 2026.
Am not enjoying this time of year, putting the tree and decs up today but my heart isn’t in it, am just doing it for my daughters and the GCs. Will scale it down this year due to DHs ongoing health probs and the fact that one of our daughters and son in law are struggling financially, will give them some money and just buy a bit of something for our GS.
Roll on New Year.
Love to all 🙏🏾❤️

Coping with a child with an eating disorder is awful. I've had it with one of mine, all resolved now but years of anxiety. To be totally honest I could have cheerfully choked my late MIL with her thoughtless comments about food. We did get to a point where we told her quite calmly that we would have to stop seeing her if it didn't stop. It never came to that but I fully understand why that is a big issue for the mother protecting her child.

Yogin your daughter must have had what I call a hissy fit when she ripped the book up. Reading she did that as you know weird things pop into my head and I wondered how many paper cuts she got doing it .

This is the first Christmas I haven't looked at Christmas presents and wondered what my 3 grandson's like. It made me smile to realise it . Letting go of hope of ever seeing them is such a relief and have been happier since I made that decision 2 years ago.

Smiles in my experience woman handle things better than men . Whether it's estrangement,grief or health problems. I call it the silver backed gorilla attitude. All the men in my life had and have it . This is just my opinion but men think they have to be brave and think they can sort out everything . My husband loved BBQing even if it rain he put up a tarpaulin and sat under it placing cards with our son while cooking the food while our daughter and me stayed inside I past things through the window. 'Me man I cook with fire ' . Haven't had or been to a BBQ since he died . That was what he loved . I did all the cooking except from when I was 38 I had total hysterectomy week before Christmas so with the help from the children he cooked Christmas lunch and did it until 2002 as 2003 he was to ill dieing from cancer. Christmas lunch that year the children cooked it I only made the gravy and craved the turkey as usual. It was the last meal he ate . Unfortunately he couldn't taste it as the chemo destroyed he's sense of taste . For him that was awful as he loved his food but didn't put weight on . Me only have to look at a cream cake and put weight on😂.

My daughter popped round yesterday to change my bed which she does monthly for me haven't been able to do it for years. But it was lovely just to sit with a cuppa and talk just the 2 of us.

I know I am veering off again but like the GN friend I had lunch with on Friday she was telling another GN member she contacts about meeting me using my username said I write like I am in real life . So she knew we would get on meeting . But when I ramble it's like I am talking to a person or group of people . Hence my veering off subject .

Better read and respond to people's posts. If I have time will tell you about the taxi driver who took me to the Phil on Thursday night. My daughter was crying laughing when I told her.

Yogin so glad you had an apology for losing your documents. Hope you enjoyed Fawlty Towers. Was it like the TV version or had PC took some of the fun out of it ? Looking back at old sitcoms they would never be made today as people are so thin skinned nowadays . I love Mrs Brown's boys and the D'movie Brendan dam forgot his surname made . Lot what he said as Agnus about family was spot on . Loved the fact when they where filming in front of an audience if anybody fluffed their lines they keep going . Which made it even funnier.

Babs glad you stopped sending gifts to your estranged daughter. You have wonderful daughters that love you and Mr B . For all you and Mr B have been through this year and your life has changed so much you are both still fighting together . My husband knew from the start about my problems but he didn't care he wanted me . Even when my health got worse when the children where 4 and 6 months nothing phased him . He just said we alter our way of life to suit what you can do and be a normal family. I was always a hands on mom only thing I couldn't do for years was go out by myself. When we went out it was easier for me to be in a wheelchair chair . I walked with a stick short distances and it wasn't until the children were older I stopped using the wheelchair. Wasn't until I was in it I realised you become invisible and in those days people smoked everywhere.

Your life changed in an instant but the love you have has seen you through the toughest times but you still have things to face now and in the future. But you will face them . None of us know what life has in-store for us . The past has gone you have to live for the now and future .

Why I always behind catching up with everyone I am on my HPX group, on heart forum and several sites on Facebook to try and help people with my experiences. Plus since my diagnosis I have become more disabled militant if I could walk I would have been on marches .

