*warning difficult topic* Re my Grandsons care

we have a special guardianship for our grandaughter, she cannot go back to her mother because she killed our son and was advised to go with diminished responsibility. Our social worker told us this and advised us to get a special guardianship. You have to see a solicitor if you want to keep your gc I would advise that you do. I am so sorry that you have all this worry, but if you can get a special guardianship it will be peace of mind. Sadly she sounds very much like my late sons partner who had a lot of the same problems.

Thank you newnanny , she would choose her son which is good as she usually has no problem with being independent and 'getting rid of men' it is just the ones she chooses in the first place to then have to get rid of which is beyond a joke

There is part of her which wants to show him off like a trophy but I suppose she will feel she has 'won him back' till reality sets in and she realises she has A LOT of difficult stuff to cope with with him on a daily basis and that is when I will get the ''help please Mum'' calls like I always did but was always there anyway especially after his diagnosis

At least the ''help Mum!'' calls mean I can have some INPUT into his life and be there for him plus keep a good eye on him of course and possibly voice any concerns I have to social services not that I feel they would take any notice unless it was DIRE!!

It's like it has gone from 'we are concerned you won't protect him enough' ( because my daughter and I were close ) to being an 'over protective Grandparent' nagging them with every 'little concern' when tbh I reckon they do know the concerns are not little it is just in the bigger scheme of utter abuse and neglect then it is 'little' it seems!!

So most Grandparents in this situation stop contacting them with any concerns unless they are DIRE but at that stage there is usually no contact as the birth parent wants to HIDE the behaviour / circumstances / dodgy boyfriend / being back on drugs etc

OMG Sheilasue am SO sorry for your loss and thank you for the wake up call!

I cannot afford a solicitor but social services supposed to be paying for one if we go for SGO which I reckon will be pushed for at the LAC review but we will still see what happens

I don't know how bad it has to get I just keep hoping things don't get worse but I do not understand why they do not go for the whole hog as in if someone has stopped using why not make sure they deal with all the issues which caused them to use in the first place ie MENTAL HEALTH etc , they do NOT seem to be looking at her mental health , only that she is 'clean' now

I AM VERY ASHAMED TO SAY MY DAUGHTER STABBED SOMEONE AND HE NEARLY DIED ..

A guy in a nightclub touched her bum and because she was raped as a teenager it brought back all her rage and she went and got a knife God knows from where and stabbed him in the stomach but thankfully we heard he survived but that is something I put to the recesses of my mind

I think it was about 12 years ago , it was before she had her son but that vile temper when drunk where does it go when they stop drinking? The anger issues and cause of the anger does not just go away does it!!

I think they want her to get some counselling etc but they are not exactly pushing her to do it and time for 'her deadline' of ''taking him'' is running out!

You are right nannynoo all that shouting does is to frighten.We do 'tell off' now and again but using a normal voice and explaining why we are saying it.
You feel protective of your DGS ( of course you do ,who wouldn't) and since you have looked after him well for the last few years I understand you feeling sad and worried about him returning to his Mother.Would it be just for weekends at first?
If it happens at all.Glad he is doing well at school.You deserve a medal!?

I'm sorry you are in such a difficult situation. I wondered about the liver disease. I've experienced someone close dying of liver disease and if your daughter is at stage 3 will she be physically well enough to look after her son, apart from all the other issues? Is she under a specialist for this?

I am not perfect and have had to deal with my own issues in life and face them head on and deal with ''my stuff'' and it was the best thing I ever did as it turned my life around and I became more emotionally stable and mentally well and able to deal with and express my emotions healthily etc

Just got to pop a lid on the feelings of being s sh*t Mum hence my daughters behaviour etc but we are all responsible for our own sh*t as it were

My background was not great but I want my Grandchildren AND grown children to find / have some stability in life and the Grandkids to have 100% stability!!!

Thankfully my other daughter is settled , married and is a primary school teacher and I have NO concerns WHATSOEVER about the welfare of my Granddaughter who is 5

I just hope my other daughter deals with her issues but NO ONE can FORCE her to and she does not want to face them now especially if she can get her son back without doing so it seems

GranmaMoira she has kidney disease , hepatitis , stomach ulcers , damaged esophagus , bulimia , painful sensitive teeth due to both the bulimia and excessive vomiting when abusing alcohol , depression , insomnia , panic attacks and mood swings / irritability

She said her liver is fine / all clear but previously told me she had severe liver damage

And yet all it takes is her stopping drinking to get him back???

