Son is pushing us away

Someone else mentioned that there is nothing to stop son and the children going alone and leaving DIL to look after the dog and do whatever else she had planned to do.

As someone plagued by similar family tensions I am now questioning whether to book a similar holiday for a significant birthday next year. It was tense enough having them here for Christmas... sometimes there is no point in flogging a dead horse. I might just book a place and go away with friends instead...

It’s obvious the OP and her dil don’t get on, so perhaps the thought of a whole weekend (Friday to Monday?) together just got too much for them to face as it got closer. I think I can understand that.

A pity they couldn’t just come for the day or just one special dinner.Too late to suggest that?

I read her "thoughtful post" differently. I suspect from her own words, OP is judging dil, and pushed "Happy Family Holiday" which didn't make outsiders happy at all

Based on what? .

Smileless2012

No Astitchintime the OP's son, wife and children were supposed to be going which is why a 3 bedroom apartment was booked and paid for, by the OP and her husband.

Her d.i.l. knowing that this was booked arranged to help with a school event so she couldn't go and now they're unable to find someone to look after the dog, despite having known about the event since last August!!!

So, Smileless, who was looking after the dog originally? That’s what was confusing me.
Sounds like they never intended going in the first place, regardless of who was responsible ultimately for that decision

Who was looking after the dog originally? has that arrangement fallen through? otherwise why has he made that one of the issues about coming? The fact that his wife is helping out at a school activity are the children involved in that? Perhaps you could text and say you are sorry they are unable to join you all as it would have been lovely to see them all but perhaps they could join you for lunch or a walk on the other day leave the ball in their court and communication lines open.

Madgran77

*Norah Why is dil always assumed at fault? Perhaps self reflection would help solve this simple problem?*

In this particular case the OP has described quite clearly the situation including an unhappy marriage that her son confided to her and other events that have suggested to her that her DiL doesnt want to engage etc

Assumptions made about DiLs "always" being blamed are not relevant in this particular situation. It is clear that both are behaving badly.
- Her by arranging to help with something else on a booked date. Who else exactly is "at fault" in that one?

- Him by not either saying they didnt want to come or telling his wife her behaviour in double booking is inappropriate and to sort it

On the basis of her very thoughtful honest and reasoned posts just exactly what is the OP supposed to be "self reflecting" on?

I read her "thoughtful post" differently. I suspect from her own words, OP is judging dil, and pushed "Happy Family Holiday" which didn't make outsiders happy at all.

Or her son could have a proper discussion about why he doesn't want to come if that is the case.

He might be making his own decisions but not exactly in an adult way!

Norah Why is dil always assumed at fault? Perhaps self reflection would help solve this simple problem?

In this particular case the OP has described quite clearly the situation including an unhappy marriage that her son confided to her and other events that have suggested to her that her DiL doesnt want to engage etc

Assumptions made about DiLs "always" being blamed are not relevant in this particular situation. It is clear that both are behaving badly.
- Her by arranging to help with something else on a booked date. Who else exactly is "at fault" in that one?

- Him by not either saying they didnt want to come or telling his wife her behaviour in double booking is inappropriate and to sort it

On the basis of her very thoughtful honest and reasoned posts just exactly what is the OP supposed to be "self reflecting" on?

Hithere

"He always makes an excuse (he hasn’t come to the last two christenings). "

This is your answer. Do not blame your dil.
He is an adult making his own decisions

Yes, son is making his own decisions.

OP doesn't like the timing and money wasted.

Gran22boys

Your son is afraid of her and knows you know it. He sounds depressed. Nothing is worse than forced social situations. Maybe he just agreed to it because he knew it was what you wanted. His being rude was the only way he could deal with it at the time. His wife probably doesn’t want to play happy families. I cannot think of anything worse than having a holiday with lots of relatives. You are treating them as if they were young children.

This was not an ordinary holiday. It was a one off weekend to celebrate a significant birthday. Of course OP wants all of her family to be there. It really is not unreasonable to want your family to join you to mark milestone birthdays and anniversaries. OP chose a location that would be convenient and gave everyone plenty of notice but DIL went ahead and planned something else for that weekend. I would have been very hurt and very angry

Madgran77

*Norah Cutting losses with dil, not son. OP will always love and adore her son.*

But his behaviour in dealing with this suggests that cutting losses with DiL coukd easily become Estrangement from her son! Relationships are not simplistic

Why is dil always assumed at fault?

Perhaps self reflection would help solve this simple problem?

I know how you feel I’ve three sons but the middle one makes very little effort. I’ve just pushed it to the back of my mind he didn’t even turn up for my retirement presentation which he was invited too.