Plus helping people I meet . I always wear my National Disability Card on its lanyard and had no end of people ask me about it . So I tell the and about the Access card . In the bank on Wednesday the teller asked me as her daughter is disabled so explained and she wrote all the information down told her see and her partner can get National Carers card and the lanyard is red . I have the National Disability lanyard but there are different ones including one for hidden disabilities.
I wear mine as it makes me visible if needing help like on trains and I stand out like going to the Phil. But my main reason is if I collapse in the street or shop people can see it's me plus it has my name and date of birth so they know being disabled I have hospital records which they can access. There is madness in my thinking . I am very fiercely independent and hate how much I have changed since January.

Babs I know how hard it is for Mr B with the stroke a bleeds he has changed . I know how much the tumour on my husband's brain but the optical nerve and the other tumours changed him which he hated . Especially the feeling of being weak but he wasn't weak he fought everyday like Mr B does . The children and our daughter still doesn't know he was going blind and couldn't see their features from his last Christmas. He never wanted them to know ,no one knew. I know and others here know how hard it is to carry knowledge and no being able to share it with anyone . But I keep my promises to him too this day and always will.

I tell young and older people do what they want to do now don't wait as you don't know what the future holds .

Babs you and Mr B have your bungalow to look forward to and it will make life so much easier for you both plus work out cheaper to run . After my brother and sister in law stayed with me they knew they had to move to a bungalow. Which they did and love it especially as her MS has gotten worse and it makes life easier for her dad who lives with them . They move from the black country to another county as her mom was in a home with Alzheimer's they planned for him to live with them and move her mom closer to them in another home . But she had a fall and broke her hip and died not long after they went to see her. I have adopted my sister in laws dad as my second dad . He's 93 now but active . But doesn't like going in the car for more than a hour . So holidays have been put on hold for the last 2 years. When my brother and sister in law visits his kids they have friends which keep an eye on him for the day.

Unfortunately my sister in laws sons don't contact her unless she does . Her youngest has Asperger's but her eldest son well won't write what I think of him . When she was seriously ill must 6-7 years ago and my brother had to give up work for 3 months to look after her as she couldn't do anything for herself. He only phoned once a week and never visited her once he lived 90 mins away on the train . So she is basically estranged not through any other reason than they just don't care . Thankfully my nieces and nephew love her very much and don't see her as step mom but a mom . As their own mom is a xxxxxxxx nightmare but they have never given up on her .

Anyway have to get up, move it or lose it this morning. Haven't read this so expect some of it not to make sense 😱😱😱😱🤣🤣🤣

Debbie, you have explained your experiences with ED very well and I really think you are doing the right thing. She is behaving very badly towards you, wanting you to choose between her and your husband. As for sil setting you up, that was dreadful. Think if you had ditched your husband for her.
Value yourself please, I feel that in a way I have let my daughter ruin my life as it dominated me for that many years, important ones, it made me physically ill as I questioned everything I might have said or done, now I now for sure it was what's she wanted all along as everyone else was binned too. I had my son, but I don't see him much so I have had to learn I am enough. We would never tolerate such behaviour from a friend or anyone.
Sparkly, I have been bereaved, worst time my dh, miss him every day still. I knew he loved me, estrangement is a living bereavement for a long time and the betrayal that goes with it, the lack of love etc.from your own child is on another level.
It's cruel.

Babs03 you are right, it is like bereavement. Even thinking we see them when out somewhere, but it’s not them, is a feature of bereavement.

DebbieJP your experience is well told and I can feel your anguish when reading your words. If you feel like it, you could find something to throw yourself into. When the initial estrangement happened to me, I was working in a very engaging and energy sapping job and I threw myself into that.

Correction - not thought about your estranged AC for a whole day or more

I understand Sparkly.
The day comes when you don’t wake in tears. Then the day comes when you can face going out. Then the day comes eventually when as you say you find that you have both thought about your estranged AC for a whole day or more and have been getting on with your life.
Is so similar to bereavement.