I do wonder health wise how she will cope as well as mental health wise but she says everything is healing now she has stopped drinking

Her Dad is currently an active alcoholic but I left him 32 years ago when he was not drinking heavily

I do not feel my daughter will be honest about her mental health or even physical health tbh

For me this still boils down to this does not feel like a ''genuine recovery'' and yet the ball seems to be still going down the road of reunification!

nannynoo no words of advice from me just a heartfelt prayer that this little boy gets to stay with you where he is loved and safe.

The reality of MY LIFE is pretty good!

The reality of my DAUGHTERS LIFE is pretty BAD!

Yet she / we 'pretend' that everything is alright because 'she has now stopped drinking'

It is looking like if she can prove she is clean and pass a parenting assessment then she can get her son back...

Has she ''turned her life around'' no , is she sober? ''yes''

Has she got help for her addiction etc ''no''

Is her mental health good ''no'' but is a difficult one to prove as she seems to be functioning well and is holding down a job

At the end of the day it is not just my job to protect my Grandson but SOCIAL SERVICES JOB but I will always report any current incidences and concerns etc but I feel like saying 'not that it will do any good'

Seems she will be allowed to parent him with her issues but I WILL be keeping an eye out and yet hope she improves / gets help with her stuff at some * point xx

What is ''good enough'' parenting? It seems popping out for a spliff is ok and being under the influence of cannabis , shouting at him will be poo poo'ed as an issue of concern and so will a certain lifestyle even if chaotic if he is in no significant or immediate risk of harm x

Sorry but I have to shout this from the rooftops .... ''POOR LITTLE BOY HAS BEEN THROUGH ENOUGH!!!''

I think your best option would be to liaise closet with the Reviewing Officer, they have a lot more clout these days and have standards to uphold (as do case holding SWs).

The RO has had a role to play also in this drift. I would suggest the Local Authority takes this matter into the Court arena in order to gain permanence for your grandson, thus far it is unacceptable. What if she resumed drinking again and her relationship with her partner becomes volatile, both scenarios will impact upon your grandsons care and possible safety.

I didn't not think you seeking legal advice would achieve anything personally, you need to go through the right channels, keep copies of your emails and voice your concerns this way also therefore it is also documented

As a mother you know your own daughter and obviously if she had changed her son might be better with his mother. The child's needs are not coming first in this and I feel for all concerned, but most of all for your beloved grandson who is making such good progress and has had the stability, love and caring every child needs. I cannot see where the social workers are coming from in all this. I would make an appointment at the school, tell them of your fears, get a contact number for the school to contact them if they notice unfavourable changes. I would also write to the case manager voicing your reservations and the reason for them, say what you intend to do about the school. Say you hold them responsible for your gs it is against your wishes and instincts they are doing it. You have done your best and it goes without saying you will be extra vigilant. It is an awful situation all round and I send you my best wishes.

I have not read all of the posts so I apologise if my comments are irrelevant or have been said already.

You social services appear to be preparing for plan A and plan B so they may also have concerns but are bound by law, Human Rights etc and if they don't do that the case will be taken from them.
I agree with the comments above, for example by Lucky Legs, and hope that her suggestions help. I can't help wondering how a young man with, presumably, no experience of autism, is going to cope with living with your GS. He may surprise you, or he may deliver an ultimatum to your daughter. Even your daughter is going to find it hard to keep to the strict routine your GS needs. But from the point of view of the social services, if your daughter is determined to try they have to give her a chance and not assume she will fail. She will soon find that the novelty of the room etc will soon wear off for your GS and are no substitute for time, care and patience. She may be pleading with you after a few months to take him back.
Therefore I suggest that the most important thing for you to do is to be encouraging, show your support, do not throw up barriers while remaining realistic about the risks, so that your daughter will not be afraid to turn to you when she needs help. Do whatever you can to help her, be encouraging, let her know that you will always be there at the drop of a hat, give her no reason to think you tried to stop her having her son, or will say 'I told you so'. I do realise that this will be very hard to do and it will be hard to guard against the obvious risks,but the more time she spends with her son will make her realise how hard it will be. It will also be much better for GS to see you all in harmony so that he does not feel that you are fighting over him.
A hair test will show the truth of whether or not she is drinking,try not to pre judge it - if Social Services will not pay you may be able to get it done privately with a little subterfuge (only as a last resort, but it might put your mind at rest, or prove you were right). As for cannabis, although I have never tried it, it is legal in many countries and might be one day in the UK - unfortunately there are worse legal highs easily available.
You have my heartfelt wishes that this will all turn out well,there will certainly be tears to come for some of you as there is no easy answer to this situation. You may see years of hard work and love go down the drain, but I sincerely hope not and hope that your GS, the innocent victim in this will in the long term, emerge unscathed. You should be very proud of what you have achieved.

