Calling all adult children

Smileless2012

For me it's important to stand up to those who deliberately come onto these threads to disrupt at best, and at worse to make false and cruel allegations about others just because they are EP's.

You call it rising to the bait stillawipp but I call it doing the right thing because silence can be viewed as condoning what's happened on this thread, even if condoning it is not what is intended.

It was more unpleasant than drama sweetpotatopie so just as well you did miss it but if you hadn't, I think you would have concluded as others have that the deleted posts were overloaded with anger and bitterness directed at people the posters don't even know.

Sometimes there IS a bad guy that's true and when there is, the anger and bitterness that's felt should be about that bad guy and not turning as has happened once again here, all parents who find themselves estranged into the bad guys.

I agree, if I creat a thread and see any bullying, cruelty, or projecting onto ECs or EPs I will always call it out

User138562

I think both parties in estrangement have things they could have done better. There's a communication breakdown and no one is without "fault" except in cases of abuse.

I raise my eyebrows at anyone who thinks they did nothing wrong when communication breaks down this badly.

I estranged my mother in 2021 and since then I've been working on my mental health. I've identified ways that I could have maintained our relationship. I just didn't have the emotional maturity, and neither did she.

Now I know how to set and maintain boundaries so I could coexist with her without allowing myself to be yanked around emotionally. If I knew in 2021 what I know now, I wouldn't have cut her off completely.

I'm not saying I regret it though, because that emotional growth was never going to happen unless I broke away.

I don't blame her like I used to. I think she did her best. I just had to do the right thing for myself and I didn't know any other way back then.

But now I've done something about my emotional maturity and she hasn't. I'm not looking to reintroduce that stress back into my life when I know she hasn't changed at all. I'm better off and it wish that weren't the case.

This is the situation I think I am in. I have done the work to be better but my mother has not changed. It's hard but I decided it was best for me to continue contact so I wasn't saddled with guilt. That's a tricky equation and for some estrangement is the better choice.

Madgran77

User *Raising a child that ends up as a gambling drug addict and burdening the other with elderly care isn't as great of a point you
think *

Hmm just a touch simplistic!

This is a disgusting statement. Addiction touches every level of society. You manage to insult those who have struggled with addiction and their parents all in one post.

NotSpaghetti

Oh Beescrete
Can we find a common purpose where we offer honest and genuine advice to each other without resorting to cruelty?

I DO hope so.
I think those of us on the "outside" truly wish you all well.

I know I've "grown" a lot as a parent.
I am not estranged (and pray never will be) but parenting is hard and we never get everything right. I know I have got some parenting wrong in the past and now my children are adults I am aware of this more acutely.
I think parents and adult children can't possibly enjoy estrangement and when it happens it's a survival mechanism.

Surely if estranged parents or children have advice - especially re prevention (without endangering anyone) - we should all be listening.

I don't think anyone enjoys estrangement, it's pain all around.

Smileless2012

If it were to have a similar OP to this one, I don't think it would make any difference unfortunately Oreo.

I unfortunately have to agree. If you are an estranged AC who wants to reconcile this forum is better than the forums only for ECs. Those are good if you are sure you want to estrange and they will offer you important and helpful support. If you are like me and waffling between estrangement and reconciliation there is no place for you in EC forums.

Same AC EC typo

Gmax3

NoMoreNarcan --- "Most people, including myself, see parents that aren't in contact with their children as a huge, glaring, red flag...."

DiamondLily --- "Not always. My two stepsons estranged DH.... Despite agreeing my late DH had been a great Dad, one estranged because we wouldn’t fund his alcohol/gambling addictions. 🤷‍♀️
The other one estranged because he considered elderly parents become an increasing burden, and didn’t want to be there.🤷‍♀️
So, no rocks on heads, no evil parent, no spouse to blame, nothing to blame but addiction and selfishness."

I love this exchange so much that I wanted to capture it for posterity.

As for the original intent of OP, to try to be compassionate and support each other, whether we are EP, EAC, or neither of these, that seems only possible for a small subset of those who post here. This topic is a hot one, and it causes many to give knee-jerk reactions. For me, I ignore the "knee-jerks" (pun intended) and focus on the compassionate ones. That's a life lesson, btw, don't you think? (Rhetorical. No reply requested.)
Hugs to those who give & need compassion!

I am quoting this specifically because I missed diamond lily's post, I don't know if they were deleted or I just didn't see them amongst the other posts. I think you bring up a major cause of estrangement that isn't well represented in these threads, addiction. While we don't have the specific statistics for estrangement I would bet addiction is in the top 5, be it parental or child.

If you shared your insight and I missed it, I am going to check back in tomorrow. I'm still battling the flu and not 💯 myself yet

Madgran that wasn't meant for you but the person you were quoting

Hope you feel better soon Beescrete .

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

stillawipp

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

It is hard to see how eg. serious financial abuse resulting in an elderly parent estranging themselves from their financially abusive AC, as being shared "fault". Ofcourse one can say that their upbringing caused the ACs behaviour but that would be a very simplistic view of what shapes a person alongside their personality.

