I’m so torn about raising my grandkids

Separating the two boys is of course a situation to be avoided if possible. However , from the little I know it appears that this is simply not possible. If a child goes to one sister and another child to a second sister then these children will have been adopted into their own family. Not perfect but this is far from a perfect situation . bjane02 , you have and are doing an amazing job. I would suggest that if you adopt both children and that adoption struggles then no one is happy and secure. Follow your instincts , they will be correct. You are in an impossible situation and also have to deal with your feelings towards your son . I wish you peace and hope you are able to access professional help that will guide you towards making the best decision- whatever that may be! Good luck.

Jane, so sorry to hear of the very difficult situation you find yourself in and well done for all your hard work so far in caring for your two little grandsons.
Your sister also is very generous in her efforts, already taking care of the older sister.
I thought possibly your sister might be able to help you, at the same time keeping the brothers together, but maybe it's too much for you.
You've got to take care of yourself first, before you can help anyone else.
Is there any possibility that you can chase up your son and remind him of his responsibilities?
I wish you the best in whatever decision you make, I really hope these two little boys can grow up in the loving care of their extended family.

Single adopter of two non north-related children here and I would strongly urge you to take on what you feel able. Trust your gut. It isn’t necessarily true that siblings should be kept together at all costs; read up on sibling trauma bonds. Often, siblings who have experienced trauma/neglect/abuse in their families of origin can re-trigger each other. Sometimes, there will be sibling-on-sibling abuse or violence as children recreate what they have witnessed and experienced. Or there may be a child who has been the object of hatred or abuse while other siblings are treated relatively well in a birth family. It really isn’t a one-size/one-approach fits all.

I think you may be in the US, rather than the UK, but I am assuming that the approach there is pretty much as here ie in keeping blood families together unless it really isn’t possible?

From your description of your younger grandson have you considered issues like Foetal Alcohol Syndrome, which could possibly account for his behaviours? The majority of children who are removed from their birth parents in the UK have experienced the toxic trio of drugs, alcohol and domestic violence while in utero. The fall-out can be life-long and, if it’s anything like here, you will be fighting an uphill battle constantly to secure the necessary support your grandson will need to help him as he navigates school, in particular, and life in general.

Good luck but please do not feel guilt-tripped into taking on more than you can physically or mentally manage as that way lies more sadness and losses for your grandchildren.

So sorry to read of your situation
No it is not selfish , it’s very sensible , you & your family have reached the best option for all concerned .. You deserve the utmost admiration, wishing you and your family the very best as you move forwards.

I think that if you keep them both your attention will be on the younger one predominantly and this will be detrimental to the older one. If your sister will help, and willingly, then let her help. This is just my opinion, and it would be heartbreaking, but perhaps save your health and well-being?

Is the children’s mother up to considering a rehab programme, or is she really a lost cause?

I would split the kids up. My friend had 2 kids in similar circumstances and the difficult little boy just dominated the whole of family life and everything was focused on him. Every day was a nightmare and the second child did not have the attention she should have had. If he gets good one to one attention with another family relative it could transform his behaviour. He probably needs assessing to see if he has any mental health issues and can be given all the support he needs. Kids are very resilient and as long as the kids have contact, this could be a good result for the whole family. You are doing a great job but remember it’s your health and future welfare that are important too. ?

What an awful situation you have been put in.
If your sister lives close to you she coud give you respite from the younger child either Monday to Friday or Friday to Monday.
Have you spoken to a proffesional about the young one,he may grow out of his problem being it`s drug related.
And i think your son is beyond vile putting you in this situation.
I really do wish you all the best bjane02.

If you live near your sister then the children can be kept in touch and know they are siblings, I can't see a problem

Is your sister nearby? If she is, you can work together and they could have certain evenings or parts of the weekend with either of you. Would mean you each have a short break and they don't feel they have lost each other. I guess they'd each have more space and attention if they were in separate households - plus having a real relationship with both of you - good for them to know that not just one person bothers about them.

Sara1954 my D has looked after 3 of her GC for over a year now and is working in between times too so I know how you feel as D just wishes for a quiet and free life that she had before tragedy hit the family. She's worn out ! At the same time didn't want the alternative for the children as the twins are teens ( 15 in June ) and the other will be 11 tomorrow, they'd suffered enough losing their dad without being snatched by the state.

No you're not selfish. You and your sister sound like saints to me.
If the alternative to separating them, is local authority care, fostering, adoption, and they'll still see each other often (and wont be traumatised by the split) try it and see.
You are no use to them if you're ground down with it all.
Good luck

I think that it's an excellent idea. The children would be staying within the family so relationships will be maintained. You are doing the best you can and that's a huge amount by anyone's standards. Good luck to you all.

Bjane02 I couldn't read this and not comment.What an incredibly hard decision to have to make.I can't imagine how much resentment goes to your son.I have a brother like that who has abandoned 2 children! And contributes nothing! I feel for you and for what you're going through.Your sister sounds wonderful too and between you both,you are making a difference to those innocent little ones lives.My brother asked me to keep his son once(his 3rd child and the only 1 he has since stuck with) I would have kept him along with my 4 but the Mother wouldn't allow it.They drink and do some drugs and though their son has witnessed alot and not been cared for the way he should have been,he has done OK thankfully! If the children get to stay with family and can see eachother then that's good.Its not like the state has taken them,thats a whole other ball game.Wishing you all the best for the future with the children.For every rubbish,selfish parent,there are many other wonderful people in the world that will care for their children much better than they ever could!