Debbie, don’t keep going over what happened, I know we all do it but is exhausting and exasperating. Your estD is making up a narrative to excuse her behaviour towards you, just ignore it and rise above this, don’t engage with her or she will twist this to suit her own story. I know. My estD was similar. Just get on with your life and show her that her efforts are not hitting home.
Wishing you all the best.
🌹🙏🏾

Having read your last post Debbie, I wonder if your D was looking for a reason to turn against your H and you inadvertently gave her one, when you talked about the stress that having a kitchen extension brings.

From what you've said, accusing him of domestic abuse was a huge leap when you were simply letting off steam because of your own frustration and stress.

How did your other D react to your H's comments when you were all together for Christmas? As you haven't said that she was also offended, it does look as if once again, your ED was looking for reasons to complain about him. Not the right thing for him to have said but your ED telling you to choose between him and her is just ridiculous!!!

If she feels so strongly against your H, she doesn't have to see him does she. I appreciate it could be awkward for you to see her and her family without him, but that IMO would be a far better and more mature approach than your D estranging you, and stopping her children from having any contact with their GM.

It must be so difficult trying not to say the wrong thing about food when you're with someone with anorexia and your ED should have realised that your remark about the pizza was said in all innocence, and rather than making a big deal out of it which wouldn't have helped your GD, she should have calmly explained this.

So when you were needed to help out with child care while she was working and the children were ill and cooked, sewed, crocheted and entertained them, your D's dislike of your H wasn't an issue then .

It does look as if your ED's troubled teens are present in her life now, and while I understand your need to be there for her because things don't appear to be going well (something we can all identify with), there's nothing you can do.

FWIW I think your decision not to send cards or gifts is the right one, as is putting money away that hopefully one day you'll be able to give them in person.

We all live with the cloud that estrangement brings and many of us find that with time, its presence from day to day becomes less intrusive but regardless of how long we've been estranged, there are and I guess will always be times when that cloud casts a shadow over us, but we've also learned that eventually it passes and in the meantime we have one another here, to help get us through .

Allsorts

Like you Babs, I regret those wasted tears, whilst they cared nothing, Whiff had the right attitude, but we are all different, I tend to overthink and blame myself. I saw her car the other day, recognised number plate, not car, my stomach churned but i didn't dwell on it. Eventually we all come to the point of acceptance and concentrate on those we do have,

Indeed Allsorts. I imagine how upsetting it must have been to see her car, we don’t live anywhere near our estD so won’t ever see her but sometimes when we go into London or other towns/cities I imagine I see her in a crowd and my heart lurches but then it just turns out to be somebody else.
The way I see it is very much like my old mum would say when hearing of a friend or relative suffering ‘is her cross to bear’, am not at all religious but believe we all have our own individual suffering, ours is estrangement, and we have to accommodate that pain and move round it in order to enjoy what time we have left.
🌹❤️

Like you Babs, I regret those wasted tears, whilst they cared nothing, Whiff had the right attitude, but we are all different, I tend to overthink and blame myself. I saw her car the other day, recognised number plate, not car, my stomach churned but i didn't dwell on it. Eventually we all come to the point of acceptance and concentrate on those we do have,

Yogin yes, she is in charge - Cally that is. They both like to express their feelings so I assume they are happy.

I am thinking about my estDS because it’s this time of year, but I keep it to myself, and try to portray a happy facade.

I don’t think about the estrangement nor him etc, every day any more.

It’s sort of a relief not to, if you my fellow estrangees understand.

Yoginimeisje

Whiff they apologised re losing all my docs & cert. and said they have taking measures for it not to happen again
Enjoy your lunch with your GN friends and keep up your fitness classes, so important to do.

