Any advice is appreciated!DIL at a loss here!!

OMG. Never let your baby out of your site (niece holding her then falling over)!!!!! As for your mother in law. You will be better off without her in your life or your daughters. She sounds very toxic and I doubt she will not change. My daughter has similar with her mother in law who is just a nasty nasty person. Would thus person be beneficial to your own daughter..NO she will not. it is such a shame that we can't all have the ideal family closeness (too many other points to pick up on). end of the day no pojnt in her being in you or your daughters life. You have your family now with your daughter and husband and I wish you all the very best. Please stop stressing and enjoy your own family life ? X

Jeus Christ! My ex deceased MiL was a nasty horrible person. Your MiL makes the ex deceased look like Mother Teresa.

She is awful. I doubt she will change either. You have every right to remove yourself from her life. This is not on.

She is clearly a jealous nasty person who hasn't let your OH go! Daughters are usually closer to there own mom's and the maternal side usually see more of the babies than the paternal side.

I know this from my family dynamics and being a mom to 3 sons and 1 daughter. I have 2 grandsons by my 2 eldest sons

I am not the type to be like the ex MiL however I have gone far out of my way to ensure I am so opposite mine have been known to turn to me and say "Mom I am supposed to be your child, not DiL" ?

She knows she can do this and is a nasty bully who is jealous. The main thing is your hub is onside. Quite honestly the way she is behaving around your baby she shouldn't be left alone with your baby.

Deliberately coughing all over her is child abuse. You do not have to see this woman and neither does your baby.

I hope the counselling works for you and you can stand up to her better in the future.

This is awful, but you know what? If you find her a nightmare then no doubt lots of other folks do too. I wouldn't worry about her bad-mouthing you behind your back because others will be thinking that she's a nightmare and they'll be sympathetic to your plight.
It's a good thing your DH is on your side. I know it's a bit tricky but can you try to ensure that when he leaves the room in your presence you go out too?
If not and she says anything again, when DH comes back into the room say, "Maybe MIL would like to repeat what she just said ...." She'll no doubt deny all knowledge but you can't win with these people.

after we gransnetters described as 'lovely ladies'
Rocknroll - you don't think this is a wind-up do you?
lovely ladies is a term a man may use - very annoying phrase!

Sadly we live in a world where evidence is everythjng. So my suggestion is to get a secret dictaphone (15-20£) record their nastiness and play it back to them once you have collected enough evidence.

This way when they are mean to you, you can smile and take it knowing that you will be playing their spiteful words back to them at a time of your choosing.

It takes the power away from the bullies.

Incidentally, "just joking" and "you're being oversensitive" are classic bully responses.

Record it, reflect on it and act when you are good and ready.

Yor DH needs to tell her to shut up!.If she doesn't then she she will have NO contact with her GD.
She's a bully and is used to geting her own way...well no more! You and your DD do not need her in your lives

Yogagirl Unfortunately, there are some MIL like this but I think most posters are suggesting coping strategies rather than cutting her out of their lives.

I agree that we are only hearing one side of the story, of course; however, sometimes it can take years before a son can recognise that perhaps his mother is not the perfect being that he thought she was. Some mothers of sons do see a DIL as a threat to the relationship they have with their sons and can be overly possessive of any DGC. It takes a very strong DIL to be able to deal with this and to come through with the DIL/MIL relationship intact in some form or another.
I would not advocate CO unless under extreme circumstances - and, as someone else pointed out, as a child gets to a certain age, they will not be happy to hear a grandmother uttering dreadful things about his mother and may refuse him/herself to visit grandmother.

sadly I couldn't read OP with empathy after we gransnetters described as 'lovely ladies'
... maybe its because I have a nightmare DIL . ...maybe its because she should be on mumsnet. I wouldn't go on mumsnet and moan about DIL. It's all about power and mothers of grandots have the power. So stop moaning and be the better person.

DIL - I could have written this myself 40 years ago. Looking at it now and the pattern my MIL had with husbands brothers GFs and wives -MIL was happy with GFs - from her point of view a son with a GF shows he is attractive etc. BUT once married she could not see anything good in anything the wives did. Did succeeded in breaking up my Bro IL's 3 marriages - and more or less taking over the children involved. I think there are some women who just cannot accept their sons have grown up.
We stuck together through cussedness and DISTANCE. Accept no offers of help - minding, whatever - even when you really need it. It's then she can take advantage. Never be alone with her. Involve DH in EVERY interaction you have with her. - And keep her knowledge of you and DH daily life to the absolute minimum. I don't think they can help it, but you have to put your family and your sanity first. Asking this shows you are very aware of what is going on so you are in a good place to change things!

What do you think MIL gets out of all this chaos? It must reward her somehow or she wouldn't bother, or maybe that is just the way she is?

She raised your OH and can't have done such a bad job if you find him lovable.

