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Estrangement

The next thread for friendship, advice and support if estrangement has affected your life

(830 Posts)
Smileless2012 Mon 19-Feb-24 09:18:27

When I started the last thread, which at the time of posting here only has another 20 posts to go before reaching the maximum 1000, I struggled to find something different for the OP.

The other day I came across this quote from Emie Zola.

"We are like books. Most people only see our cover, the majority read only the introduction, many people believe our critics. Few will know our content."

It struck me how pertinent this is to us as EP's. We are at times judged by our cover, the fact that we are estranged. On occasion regardless of how much we talk about our situation, little attention is given to the detail resulting in inaccurate assumptions being made.

Some of us have experienced our critics, our EAC, being believed by others who are/were close to us and we have those who criticise us here too.

Those of us who found this thread however long ago or just recently, have found a place where our content can be known, to those who care to listen and understand. Perhaps that can also be the case for those who read but never post here, sometimes making contact through private messages or never reaching out all.

If their experience is the same as someone who is sharing, then through our words, their content can be known too.

So it's over to you, to get posting.

maxiepants Mon 19-Feb-24 09:40:55

I prefer another Emile Zola quote: "If you shut up truth, and bury it underground, it will but grow."

Bridie22 Mon 19-Feb-24 09:53:10

Thank you for the new post Smileless, interesting quote.
I always read but only occasionally post, even after 4years I find my situation to raw to express totally, but do look for friendship and support from EP s.

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 09:57:19

The truth is on the March and nothing will stop it - Emile Zola

Whiff Mon 19-Feb-24 09:58:16

Smiles lovely piece as usual. Well decide any nasty posters are to be ignored. As they only see one side and it's the parents own fault if there adult children, child or adult grandchildren estrange them. They will never change that view. So not going to waste my time with them. There are other threads where children who estranged their parents can vent their spleen.

Whiff Mon 19-Feb-24 10:00:12

Bridie you know you can always PM any of us you like. And know you will be heard and not attacked. 💐

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 10:00:56

@Bridie22 I’m new to this as well . Clinging on by a thread , building bridges wherever I can with my son , ostracised by my DIL and not sure at all what will happen with regards my GS due the end of March . It is feeling very raw for me too . I’m sorry you find yourself on here , a place I didn’t expect to ever be . Take care xxx

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 10:03:14

@Whiff - yes I think our perspective and particularly the anxiety when you’re struggling to prevent full estrangement is always going to be different. Because of this , we obviously have a lot more empathy and compassion. flowers

Shelflife Mon 19-Feb-24 10:12:40

Fortunately I am not estranged from AC. Smileless thank you for the quote from Emie Zola. I can not imagine the stress that estranged parents are living through. Why on earth would posters send nasty messages, it beggers belief! The phrase ' there but by the grace of God go I ' springs to mind. None of us know what is round the corner and people should not be complacent. These situations must be very complex and I send all estranged parents good wishes and peace. 💐💐

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 10:42:22

@Shelflife
I am someone who is clinging onto my relationship with my son and his wife . Facing a life with no relationship with my GS . This weekend I had a breakthrough with my son and we kept the conversation light - this worked . My situation, which I suppose is summarised by Smile’s quote from Zola is that the process of estrangement is complicated and people only see the fact you are , not the multitude of reasons leading up to this point . It is a time of terrible stress and anxiety, I have found it’s made me very unwell mentally and physically. Losing my partner suddenly just over a year ago seems to have triggered this change in my relationship with my AS and DIL - leading me to suspect I’ve wanted more from them then they are able to currently give . It has been a hard lesson to learn and I begin the process of trying to rebuild . I really wish I didn’t have to but I’m now in the situation I really don’t want to be in . I would never have believed it 😔

Shelflife Mon 19-Feb-24 11:08:05

My heart goes out to you Lady Susie.Losing your partner so recently must have been dreadful - my condolences. Very pleased to know you had a break through with your son this weekend and hope you can both build on that. I imagine it is best to take gentle step by gentle step. We should never take the relationships with our AC for granted, as you said
" I would never have believed it" I sincerely wish you well and hope the situation improves for all of you. Our AC marry and our relationship with them changes a little, it is complicated is' nt it? Good luck , be kind to yourself 💐💐

Smileless2012 Mon 19-Feb-24 11:13:47

That's why we make sure this thread is always available maxieplus so that our experiences wont be buried underground, and by not being made to shut up we will prevent others from being shut up too.

Our friendship and support is always here for you Bridieflowers.

That's another great quote Ladysu, thank you for sharing.

It is, at least it should be possible to be understanding of and empathetic too others whose experience differs to your own Whiff and if anyone can't be, then this isn't the right thread for them and should be left to those who can and want to be.

Thank you Shelflife smile.

maxiepants Mon 19-Feb-24 11:30:49

You misunderstood the point of the quote I posted Smilderess, but I can't say I'm surprised.

On the last few posts of the previous thread, several posters seemed to believe that I was excusing or justifying violence against women. Astonishing, the leaps of logic exhibited there, but maybe the fault is mine in expecting anything else.

To be clear: I was asking Ladysu (as I have done previously) if perhaps her son is swearing and shouting at her out of frustration at having the same discussion many, many times without him feeling heard. I wasn't excusing the method of delivery and I said that plainly in my post. There's never any excuse for violence. I was only pointing out that she might consider why he's feeling the way he is and whether (perish the thought) she has contributed to that feeling (NOT TO THE VIOLENCE OR ABUSE) by her actions.