I'm going to the theatre with my sister today, Faulty Towers & then a nice meal in an Italian restaurant, so need to get off and get ready

Have a great time Yogi. Should be a hoot 🤩

Thanks Whiff for telling your story too. I am so sorry to hear how difficult it has been for you. In fact, thanks to the five of you who have responded to me. It has really helped me to make some decisions.
My story starts two and a half years ago when we were having a kitchen extension. As you can imagine, it is very stressful living in the chaos of building and my husband (not my daughters father) was not coping well and we had a lot of arguments about silly stuff like moving a sideboard! I got stressed too with his moods and I confided in my eldest daughter about it. The biggest mistake I ever made, as despite knowing him for 10 years, she then decided that she didn’t like him. I tried to tell her we were just going through a bad patch but she had made her mind up and accused him of domestic abuse! We spent Christmas together two years ago but again he got a bit stressy about the chaos of my family (2 daughters, partners and 3 grandaughters), which he is not used to as he has no children and only one sister , and made a comment about how he had spent all day clearing up after them all! A bit jokey but also a bad thing to say in front of them all. So that was it, I was given an ultimatum, her or him.
I spent the next year or so trying to tell her that he isn’t as bad as she thinks and I am not being abused but this just antagonised her as she was convinced she was right. She had known him for 10 years before that, was even a bridesmaid at our wedding in 2019 and had spent short breaks with us on holiday. But there was no changing her mind. I told her I know that he is not perfect - indeed a grumpy old man sometimes - and I would not choose between them and couldn’t see why I should have to.
Another mistake I made was regarding my youngest GD when she was suffering from anorexia nervosa. I said a few things by mistake. E.g. she was on the road to recovery and my estD gave me some money to take my two GDs out for lunch. When the pizza arrived, I stupidly said ‘wow that’s a big pizza, shall we share it?’ This apparently was enough to trigger my GD into a melt down at home later. All my fault of course! She may have also cut herself as that’s what she was doing when she got anxious 🙁
A year ago I approached her husband, my son in law, to ask if we could talk privately on the phone about the situation and asked whether we could all go on the family Christmas walk together. He said no, she would not tolerate him on the walk, even though there would have been about 20 of us. I said to him that I thought she was stubborn and had overreacted. Little did I know at the time that she had heard every word of our conversation - my SOL had set me up. She was furious and that made it final and she said I was not to contact them again.
I heard in May that my 17 year old grandaughter had performed in a theatre and I sent her a text to say how proud of her I was. I had also been sending them pocket money. My GD didn’t reply but my daughter did with another abusive, unkind message saying again not to contact them saying we don’t want your money or messages and saying that I had now spoilt what was a lovely memory for them. She accused me of not being there for her girls, which is a lie. The last time I saw them was to take them out for ice cream while their dad took their cat to be put down. We all cried and I truly believe I was there for them, and always have been. I looked after them while their mum went to work, during Covid and when they were off school (a lot). I did cooking, sewing, knitting, crocheting and played with them a lot.
So basically, each time I have reached out, I have been shot down in flames.
My estD was very troubled during her teens and now her own daughters are going through similar troubles. I hear that her marriage is also now in difficulty. I should be the person who supports her!
I will let my estD go on the walk this year, but only so that my GD’s can all be together - I’m not doing it for my estD. I think my wider family will make decisions about how to deal with this the following year.
I won’t send them any Christmas presents or cards. But I will put money in an account for my GDs and hopefully one day, I will be able to give it to them. My eldest GD wants to go to Uni next Sept and I am sure she will be glad of it then - she will be 18 by then too.
As for me. You are all right. I need to make a good life for myself, not that it’s bad, just this cloud hanging over me. I will do more to keep me busy and try new things. Lots of new years resolutions for me!

Oh Whiff, I just came up for air, you are such a busy bee can’t believe how much you do everyday. I have every faith that your DH would have read your son the riot act but a part of me is glad he didn’t live to go through the estrangement. Am really glad my parents didn’t live long enough to witness what my eldest daughter did to us.
We only stopped sending things for our GCs last year when a cousin told us she was probably binning it all. Wish we had acted sooner.
@Debbie is so hard when those we love so deeply respond with such hatred and anger.
Be sure not to try to reason with this, keep your distance, ignore her behaviour and get on with your life as best you can. We wasted so much time agonising and trying to find a way of reaching out to our estranged daughter when she was openly abusing us. Time we won’t get back and now with my DH disabled by a stroke and bleeds on the brain I regret that wasted time. As we get older life really is short and none of us know what lurks round the corner. So be sure to prioritise your own well-being and peace of mind.
Take care 🙏🏾🌹

Whiff they apologised re losing all my docs & cert. and said they have taking measures for it not to happen again
Enjoy your lunch with your GN friends and keep up your fitness classes, so important to do.