I fel SO sorry for you and your darling Grandson I only hope Social Services realise where your Grandson is going to not only to his Mum but his dubious Father too that seems very risky why put a child in such a terrible position I hope and pray there will be a positive outcome.Please try and cope I send huge hugs to you and to your Grandson xx

tHANK YOU FOR YOUR SUPPORT EVERYONE

I am still feeling angry and what I am feeling angry about is the FALSEHOOD of it all ie she is trying to get her son back by false pretenses not be HONESTLY and being honest about where she is really at or the help she needs

starbird you are right - I feel after a month or few I will get a call from her saying she can't cope but I do not want my Grandson moved back and forth and would rather they get it 'right first time' either my daughter has him with SUPPORT or I do , she needs to make up her mind if she is indeed 100% COMMITTED TO HER SON or whether he just wants to 'show the world she is a good Mum and loves her son'

I have NO DOUBT she loves her son and misses him a great deal but that does NOT mean she will cope well eg with his difficult behaviours which will only get worse with puberty and change of school to secondary which is going to be very HARD for him indeed and he will need LOTS of support with it

You have to go the ''extra mile'' with a child with additional support needs , basic parenting WILL NOT CUT IT

You have to be consistent with his routine daily and tackle any problems he is having which can emerge suddenly and out of the blue and CALM his high levels of anxiety ( not add to them )

I will do EVERYTHING I can to help , yes even at a drop of a hat but I want her to be PREPARED for the REALITY ahead as it will NOT be easy on her own as I cannot be there all the time if she is indeed taking responsibility of her son again and I am getting my life back to a degree so I can be a ''normal'' Grandparent again but I do not see that happening for a while as I reckon she is going to need a HELL OF A LOT OF SUPPORT but of course I am willing to do it for little mans sake and for a while it may need to be a type of 'shared care' arrangement if she gets him back

He needs me in his life as the stable adult and so does she tnh as sometimes she is still like a child herself

I can see her wanting to do the 'fun stuff' with him and leaving all the tough HARD stuff to me but she really needs to take responsibility for her child if that is indeed what she definitely wants which she is adamant she is so she will have to put SOME of the ruddy hard work into it as well then

Plus drop the 'pretence' at some point and hopefully get some work done on herself as well , getting the emotional support and help she needs as that is when I really feel things will / would turn around FOR THE BETTER but until then I just have to be there for my Grandson 100% as I am now and will always continue to be but if she wants him for life she better buckle up for a ride which takes MATURITY , consistency and real inner strength! x

He is not going to be a child forever and because of his condition HE will need support for the rest of his life but hopefully together he can grow into a fine , stable and happy man as he has SO much potential in him and is extremely bright , sharp and yet very sensitive , bless him xx

I end each day EXHAUSTED , it is not about getting your nails done , going shopping for nice handbags , getting your hair done , chilling and socialising with friends , walking around looking glamorous with your child in designer clothes , portraying to the world that everything is perfect when it IS NOT

It is a constant , daily being there for him , seeing to and considering his needs eg he does not do well with constant rounds of visitors and noise and late nights etc , he needs consistent calm & peace and THRIVES in it and of course he needs loads of ATTENTION , not ignoring him and tapping away on ruddy Whatsapp or however you spell it , or ruddy Instagram or whatever and her bubble will burst at some point once she has announced to the world her son is back with her and the novelty of that wears off! lol

OP - will the local police be able to tell you anything about the released ex? Why he did 10 years when the sentence was 8, whether he's released under any conditions? Or they may need to know he's on their patch.
The skunk being smoked nowadays is a far cry from the comparatively mild cannabis the '60s hippies smoked. It's nasty stuff, highly addictive, and can cause paranoia.

