I have been having issues with my daughter ever since her husband left her. And she has a best friend, since high school, who claims she was abused. I don't know if that is true or not, but, seems my daughter talks a lot about and has now claimed she was an abused child.
She even is starting to make my grandkids think I am not safe in some way or was a bad parent/grandparent. They told me and it suck that the oldest one seems to believe it. The youngest told me she doesn't believe it.
Anyway, this is complete fabrication and I am thought maybe the best friend has been projecting her childhood onto my daughter.
My confusion is, when I offered to discuss the alledged abuse, she got mad that I didn't believe or acknowledge she was abused.
I went mad trying to get just ONE example. Just ONE. A long message conversation with me offering to talk in person or at least give one example on the messages.
She kept ranting about me and how I act, called me psychotic if I am called out on something.
Well, I have recently been deciding when she does say something very untrue to me, I don't agree with her. I've always been more of a silent person when attacked, will just leave the room, ignore it, etc. but lately I decided to at least basically defend myself like most people would.
Not arguing, just saying yeah no that's not true kinda thing. No big deal. That's now psychotic in her view.
Anyway my question is, has anyone here had an experience that when you ask about abuse, with the tone of if I did something I will apologize kinda thing, that then the adult child avoids, attacks and basically never tell you what you did?
It's completely maddening. You feel so hurt yet you are trying to understand by getting an answer. It's looney.
So finally, she mentioned children need to feel safe. I had a husband who yelled at me all the time. I thought ok, so maybe she was scared of him?
That's reasonable I think with a young child. But that's not abuse if I didn't know she was scared at times. Most the time she was always smiling. I can't read minds.
I told her if just once she told me she was scared, I may have tried to help her. But not knowing her feelings isn't abuse, it's lack of knowledge.
No matter, I told her I had no idea, that what she said was valid. Yet she still insisted she was abused and she said I won't accept it.
Again, how can you accept what exactly?
Don't kids know what happened?
I read about Mackalay Culkin and his story about his dad slapping him across the face and how Culkin said he had no bed to sleep on while his dad had a large comfy bed, etc.
He had examples of abuse.
What is the deal when an adult child can give no examples?
No clues? and the idea when you say you are ready to listen anyway, they don't want to talk or they avoid/distract with their opinions of your behaviors rather than on the subject of the abuse?
It got to the point of so many horrid accusations of abuse, again, using only the word abuse, even saying I do it with my grandchildren (too many hugs? idk?)
Now I am worried this will end badly. I did acknowledge her fear as a kid. But this is kinda nuts. Anyone who knows what this is, give me a clue.
I feel like the best friend projected so much of her own childhood now that my daughter thinks it's hers. I mean, she's known the friend for decades but seems now that her husband took off on her leaving her a single mom with 2 kids, it seems now something is seriously wrong. A couple of years ago, when her husband first left, she talked alot about her friend helping abused kids, and there was a predator defense protocol that the friend told her about for kids.
She used it one day to throw me out after I teared up a little when she yelled at me.
I never asked her why she used that. But she's a grown adult.
It's mental.
Does anyone know what this is?
You're the one who appears to be confused Crossstichfan. When you said you had better things to do, it was about this particular thread. My response about you still reading and posting was also about this particular thread and not GN in general.
Having read your last posts, I agree with those who say maybe some space and time are the best thing. You are totally unwilling to admit even the possibility that your daughter may have a point, so I cannot see any way forward for that relationship. I think the best thing you can do now is give her and her children some space.
Sago
I was an abused child, my late mother was a narcissist and denied I had ever been abused, she told people I was a liar.
So I was never believed.
When I reached adulthood she tried to control and abuse me but I was getting wise to the NPD.
She could no longer win so she told people I abused her!
There is always two sides to the story.
Sorry that happened to you. I never abused my daughter, if you read it all, it was me who got all the verbal abuse, the putdowns, the accusation's, the scapegoating from my husband who now I realize (didn't back then) that he was doing everything they say narcissists do.
Unfortunately, somehow the victim (me) became the cause? I guess that's also part of living with a narcissist.
I mean, I've always been a bit dense. A total stranger walked up to me at a neighbors get together and asked if that man was my husband (he pointed at my husband across the room).