I'm going to the theatre with my sister today, Faulty Towers & then a nice meal in an Italian restaurant, so need to get off and get ready

Whiff Awful your gifts coming back all screwed up and with fingernail marks!

I sent my estD a book I had read about estrangement, it was a novel, but sooo sad, the grandad sat with a shotgun in the garage after he had made a red buggy type pull-along for his GS that he had been very very close to, he took it to his school but was marched out without giving it to his GS. His wife [the grandma] found him just in time. It was certainly written by someone that understood estrangement. Anyway, I got the book sent by Amazon to their house, came home from work to find it ripped up on my driveway, you could feel the hate emanating from it, without doubt torn up by him [D husband].

Like you Whiff my estD & GC are not in my will.

Oh dear this is turning into a monster ramble really must read and reply each day . But this week is hectic Monday sit fit , Tuesday move or lose it , yesterday GP,charity shop to take in things I had made for them to sell and the thing for the children's quiz,then went to cafe for breakfast as I had to be out at 7.30am and it was very frosty . After that went to the bank and finally got home 5 hours later frozen 🥶. Today hair cut then tonight Sir Stephen Hough playing Rachmaninov at the Phil , tomorrow lunch with GN friend , Saturday going to the church Christmas fair . Sunday depending on what the boys have on my daughter and boys coming . Think it's only 4 things planned for next week but have to check my calendar.

Smiles I am so glad you have Mr S. If my husband was still alive I know he would have been broken hearted but he would have confronted our son but I don't think it would have changed anything . My daughter in law was jealous of my husband and my son's love for him even though he had been dead a year before they meet. Otherwise why did she write on Reddit FIL died to get away from MIL. That killed any love I had for her.

I hated the pain my in laws caused my husband but he didn't like them but loved them . I hated the pair of them and hated my mother in law for 40 years but still looked after her for 11 years after my husband died because she was still my mother in law and the children's nan . Even though she denied she every had a son or 2 grandchildren. But I made sure everyone knew she lied. And refused to go too their weddings. Both the kids kept in touch with her and visited her once a year. In a way I supposed it was my revenge on how she treated us. But she always put me down as next if kin because she knew I wouldn't abandon her unlike her brother who turned up once she was dead.

You and Mr S have a wonderful life
together in your lovely home can't believe it's a year since you moved plus your dogs . Sorry you are still not recovered but I know up here there are a lot of things going around and it's not just knocking us older ones but younger families as well. The strain of covid going round is knocking people about for 2-3 weeks . Glad I paid for the jab if I get it hopefully I won't be to bad .

Have to finish as I need to get up as early hair appointment. But I will be back you have been warned 🤣🤣🤣

Posted that incase I lost it as usual ramble on . Better read what everyone else has been up to .

Yogin I hope you managed to get all the forms filled in . Why didn't they have a back up system in place so if anything crash they didn't lose members information. I would have thought all organisations would have back up systems . I know when M&S got attacked they still had everyone's details who had their app I just had to change my password . Sorry you lost information when your laptop crashed . Hope you are still able to do all the classes you did and got your renewal.

I know both my exercise teachers had to have insurances but they don't have to have music licences . My sit fit teacher just does 2 classes on a Monday as she works the rest of the week she's 63 . But had to fill in 2 forms when I joined and have fitness test.
My move it or lose it teacher is part of a large organisation and it's her full time job. She was a physio for 30 years abroad but came back to look after her mom . She's 60 and runs 7 classes a week. She has to go too meeting with management every few months. Had to have training how they do things . More insurances than my sit fit teacher as she represents the move it or lose group . Had to fill in forms to join and fitness test .