I know as everyone has already said, in an ideal world the children should be kept together, but there are other considerations, one of which is you.
I say this only because from my experience of having three children in the house for over a year, it’s a strain.
I don’t know all of your circumstances, but I know for us it’s not so bad, everyone has a bedroom, everyone apart from the baby has a bathroom, we have a decent sized garden, and we have three adults in the house.
But the amount of extra cleaning, the endless cooking of meals, the mess everywhere, but most of all for me, the lack of any time to myself, I love silence, and the televisions seem to be on all the time, or electronic games. They tend to wind each other up which inevitably end in tears.
I love them all very much, I’m very pleased that they got out of the situation they were in before lockdown, I’m very close to one grandchild, and the toddler is a constant source of joy and amusement.
But I often feel resentful, and I hate feeling that way.

I agree with mumofmadboys, I think you’re a hero bjane to do what you’re doing for your little grandsons.
It used to be quite common for children to live with other members of the extended family & it might well be in the best interests of your GS’s for the both of them for the younger to live with your sister.
I hope you can get the professional help and advice you need to keep the family together.
You don’t say whether your GS’s are at school or kindergarten - presumably CV-19 has affected that, but perhaps things might be easier when they can return to school. I know the picture is different in different parts of the US.
Good luck & let us know how things go.

i tend to think that proposal is the best option, OP.
some people have rigid ideas.
in an ideal world, the children would have caring competent parents. this whole situation is far from ideal.
how far away does your sister live.
my only question is whether you OP can realistically cope with all the on-going responsibility of raising one child with special needs.
how old are you. what is your health like. do you have a partner or other people around you to give support.
i don't agree that the brothers must be kept together at all costs. there are other considerations.
if they are adopted by strangers they will lose all contact with their birth family, and with you, so that would be another wrench.
when i was young i would have quite happily lived with my aunt; i used to go stay with her on saturday afternoon and sleep on the divan in her living room, going back sunday after church. it was walkable distance about a mile and a half. she used to wash my hair in the bath. and i could watch the long goods trains go past, across the scrubland where the bee keeper roamed, like a space-man. it was a happy time.
i think your/your sister's idea is a good one.

I think it a big mistake to separate the boys, you need help to all stay together, cannot your sister just support you in doing that, and be a loving Auntie. I don’t see why she must own own one, brothers need to be together. So sorry you have this awful problem, but it will get better if you get help. Splitting them up seems hard and will have repercussions their whole life.

I am full of admiration for you bjane. You are doing a great job. I hope you make the best decision for all involved and I wish you well.

ExD

bjane02 I can't help noticing your lack of response!
How old are the children? Are they old enough to discuss things with you and tell you how they feel? You do need professional help too, this isn't a couple of puppies we're re-homing.
Could you try a 'dry run' with the little boy going to his aunt for three or four of months just to see if they can cope with the separation? He might thrive on a one-to-one basis.

The boys are 4 & 5. I might mention that the oldest has a brain issue that requires a shunt and has developmental delays too. That with the younger one hyperactive it’s been a lot of work to manage them. I’m doing my best.

If my sister takes the younger one we’d transition slowly. He knows her already anyway. My sister has already adopted the brothers older sister as well. Not my granddaughter cause she has a different dad. So he’d be with his older sister. So of the 3 sibling group I’d have one and my sister would have 2. The thought is I help my oldest grandson with his delays and my sister helps the youngest with his hyperactivity.

I’m stressed thinking about it. I’m so disappointed in my son.

Well have to disagree a little GG65. The older sibling is a child too and shouldn’t have the responsibility of being a caregiver to the younger child.

The dependency and demands of one sibling upon a brother or sister can be very detrimental and can, when it is deliberately manipulative, be a form of abuse.

It’s sometimes a massive relief to a sibling to get away from that. The needs of the more dependent don’t necessarily come first.

We don’t know how these children feel but all I’m saying is keeping siblings together isn’t always the best for them.

OP

Is your sister fully aware of the issues with the youngest?
It is different to live it 24/7 vs having breaks in between (occasional caregiver, for example)

Peasblossom

I just want to say that it isn’t always best for siblings to be kept together.

I know we all want to think that it’s a supportive relationship, but often it isn’t when the siblings have been raised in a difficult environment. Sibling bullying and abuse is very real.

There are two adults here who each feel they can give individual children the love and attention that they need and can make a difference to their lives.

Personally I think that would be better than the OP struggling with the needs of two and then possibly becoming ill.

The children could still keep in close contact with each other as both adoptions would be in the family.

I fully understand what you are saying, but the OP hasn’t mentioned anything about sibling abuse, simply that the younger sibling is “wildfire crazy”.

None of this is the OP’s fault and if she is struggling and can’t manage, that is in no way her fault either.

But let’s not pretend that splitting up the siblings in this way is going to be anything other than utterly traumatic for them. And will be yet another abandonment by a caregiver for the younger one.

I don’t see how you can separate them. Could you adopt them but with your sister helping ?

In the UK, Social Services would be involved, there would probably be a family conference, and the final decision would go to a Family Court, based on reports from all concerned. I have known cases like yours (my sympathies) and decisions depend on many factors, some of which have been mentioned above. Iam64 describes the orders that can be made in the UK, which are more flexible.

I have no doubt that with good will and efforts on everyone's part, the arrangement you describe could work. Indeed, I can think of two families where the children thrived in similar circumstances. However, it needs to be carefully discussed and mediated, and in the UK can involve mandated involvement of health services.

I know that in the US & other places, laws and practice vary by state. Are you able to ask for professional help to explore these possibilities?

Good luck

bjane02 I can't help noticing your lack of response!
How old are the children? Are they old enough to discuss things with you and tell you how they feel? You do need professional help too, this isn't a couple of puppies we're re-homing.
Could you try a 'dry run' with the little boy going to his aunt for three or four of months just to see if they can cope with the separation? He might thrive on a one-to-one basis.