I said yes, and he looked at me and said well, he certainly thinks highly of himself!
I just stood there with my mouth open. He walked away and deep down I knew he spoke truth but I just didn't know what it really meant until later in my life.
Smileless2012
^I have better things to do^ so why are you still reading and posting Crossstichfan?
I think you have got confused. I am on here because I like Gransnet, not specifically to read posts that, to me, seem rather convoluted.
It said nothing about having better things to do than be on Gransnet, but referred specifically to the long involved and repetitive post that went nowhere.
I was an abused child, my late mother was a narcissist and denied I had ever been abused, she told people I was a liar.
So I was never believed.
When I reached adulthood she tried to control and abuse me but I was getting wise to the NPD.
She could no longer win so she told people I abused her!
There is always two sides to the story.
MarieElla
So, still ignoring my suggestion OP.
Why?
Could it be that your daughter may have a different version?
Sorry, did not mean to ignore exactly. Because see, I've laid this out to her already, all the stuff here.
And I got called paranoid, accusatory, she even threw in I attacked her, her friends (notice the plural, but I've never had one issue with any of her other friends, at all in fact they are nice people) and even attacked the grandkids....total fabrication ........as I would never blame them for one adverse action, ever, because I know where the ideas/instructions are coming from.
So showing her all this would be completely, utterly a waste. And I'm so tired of engaging with her, as no matter what my feelings are and what she's done, she will divert it back to me, her childhood or even my mother's personality, oddly because I've always taken after my dad.
But why not? Throw the book at me for what she's done, what her husband did, my husband did, etc....
BlueBelle
This is only a thought starfire could it be that the more you try to force your grandson to look at you, speak to you etc etc it’s making him uncomfortable and maybe he’s going home and saying Nans behaving weird she said I ve got to look her in the eye, then his mum will say well you don’t need to do that, and so it goes on …eight is an age when they are heading up to want to prove a point The whole scenarios is getting weirder and you re getting more upset You must let it all rest and die down. Surely that would be the best way. please don’t take this the wrong way I m being honest as I see it. You are acting like a victim…. ‘poor me, no one likes me’ It’s not attractive or a good role model for your lad
Give it all a rest when the lad comes over do something nice with him, take him to the park, out on his bike or whatever he likes doing, have a game of football with him in the garden go to the pool, but do some normal fun stuff and stop the control trying to make him like you, look at you, talk to you …….that’s control. I understand where it comes from you feel out of control and it’s scary but calm down, relax and hopefully it will improve
Thank you for advice. I don't want to control what he does but he is doing things so uncharacteristic since all the talk from his mom, like not looking at me while talking; avoidance it what it is.
I simply pointed it out to him, I didn't tell him he had to look at me, I said hey, are you talking to me because you are looking somewhere else, so I wasn't sure........
He just said oh, yeah, I was and looked at me. I was smiling, too, didn't want him to feel bad about it. Because after all, it's not his fault.
I wish I could do nice things with him. My daughter limits time and if I am one minute away from her and granddaughter, she comes running into the room to see what is going on.
I have toys in the room and sometimes he goes in looking for stuff, which is also some of it is out of reach, so I go in to see and like I said, not much time passes before she comes in saying what's going on??
He's wanted to stay in the room to play (moving a lot of toys to the living area is tedious) but she insists he cannot. I think she wants to make sure I don't have any real time with him.
My daughter has insisted we play in front of her, in the living area, even when my granddaughter decides to join us.
She does not allow me any time alone with him to do anything, except when the weather is good and we go outside, she doesn't usually follow all the time , instead will stay inside to crochet or play a video game with my son.
Since her husband left she became very controlling of how much time and where I am allowed to interact with my grandson.
Also, even up to a couple months ago, he would ask me to play with him, now suddenly he asks his sister and when she says no, he doesn't ask me and starts to play on his own. One time when she said yes, he said I couldn't play at all with them.
Again, this is a stark difference in a short time. This last couple months I found out my daughter has been saying I don't allow her to buy him Christmas gifts because she thinks I bought too much or she doesn't know what I bought so she can't decide.