But I love both classes and go every week it doesn't matter how much pain I am in or how bad my mobility is I still go . As they are keeping me fit and because we do few of the same exercises but different ones in each class I moved every bit of my body. Plus it's fun and a great social event . We encourage eachother and we can see eachother improve .

Yogin what you do is very important for people to keep doing what they want . The age range in my sit fit class is mid 50's to nearly 90 . Move it or lose it mid 50's and oldest member is 97 this year. She couldn't stand up to do any of the exercises but after a couple of months she does now .

Both teachers do what you no doubt do and that is tell us how much we have improved. But it's always the same with both classes asked if anyone has any injuries . Do warm up and cool down exercises. Plus different moves for some of the exercises if you can't do them but still get the same benefit .

My daughter does combat training one day a week and gym work on the machines another day. Plus any extra classes like yoga with her old teacher and class mates. Because most of the classes she went to where she took her sons until they started school. The mom's have all kept in touch and have girlie nights out her words not mine. Every few months .

My daughter says it lovely going to classes that are child free. She joined a gym to do the classes .

Glad you and Babs got together I know how much you enjoy eachothers company.

Meeting for the third time a GN member who is now a friend . Can't remember which thread we meet on . But she lives in a town not far from me . Having lunch at the same restaurant we went to last time she had never been but my daughter took me for lunch when it was my birthday and I loved . Luckily she did to and we get on like a house on fire .

Funny how meeting people in person they are just like you expected. So far meet 3 from GN and the friend I am meeting been in contact with another GN but never met . She asked if she could tell her about me so said yes . She lives in another town no far from me in the opposite direction. So we are all meeting for lunch at hotel which is easy to get too for us all next month . As usual I booked everything . Once we set dates I book as they both understand my planning and routine life 😁.

Behind as usual lately.
Welcome Debbie it takes courage to admit you are estranged. I still remember how difficult it was for me 5 years ago . Your grandchildren are of an age they can make their own decisions. Yes your daughter may have poisoned them against you . That's something you will never know unless they reach out to you. You mentioned presents . I don't want what happened to me happen to you as it hurt and angered me so much .
In my son's email he sent me dumping me 4 days after my birthday in 2020.he did end by saying he didn't like me but loved me and said give him time. Which I now know was a lie. Last time I saw his 2 eldest they where 4&2 March 2020 . I had seen them every week for 7 months then covid hit .

Saw my son on my birthday had lovely time he even talked about putting paving down to make the garden safer for me . But said with work the family and they were expecting another son end July I would get someone in to do it. Because of covid rules we sat apart and didn't hug or kiss.

As he said give him time I did . August 2020 was his 33rd and second son's 3rd birthday. So I knew the baby would have been born . I sent 3 presents for the baby ,birth card ,birthdays cards and a letter in my sons card with a cheque . Didn't mention the email just hoped mother and baby were well and everyone else. He knew they had found a problem with my heart so told him what was wrong. And explained how the cheque was to be spilt some money for my eldest grandson as I always gave to siblings when new baby arrives.

Next day everything arrived back all unopened the babies presents look like someone I suspect my daughter in law had a hissy fit as they were crushed you could see finger marks in the paper. Luckily they where soft just clothes and cuddly toy.
Had written letter from my son saying he didn't want my manipulation and vindictive behaviour anywhere near him or his family ever again .. Zero contact. Still remember it exactly.

I have never been manipulative or vindictive in my life .

My daughter was here when it arrived with her eldest and pregnant with my youngest grandson. I gave her the presents to donate to a charity that helps new parents .

And that was it . I couldn't let my grandson see nannie hurt but after they left broke down . But as much as what my son and daughter in law did doesn't come close to the heart break I still feel over my husband dieing .

The hardest thing was for me realising my son is a cruel coward as he should have told me to my face .
This thread saved me . You have shown more courage than I did . I found this thread but it took months of sending Smiles PMs before I could post on here and not shut up since 😁.

It's thanks to Smiles,Yogin, Allsorts and other long timers that helped and realise I wasn't alone. Thankfully estranged isn't the taboo subject it was 5 years ago . And for the long timers 13+ years it must have been so hard for them but they are still here helping me and everyone else .