If it is just her natural way of being then nothing will change it. If she gets a thrill causing trouble then stay away.

In Transactional Analysis there is a 'game' called 'Let you and him fight' it is a way of time being filled with the creation of fights in families or groups of friends or colleagues, everyone has a part to play. Games can be replaced by more healthy transactions but you need to recognise them first.

I suggest 'Games People Play' as a start to seeing the picture from a different angle.

Hi, I had a difficult MIL. My DH knew how difficult she was and in the end he stopped visits and laid down some rules. That did work. I regret now with hindsight that I wasn't more pro-active. There's some great advice regarding this and being pro-active above. For your own health and family harmony do follow it.

Part of the problem, if your DH wants you to go on visits to enforce boundaries and rules for your DD, is your DH. If you’re both on the same page he needs to enforce boundaries about your DD with his family, not just you, or it does look, to them, that it is all you being awkward. He really needs to stand up to them for you and your DD. Your baby’s health, safety and comfort are more important than his mothers feelings. They won’t change unless there are some consequences for their action/ like seeing less of your DD until they can respect BOTH you and you DH’s rules.

OP I had to see a therapist about being Assertive and standing up for myself. It really did help. They will give you tips and paperwork to work on at home. You can't change her behaviour but you can change how you react to it.

I'm off my medication now too which is a huge achievement.
Let your HV know if you still see her. She recommended I speak to my doctor.

Sadly my DD has very similar problems with her MIL. When DGD was born MIL insisted that DD, DH and DGD undertake a 6 hour round trip car journey to visit.... a total no no for week old baby in car seat! DGS screamedthe whole journey. MIL had already been to visit DD on 2nd day out of hospital.
MIL critises the way her son and DD are bringing up DGD, now 15 months. At 1st birthday get together she was rude to their friends and critised visiting children’s behaviour.
I get really concerned about all this as try to keep a harmonious family atmosphere, I get on really well with my DIL and her family but cannot see a way forward with DD’s MIL.

"DARKNESS CANNOT DRIVE OUT DARKNESS: ONLY LIGHT CAN DO THAT"

"HATE CANNOT DRIVE OUT HATE: ONLY LOVE CAN DO THAT"

From today, accept that she does not approve of you, she does not respect you, your husband or your decisions as a family unit, she does not love you.

Today, you approve of yourself, you're doing the best you can. You respect your, your husbands decisions for your family.
And love yourself for the amazing person you are.

As said in previous posts, I would organise the visits in my own home. For me that would work because at home I feel stronger and more in charge of things. I have some issues with my own MIL, when I'm in my own house I feel more capable of saying how I want things. You could try and make it sort of an official invitation, sending a clear message when your MIl is expected, stating it will be for a cup of coffee or whatever, and adding the time you want the visit to end. Trust me, been there, done that. Oh, and by the way......I'm a MIL ánd first-time gran now, I don't think my beloved DIL has complaints ?

In that case many people could 'Read between the lines' about you and your situation.

Another famous saying is 'Before you diagnose yourself with Depression and anxiety make sure you aren't surrounded by arseholes'

This is awful. I was in similar situation though not nearly as bad!

A friend told me this- you are in control, the baby is yours ( and hubby) you hold all the cards. She needs to step in line now or else. You need to be braver and when she says something. Challenge it to her face. You have been nice and unchallenging because you are nice to a elder probably like me but you are a grown woman who would not put up with this from anyone else. She knows this too. If she is unkind she doesn’t get to see her grand child. Also your partner needs to address this she’s allowing it too. It’s a form of bullying. I challenged my mil and aunt in law and when I spoke back things slowly changed. Change the way you see it. She is pathetic really and you could pity her and be sympathetic as she feels no longer in charge and lost a son. But challenging her when needed. She has a lot more to lose than you. Xx

Stop looking for her acceptance... it's the best thing you can do for yourself. It will make a huge step towards your happiness!

A very REAL SITUATION! Sadly so.

And all YOU need is someone to support YOU.

Sending love xx

Buddha said:
Do not believe with the ears, that which the eyes do not see!

No I'm not reading the same as everyone else, I'm reading between the lines, as did Nelliemosser My nasty s.i.l will be saying the most unbelievable lies about me [& has done], to justify why I & the entire birth family of my once beloved D has been 'cut out', with my precious GD without a single blood relative left in her life [apart from her mum & half bro.] Be careful what you wish on your fellow grandmother, it could turn round and bite you on the bum!!

That last post was in reply to Yogagirl btw

I have NOT advised anyone to CO their MIL including this poster.

Yogagirl, you did exactly the same to me when I gave advice on my MIL who lied about having Cancer and called me a nightmare DIL

Are you reading the same as everyone else?

She knows what she's done wrong because her son has spoke to her about it and keeps reverting back to being disrespectful. So she can't trot out 'i don't know what I've done' she's been told.