She has not asked me once about what I bought this year or how much. I actually hadn't bought alot this year, as kids get older they already have a lot anyway. In the past I did buy a lot but back then she didn't seem to care about it other than the first Christmas after the breakup she complained.
After that, nothing. Now she actually demonized and degraded my gift giving to him.
She rewards him for good behavior at school with toys all the time...no wonder she comes up short with ideas at Christmas and of course I cannot give him a toy for anything in between.
Controlling gift giving, controlling the time with grandkids, I looked up a couple things and those are hallmark in Grandparent Alienation.
So, still ignoring my suggestion OP.
Why?
Could it be that your daughter may have a different version?
Smileless2012
What do you mean by caught posting under a completely different name? Sometimes posters leave GN and when they come back are unable to use the name they had before.
Providing this isn't done because they were banned, as far as I'm aware this is allowed.
Yes, thank you. I was not banned. I did leave for awhile.
I really think it would help to show your daughter this thread OP.
Then she could see how you see the situation from your side.
I have better things to do so why are you still reading and posting Crossstichfan?
Smileless2012
Of course GN and especially the estrangement forum is the place for anyone to come to when they're struggling with family problems Crossstitchfan.
No one is forcing you or anyone else to read this thread so why not leave it to those who are happy to respond and try to help the OP?
But she refuses to be helped! That is so frustrating and makes me wonder why I am wasting my precious time on her when she doesn’t want to hear anything she hasn’t come up with herself! But if you want to waste your time flogging a dead horse, then good for you! I have better things to do!
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BlueBelle eight is an age when they are heading up to want to prove a point. I agree, eights can be difficult, perhaps wait quietly.
This is only a thought starfire could it be that the more you try to force your grandson to look at you, speak to you etc etc it’s making him uncomfortable and maybe he’s going home and saying Nans behaving weird she said I ve got to look her in the eye, then his mum will say well you don’t need to do that, and so it goes on …eight is an age when they are heading up to want to prove a point The whole scenarios is getting weirder and you re getting more upset You must let it all rest and die down. Surely that would be the best way. please don’t take this the wrong way I m being honest as I see it. You are acting like a victim…. ‘poor me, no one likes me’ It’s not attractive or a good role model for your lad
Give it all a rest when the lad comes over do something nice with him, take him to the park, out on his bike or whatever he likes doing, have a game of football with him in the garden go to the pool, but do some normal fun stuff and stop the control trying to make him like you, look at you, talk to you …….that’s control. I understand where it comes from you feel out of control and it’s scary but calm down, relax and hopefully it will improve
Of course GN and especially the estrangement forum is the place for anyone to come to when they're struggling with family problems Crossstitchfan.
No one is forcing you or anyone else to read this thread so why not leave it to those who are happy to respond and try to help the OP?
'So, not only do people seem to want me not to be loved, if I am, then it must be stopped, but also, I am always like Smileless2012 said, the scapegoat when other family in my life misbehave.'
Where did this come from?
I can't see that anyone has said you shouldn't be loved, but refusing to take on board anything that your daughter has said, or admit your failings in not protecting her from abuse, will not repair the relationship.
Also, she isn't poisoning her son against you, she is protecting him from someone who didn't protect her. The best way to repair this relationship is to seek counselling of your own, and have an open and honest conversation with your daughter where you are not defensive, admit the harm she has been caused, and your part in it, and seek forgiveness.
Sorry InRainbows - that last message wasn’t specifically for you!
You said you were stepping away. I did too, but I went back to see how things had transpired and, finding nothing had changed, got sucked back in again. To be honest, I have never read posts like it!
Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.
I agree NotSpaghetti. It's better to interact with him on his terms Starfire.
looking where he was looking, positioning my face in his line of sight
I think this is possibly making him uncomfortable?
What do you mean by caught posting under a completely different name? Sometimes posters leave GN and when they come back are unable to use the name they had before.
Providing this isn't done because they were banned, as far as I'm aware this is allowed.
Why doesn't that surprise me.
Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.
So, not only do people seem to want me not to be loved, if I am, then it must be stopped, but also, I am always like Smileless2012 said, the scapegoat when other family in my life misbehave.
This is very, very depressing to me. Makes me wonder why I wanted to have a family to start with, what's the point?
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