Your daughter like my son made his choice . My son sent my daughter an email as well but she didn't care what I didn't know was they only saw or spoke to eachother when I was with them all. My son not only estranged me but all our side of the family. He has hurt my brother very much and at the time he wanted to go round and in his words sort him out and bitch slap that wife if his . But I told no it was his choice.

When the children were naughty when young there where consequences. It was a very hard decision but I changed my will and made my daughter sole heir and took out both powers of attorney at the same time as it was cheaper . My daughter and son in law are my attorneys I trust my son in law the same as my daughter . Some might say that I am being vindictive doing that . My son wrote vile things about me ,re wrote family history and assumed I took certain actions which I did not .

My lovely son in law said he knew that something had been wrong for years but didn't want to hurt me . And that's the difference my son and daughter in law did everything to hurt me .

Two years ago I decided to stop hoping he would contact me and been happier since making that decision. But I can never forgive or forget what he and my daughter in law have done . I could never trust him again . And we are strangers . He is not the kind loving son I knew but I am not the same mom he knew . I have zero tolerance for bad behaviour.

I know I have bored everyone else with this Debbie but I wanted you to see you are braver than me . It's only 2 years for you and that's so hard . Took me 3 years to let go of hope . So glad I did .

If my son thought to destroy he's sadly wrong . I am living my life to the full like my husband wanted for me. Since I moved here 6 years ago to be closer to the family I have a life after he died I only existed had no life . But the life I lead isn't dependent on the family . I have made a life for myself I am fiercely independent. My daughter laughs I have a better social life than she does.

Morning all

Bright & sunny but very cold!

Got my creditsSmiles thanks for asking but not before someone emailed asking where 1&2 sessions are, as they had only received session 3! .

Welcome Debbie you're in the right place for advice and a shoulder to cry/lean on. So sorry to read about your estrangement, such a horrible thing to do to a loving mother.
Each estrangement is different and therefore different things work or not for that person. It does affect the whole family. My estD cut out all the females [that's why we think it was from her H] so my sister & sister-in-law, my DD, my son was cut out when he came back to live with me some years after.

I sent cards, till they moved & then put them in a gift bag with presents from the first Xmas & birthdays. I opened bank acc. for them and put money in for Xmas & birthdays after that. After 6yrs just stopped with everything as I needed to move on and stop grieving for them. Now 13yrs last Nov 16th.

You've already received good advice on here from long time posters but at the end of the day you have to do what's best for you. I really hope you find a way to heal this rift and get back with your D&GC. Best of luck xx

As for meeting up with your siblings for your traditional Xmas walk, you go, you come first and it was your D who did the rotten deed so it's her that should miss out, not you.

TBH that's how I'd feel Allsorts especially at the expense of my sibling missing out.

Your daughter estranged you. If I were a sibling I would not want her there after hurting you so much.

Estrangement is like throwing a stone into a still pond Debbie, the ripples reach outward affecting for more than the area where the stone hit.

If your D feels she can't engage in a family activity because you'll be there, then she'll have to miss out wont she. She estranged you and there's no reason why you should sacrifice time with your own siblings because she feels uncomfortable, so I hope you'll tell your brothers and sisters that you will be taking part.

Finding it difficult to be involved with wider family because you've estranged your parent(s) is something that should be thought about by the EAC when they decide to estrange. It's a bit late to think about it afterwards.

Your siblings keeping in touch with their niece and her children really shouldn't be at the expense of their relationship with you which may well be why they're finding this difficult.

It's very hard for the siblings of those who have estranged because they can see how hurt their parents are because of what's happened.

We told our son that we hoped he would stay in touch with his brother and made the decision a few years ago to tell him we didn't want to discuss his brother or our GC. He understood our reasons and I think that it's been to a certain extent a relief for him as much as it's been for us.

We were of course happy for him to talk about it to begin with as this helped him to work through his own issues, but it got to the point where were simply going over the same old ground and reopening wounds we were desperate to heal. That was when we no longer felt able to continue.