It always happens Madgran when a m.i.l. is talking about problems with her son and thinks her d.i.l. might be responsible.

You're right Fallingstar. It's awful being estranged from our son and only GC but at least we don't have that to put up with.

Gran22boys You are treating them as if they were young children

In what way?

THEY are behaving like young children by not just saying if they dont want to come! If his wife doesnt want to go she can just say so!!
Lots of families go on holiday together and enjoy it. Offering it as an option to ones adult children is not " treating them as young children"

Norah Cutting losses with dil, not son. OP will always love and adore her son.

But his behaviour in dealing with this suggests that cutting losses with DiL coukd easily become Estrangement from her son! Relationships are not simplistic

Your son is afraid of her and knows you know it. He sounds depressed. Nothing is worse than forced social situations. Maybe he just agreed to it because he knew it was what you wanted. His being rude was the only way he could deal with it at the time. His wife probably doesn’t want to play happy families. I cannot think of anything worse than having a holiday with lots of relatives. You are treating them as if they were young children.

Madgran77

*Norah Them not coming along is clearly not OPs fault, however apart from the financial aspect it's not clear not why OP desires a holiday with dil..Cutting losses springs to mind.*

Well this appalling behaviour might well make the OP "cut her losses"!

But trying to maintain a relationship with your ACs partner is a normal process in family relationships and frankly AC partners have some responsibility for that if they really care about the person they presumably love as they married them!

And cutting losses actually means walking away from a son you love (despite his behaviours) who you know is in an unhappy marriage and are worried about. Being quietly available seems more appropriate as a parent frankly as the son is not actually cutting off completely. If he wants to estrange he needs to say so. But he isnt! And if he doesnt want to he needs to carry on with his parents whilst letting his wife make her choices (but not let her scupper plans by making arrangements to help with something on a previously arranged weekend away)

And the OP is hurting understandably.

Susie is absolutely making the right decision by going away with her other AC and watching and waiting

Of course the holiday should continue with other AC.

Cutting losses with dil, not son. OP will always love and adore her son.

I agree falling star

Nothing the OP says has suggested pressure being put on. Of course they could have just said No! But instead the DiL agrees to do something that weekend instead ...rather than just say "No thanks". Honestly, just WHY is Susie at fault here?

OP is not at fault for son and dil change of plans. However, OP and other family members judgement of dil may be apparent (even I can read judgement), making for uncomfortable holiday to avoid.

Smileless2012

^Honestly, just WHY is Susie at fault here?^ because she's the m.i.l. Madgran.

So are a lot of posters on here! Which is why I dont understand the level of assumptions being made

Norah Them not coming along is clearly not OPs fault, however apart from the financial aspect it's not clear not why OP desires a holiday with dil..Cutting losses springs to mind.

Well this appalling behaviour might well make the OP "cut her losses"!

But trying to maintain a relationship with your ACs partner is a normal process in family relationships and frankly AC partners have some responsibility for that if they really care about the person they presumably love as they married them!

And cutting losses actually means walking away from a son you love (despite his behaviours) who you know is in an unhappy marriage and are worried about. Being quietly available seems more appropriate as a parent frankly as the son is not actually cutting off completely. If he wants to estrange he needs to say so. But he isnt! And if he doesnt want to he needs to carry on with his parents whilst letting his wife make her choices (but not let her scupper plans by making arrangements to help with something on a previously arranged weekend away)

And the OP is hurting understandably.

Susie is absolutely making the right decision by going away with her other AC and watching and waiting

"He always makes an excuse (he hasn’t come to the last two christenings). "

This is your answer. Do not blame your dil.
He is an adult making his own decisions

Since joining Gransnet recently am quite astonished how parents and grandparents are regularly advised to ‘say nothing’ ‘take a back seat’ ‘be careful or you might not see your grandchildren’ . Is like we are all pussy footing round unexploded bombs, not dealing with ‘adults’ who are in some cases being rude and rather horrid to those they presumably love.
Is as if emotional blackmail is the weapon of choice with adult children and we should all enable this by just letting their rude behaviour go unchecked.
The OP and her husband have every right to feel hard done by.

Honestly, just WHY is Susie at fault here? because she's the m.i.l. Madgran.

But perhaps you should not have put pressure on him and his family to come at the onset.

What ...as in "Would you like to come on a family weekend to celebrate ....."

Nothing the OP says has suggested pressure being put on. Of course they could have just said No! But instead the DiL agrees to do something that weekend instead ...rather than just say "No thanks". Honestly, just WHY is Susie at fault here?