It's good to see your post Madgran as it comes from someone who isn't estranged, demonstrating that it isn't only those who are still estranged who realise that EP's don't always have to be at fault.

stillawipp

Wow, Beescrete you’ve been busy from your sick bed! I am so impressed with your efforts to learn & understand both sides of the story. For my part, I will never believe that these things are ever 100% one party’s fault and that the other is totally blameless, but I know that others who are still estranged will oppose that view. And that’s fine, it’s just my opinion!

I think it is possible for it all to originate from one side. One person makes choices that are truly damaging to the other person, maybe it's necessary to step back. In the case of AC, not even necessarily because of how they were raised. There are always multiple other influences on their lives while young.

On the whole though, I think there is often contribution from both sides. Not to say that the other side is unreasonable in the choices that cause the other side to react badly, but they've contributed to the situation, even if it is completely justified.

Sometimes a loving parent has to estrange, in the case of financial and elderly abuse, gambling and addiction, mental health issues. What Diamond Lil described is a reason to estrange. No one should be abused. I haven't experienced it but I can see why some parents need to protect themselves. Sometimes only one is to blame, its ridiculous suggesting that
parents are responsible for life choices adult children make.
Do not judge a situation until you know the facts.

What is this post about?
All these abbreviations get on my wick.

We were estranged when my then daughter-in-law didn't want our DS to have any relationships she couldn't control (this included friendships). She controlled him by saying she would stop him seeing the children by telling the police he had hit her.
The estrangement ended when the marriage ended.
I don't agree that we were in any way to blame for what happened. Was it our fault he married a duplicitous woman?
(He is now with a wonderful woman)

Yes, apologies, of course there are exceptions to every rule, I should have been clearer in that I meant in the case of an argument or a differing of views. Abuse or true narcissism is an entirely different matter and should never have to be tolerated.

Was it our fault he married a duplicitous woman? of course not eddiecat. Thank goodness he's no longer with her; unfortunately for our ES and us, he still is.

We realised too late that his friends, some that he'd had from childhood were dropped in favour of hers, those being the only ones they socialised with. We were so close that it never occurred to us that we'd eventually be dropped too but of course it was our closeness that was the problem for her.

We do know that he told his brother he'd told her that he'd given up everything for her. So there's nothing you can do to prevent being estranged in these circumstances and as long as the influence remains, so will the estrangement and when this happens, the EP's are blameless.

It is as you say Allsorts ^ridiculous suggesting that parents are responsible for life choices adult children make^; ridiculous, tiresome and incorrect.

Smileless2012

The reason for them to lie about their observations User is because they were fed by VioletSky as part of her continued vendetta against some EP's here on GN, because she was banned for the second time.

The link you've provided is extremely offensive to some loyal and long time members of GN so I've asked GNHQ to remove it.

Such is her inability to move on, that she continues to return with different names.

I agree that that would be valuable sweetpotatopie but I think we can all see that that is never going to happen.

Yes Whiff Hithere's 'defence' is no surprise.

Well, whatever " User'whatever the number is this week" posted, I know how DH was.

He was a good Dad, but I'm not sure how anyone deals with addiction - it takes over. It's all about the next "fix" whatever that might be.

As for poor parenting maybe causing it, well ok, but can someone explain (by statistics) why more very young children have mental health problems now, than ever before?

Is that down to poor parenting by some of the young estranged or otherwise parent/adults that post, moaning about their parents? 🤷‍♀️

Or not?

To be clear, I worked in a child protection dept for many years. I know how awful some parents can be. I can still remember some abuse that continues to make me feel sick. 😡

And, I worked with other forms of abuse depts, and I know how abusive and awful some adult children can be. 😡

Estrangement happens for so many different reasons. 🤷‍♀️

Not everything is down to EPs. 🤷‍♀️

Not everything is down to EPs and we've been saying so for years DL, it's a pity we have to keep repeating ourselves.

@Madgrann77
"It is hard to see how eg. serious financial abuse resulting in an elderly parent estranging themselves from their financially abusive AC, as being shared "fault". Ofcourse one can say that their upbringing caused the ACs behaviour but that would be a very simplistic view of what shapes a person alongside their personality."

I totally agree with this and have made some less articulate posts trying to describe the same phenemon. Those who are willing to come ask for help and advice on a forum are unikely to be the worst of the worst abusers, but the people who were abused by the worst could totally be on here. I think this dynamic can create a weird distrust where one side thinks the other is always downplaying their part and not being honest.

For clarity I think it creates a weird dynamic On This Forum, where many ACs and EPs have experienced very cruel treatment. The worst of those people aren't coming to forums for help, so instead they are interacting with reasonable and flawed humans.

Smileless
Thanks for you well wishes this is the first day I have woke up feeling normal. When I'm sick it's like a day or two. I was out of commission for over a week, so glad to be feeling better. I already made my mom's and my (even if it's too late) appointment for the flu shot

@purplepixie the abbreviations really confused me too. Most important EP- estranged parent AC EC estarnged child