Struggling with estrangement from 2 adult children and dont know where to go from here.

Oh. Thanks.

I reported stephenmitchelll because it was advertising fancythat; I didn't see the other one.

And stephenmitchell1?
I didnt see that one either.

I didnt see CptnObvious post.
You mean that that poster knows you?
You dont have to say if you dont want to.

Oh my name is there by accident, that makes sense now.

In relation to ongoing relationships I agree that's why raking over the past maybe happening InRainbows.

My post in response to fancythat's was when someone decides to estrange and rather than moving on with their lives, continues to vilify not just those they've estranged but those of us who post on GN who have been estranged.

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Smileless2012

Constantly raking over the past IMO isn't healthy InRainbows especially if it prevents who ever is doing so from moving on.

I am not disputing your comment but I did not mention constantly raking over the past, I said that feelings can return. I can count myself the amount of times I have put my own feelings aside to keep the peace and realised later that it hurt me deeply and I do need to talk it through properly.

Do you think some situations where "raking over the past" is happening could be because one person isn't really listening to the other? Or saying they are sorry but behaving in the same ways? I think that could be true and understandable.

You're welcome, I hope it helps .

Smilesless2012
I couldnt have replied any better myself. Thank you, tou gor it in a nutshell.

Smileless2012.
I couldnt have replied any better myself. Thank you, you got it in a nutshell.

I m well confused I commented twice on the thread about the poster who went off with a new man at Christmas and her two sons didn’t like it she said it hadn’t lasted and was now with a different man
Where’s the rest of the thread gone ?

Sometimes a disagreement can feel resolved in the moment but upon deeper thought you realize things are still lingering.

My mom was never one to apologize about things. She always had a reason that she felt was adequate and I felt obligated to accept it because of the parent child relationship dynamic. It never felt like things were resolved even when the argument stopped. It sometimes made it worse because it felt like she was doubling down on hurtful things she would say to me by making excuses.

To her, explaining her reasoning was equivalent to apologizing or resolving the conflict. It would've made a big difference to me if she had even once said something like "I can see that my actions hurt you and I'm sorry. I am going to do better" with no excuses or justification.

I say that to people now if I'm apologizing but it was a skill I had to intentionally invest in as an adult. I recognize that these changes might be beyond my mom's ability, but the hurt still lingers from things she never truly took responsibility for. She can't handle being wrong about anything.

I'm not saying any of this is true for your situation, OP. I just wanted to demonstrate how people can "settle" conflict without actually feeling like it is resolved. I eventually stopped trying to work it out because things never got better until I cut her out.

Constantly raking over the past IMO isn't healthy InRainbows especially if it prevents who ever is doing so from moving on.

Oh that annoying, my hand slipped

Even if things seem resolved, feelings can return days, weeks and even years later. That is when I think we need to understand that, something being resolved from our point of view may not mean our loved ones are quite there yet. Sometimes people say raking over the past isn't healthy but I disagree with that. I think revisiting past hurts might go wrong and not be understood but can also lead to a healthier relationship in time.

Even should things be "resolved" feeling can return days, weeks

For me that's the million dollar question fancythat; what do they want and do they even know themselves .

I ask myself that question when ever we see posts from an EAC who remains so angry and bitter despite having estranged the parents they no longer want in their lives, to the extent that they 'attack' those of us who have also been estranged.

It could be an example of mixed messages fancythat.

It does sound like it.

I have been struggling to get my head around the concept.

So what does the person really want? Deep down?

I know they all met and discussed the Christmas when things didn't go well Smileless but it wasn't resolved as she said by a long way.
Thought that saying that to them one last time might be worth it. However you have to face the possibility that thing might not be resolved and you cannot waste the rest of your life hoping for something that won’t happen. Rebuild the life you do have, you have a man friend now and even if you go a walk each day, get a routine going, local libraries and churches have coffee mornings and meet ups, doesn't cost much, there are so many of us living alone now, many people have family living far away or have health problems and have to adapt to livingl the life we didn't plan for but can be good.

Thank you Smileless2012, you have put it in a nutshell so to speak.

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There does come a time I think when all attempts to get your AC to engage and they refuse to do so, to stop. That doesn't mean ceasing all contact but perhaps reducing the number of times you do, and keeping that 'light'.

The OP appears to have done what you suggest already Allsorts and did so that Christmas when they had a sit down discussion and aired all (their) differences.

She hadn't ceased contact with her sons but had wrongly not responded to messages and calls and chose to spend some of that Christmas with the new man in her life.

She mistakenly believed they'd achieved resolution, presumably because her sons left her with that impression. If there were still unresolved issues, her sons should have addressed those at the time. As adults if there are issues not addressed, or sufficiently addressed, they have to take responsibility for not pursuing this when as it was in this case, they had the opportunity to do so.

Parents aren't mind readers. We can only know what is and what has upset our AC if they tell us and if they don't, we can hardly be held responsible for not knowing.

We cannot rewire our brains Readheadpanda, if only we could but what we can do is reluctantly accept when we've been estranged, that the relationship is over.

Some years ago on another forum specifically for EP's, someone talked about the 'hope devil'. When things are as they are right now, hoping for change in any shape or form IMO adds to the burden of pain and overwhelming sense of loss and grief.

Think about contacting them one last time assuring them of your love and that you'll always be 'here' for them, and perhaps telling them that you wont be doing so again, respecting their decision for no contact.

You have someone new in your life so make enjoying time with them your focus. Maybe one day things will be different, but that will only happen if your sons want things to be different .

It seems it goes back to when, after 6 months alone after your breakup, you ceased contact with your sons and cut Christmas short to be with your man friend. Can you imagine how this made them feel? How that affected them.
I think you need to own it and tell them you made bad decisions at a bad time and are sorry and can you talk as you want to be part of their life so much. Then wait. I have had to acceot my d never wanting me in her life as many of us have but I tried everything and was ignored, I never and still do not know why she cut all family and a lot of her friends away. My d has her new trusted family of friends. It's her life and decision. I see her son who has severe ADHD and rages at me and her not seeing him has made it worse, but I am close to walking away from it myself as its made me unwell but I take months out when it gets really bad.

I will give you the same advice I gave my sister recently (when she asked for it of course). From what I have learned reading here and elsewhere. The estrangement didn't start when the contact stopped. You have to find the start of it, not the "end" to fix this one.

In rainbows sorry sent too soon. Its the recent things that have hurt me though. Ive tried to get them to try and resolve things, Ive sent cards, messages etc and nothing in return.