I really hope that's clear. I know it's not always an easy thing to grasp that blame lies solely with one person.

maxiepants Mon 19-Feb-24 11:31:50

Doesn't lie solely with one person, I meant... sigh

Madgran77 Mon 19-Feb-24 12:09:40

Ladysuisei

@Bridie22 I’m new to this as well . Clinging on by a thread , building bridges wherever I can with my son , ostracised by my DIL and not sure at all what will happen with regards my GS due the end of March . It is feeling very raw for me too . I’m sorry you find yourself on here , a place I didn’t expect to ever be . Take care xxx

Ladysue I went to post to you on the other thread but it had closed so ....

Be proud of yourself for enabling the change this week by not engaging in the angst and anger for much of last weeks meeting and for offering but not pushing the hard conversations this week. You deserve acknowledgement for managing to do that despite your anxiety and mental health problems that you are dealing with. It's a real achievement. 👏👏

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 12:20:13

@Shelflife thank you for your kindness. Yes life is very hard so early into this loss - he didn’t quite make it to 60 , so eternally 59 .

My relationship with my AS was so good ( and his wife !) but the beareavement coupled with the pregnancy has altered things. I’m prepared to work hard and to respond to my son in a way that improves things .
They’ve been married for 5 years , but it was the death in the family which set us onto the wrong path sadly . Xxx

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 12:23:28

@madgran thank you !!
I’ve put a lot of thought into just what I think might work best and it’s light conversation for the time being. Maybe this will gradually put things right - I hope so . As I said above , no taking my relationship with my AS and DIL for granted again though , I’ll need to stay on the ball . Yea I think I’ve enabled things to improve, let’s just hope this continues xxx

DiamondLily Mon 19-Feb-24 12:26:45

maxiepants

You misunderstood the point of the quote I posted Smilderess, but I can't say I'm surprised.

On the last few posts of the previous thread, several posters seemed to believe that I was excusing or justifying violence against women. Astonishing, the leaps of logic exhibited there, but maybe the fault is mine in expecting anything else.

To be clear: I was asking Ladysu (as I have done previously) if perhaps her son is swearing and shouting at her out of frustration at having the same discussion many, many times without him feeling heard. I wasn't excusing the method of delivery and I said that plainly in my post. There's never any excuse for violence. I was only pointing out that she might consider why he's feeling the way he is and whether (perish the thought) she has contributed to that feeling (NOT TO THE VIOLENCE OR ABUSE) by her actions.

I really hope that's clear. I know it's not always an easy thing to grasp that blame lies solely with one person.

I don’t think verbal abuse of anyone is justified. Swearing, shouting, and threats is deeply unpleasant.

And, surely, if you have a real problem with someone, the best way to articulate how you’re feeling is to keep it calm, coherent and reasonable.🤔

As people, we are all flawed - there’s never been a perfect parent, and there’s never been a perfect child.

Any strife differences may cause are best dealt with promptly and calmly.

Shouting and abuse just puts everyone on the defensive.

VioletSky Mon 19-Feb-24 13:30:16

The thread is for EPs only now?

Bridie22 Mon 19-Feb-24 13:36:04

Does it say that VS?

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 15:00:20

@DiamondLily you are correct in saying nobody is perfect. I am sure that somewhere along the line I’ve frustrated my son for not listening. He’s frustrated me too , but I don’t get abusive though. I’m disappointed in the way my AS speaks to me sometimes- he’s unpredictable in his mood and unless I’m in the same room as him it’s impossible to gauge his mood . I’m having difficulty with trying to have a text interaction with him today so I will stop now. I can tell he’s frustrated. At least he can’t be abusive though - I will wait until I see him next weekend. xxx

DiamondLily Mon 19-Feb-24 15:08:20

Ladysuisei

@DiamondLily you are correct in saying nobody is perfect. I am sure that somewhere along the line I’ve frustrated my son for not listening. He’s frustrated me too , but I don’t get abusive though. I’m disappointed in the way my AS speaks to me sometimes- he’s unpredictable in his mood and unless I’m in the same room as him it’s impossible to gauge his mood . I’m having difficulty with trying to have a text interaction with him today so I will stop now. I can tell he’s frustrated. At least he can’t be abusive though - I will wait until I see him next weekend. xxx

Yes, sometimes it’s best to stand off and let others deal with their stress, whatever may be causing it.

Hopefully, he’ll be in a better mood by the weekend. 🙂

Smileless2012 Mon 19-Feb-24 15:22:35

Good to see you've found the new thread Madgran and DL.

Shouting and abuse just puts everyone on the defensive yes it does DL and achieves nothing constructive.

We all get frustrated from time to time and angry Ladysu that's the nature of relationships. Good idea to stop texting for now if it's proving difficult and wait until you talk too him and see him at the weekend.

It can be difficult to gauge someone's mood if you can't see them, especially when communicating via text messages and emails.

Ladysuisei Mon 19-Feb-24 15:27:34

@DiamondLily sadly my AS does tend to shift the blame for everything onto me , which is not good . At the moment for the sake of restoring some harmony I’m taking it on the chin . Doesn’t mean it’s correct flowersthough.

DiamondLily Mon 19-Feb-24 15:43:53

Ladysuisei

@DiamondLily sadly my AS does tend to shift the blame for everything onto me , which is not good . At the moment for the sake of restoring some harmony I’m taking it on the chin . Doesn’t mean it’s correct flowersthough.

Just disengage a bit. If he’s seeming stroppy and stressed, don’t get into it. Just take the line of “oh, sorry you’re stressed, keep well and we’ll speak soon”. Then leave it until the weekend. If you start engaging and arguing, you will either end up with more stress, all around, or you will have to pander to it.

Just leave him to sort out his own stress - he’s an adult.🙂