Respect for what you are doing for your DGS, you're a strong woman.

Also the NEGLECT needs to be addressed , he used to go to bed at around 11pm and then not be able to get up for school and then it was rushed , he was not CLEANED before school and was in nappies which is pretty usual for many kids with Autism BUT she would not have time to change his very soggy and soiled nappy before school that is if she made it to the school bus with him anyway on time or even got up herself!!!

He needs his breakfast every morning to start the day and his teeth cleaned of course and a wash and fresh clean uniform and underwear every morning as it does get dirty after one use and his underwear certainly does as well as he has little accidents sometimes as well

He likes his snacks ready as soon as he comes home from school and likes to do exactly the same things every day after school and any change like shopping he has to be prepared for

Visitors need to be kept to a minimum , not like piccadilly circus and he just about tolerates the social workers coming round , bless him as they disrupt his sense of routine!

My daughter had visitors on all days and at all times and I used to have to take him in the other room and settle him down for bed or keep him calm and away from all the noise and chaos

Those type of things HAVE to change and she has to be prepared to change her lifestyle for HIM as that is what a parent DOES

Basically her focus has to be on HIM not on herself , yes she will get some time to herself but a constant stream of different visitors in the house day and night is NOT good for him , neither are late nights and just about get him up and out the door mornings!! Lol

The school will be monitoring him as well which is good

She just has the one child , there are other Mums with 3 , all with special needs etc ( not sure how they do it but they DO )

I suppose it is the COMMITMENT of parenting!!

The authorities HAD to pick up the slack in the end as I could not do it all at the time ( what with burnout , stress related chest pain and unresolved grief which I had no TIME or space to address )

Nice to come the day when no one else has to 'pick up the slack' and she can manage him all on her own , with respite breaks and support but still DO IT and manage it WELL!!

I would LOVE to see the day..

The ex just out of prison is not my Grandsons Father thank goodness , his Dad is not exactly up to scratch though either

I think it was due to smuggled mobile phones that his sentence was extended , that is what my daughter told me anyway

Not sure if / how much info the police would give me but if I said he has been around a VULNERABLE CHILD they may be more forthcoming

I just hope she gets rid of him and that is that particular problem solved especially if she thinks it will have a negative impact on her getting her son back I don't think she will let the man stand in her way as she is definitely DETERMINED by hook or by crook to get him back!!

That said I do still worry about her seeing him sneakily but I'd go mad if I worried about that if he appeared to be off the scene!

I just had a message from my daughter to say the social worker is coming round next week to ''discuss contact''

Obviously she is not happy with her choice of 'visitor' my Grandson is / was exposed to at contact last week , well I presume that is what it is about , there are times when they don't contact me at all even though I ask them to but they contact my daughter PRONTO but I suppose she is the key element into which way this goes..

I just feel like the one behind the scenes slogging away , then it's ''thanks a lot'' and back to Mum [lol]

I really do feel like a foster carer now but not in a way I did before xx

It feels like I am the one who always mops up the mess but I will do the bits I signed up to , for my Grandsons sake but will not be 'babysitting' my daughter as she is a grown ruddy adult!! x

Good to have your update nannynoo. There is some good advice here from posters with social work experience. The situation your grandson is in is 'drift". It happens too often when care proceedings are avoided by using Section 20, that is so called "voluntary care". There have been a number of recent Judgements when the Judge sitting in care proceedings initiated after 2 or 3 years of a child being in voluntary care, with only the parent having any legal rights. This is the case with your grandson, his mother is the only person with Parental Responsibility. She could walk into your house this afternoon and take her son back to live with her.
Please phone the Reviewing Officer, he's the independent person in the local authority with a key role in preventing drift. There are child protection/safeguarding issues at contact given the presence of this man and the cannabis smoking. I know many parents smoke cannabis without it leading to social work involvement but that isn't the case with your daughter given her history of addiction and ongoing health problems.
Phone the reviewing officer
Go to see a solicitor whose name is on the Children Panel.
As the local authority has indicated it will pay your legal fees if SGO is to be applied for, the solicitor will contact them and that will happen.
I remember you didn't seek legal advice when your grandson was placed with you. I understand why, but I do believe you have to do this urgently to stop this drifting any more. Stress and uncertainty is the last thing you and your grandson need.
I know its difficult when you feel you're going against your daughter but this needs formalising asap.
Best wishes.