Feeling sidelined

"the child's mother goes out to work, and naturally wants to build the primary relationship of her daughter with herself" OK so does that have to include the OP being ignored by her d.i.l. at her son's 30th birthday luncheon welbeck?

Does that mean that the OP has to be supervised when she's with her GD? Does that mean that the OP must be satisfied with watching her d.i.l. play with her GC because she isn't allowed too? Does that mean that the OP's d.i.l. needs to refuse to allow her D to play with the toys the OP has bought for her?

Of course not.

I'm so sorry you are being treated this way Twinstar. It has to be experienced to know how terribly hurtful and heartbreaking it is.

There's nothing you can do I'm sorry to say except enjoy what time and interaction you have with your GD and hope that with time things will improve.

I hope they do.

The first two paragraphs of your post are spot on Nansnet.

OP writes,
I’m very aware of giving them time together and not intruding,

how do you mean, giving them time together.
what would DIL write on this subject.
you seem to have quite a lot of visiting time.
the child's mother goes out to work, and naturally wants to build the primary relationship of her daughter with herself.

I would cut back a bit. If 1.5 hours is their limit make sure you are on your way after an hour. I expect that your DiL senses your desperation and probably is trying to control it. You may find that things settle down if everyone relaxes a bit. I don't think that my own daughter would have tolerated me taking a GC off for a walk in the middle of a family get together. Things may not be as you would wish but it is her daughter. Maybe focus more on your DiL, chat to her, build a good relationship, ignore the GD for a bit. Make the most of what you have, even if its not perfect.

I’m sure time and patience will sort it all out. Perhaps don’t sit there till DIL hints for you to leave, go before.
Don’t overstay your welcome. 1.5 hours twice a week or whatever is more than enough for a working mum to have her MIL there.
I feel sure it will all come right in the end, especially if she has another baby she will relinquish her tight control of the older child.
Just try to enjoy your time with both mum and toddler at the moment.
Offer to help with abit of ironing, gardening, shopping, anything to keep the lines of communication open with your DIL.

I didn’t particularly read it that the OP wants alone time with her granddaughter, just to be able to sit and play and read with her, rather than watching mum do it. She does mention about going for a walk though. Is this alone? Or with the mum?

I didn’t let any grandparents take my children out alone at any age to be honest. I felt they weren’t trustworthy enough.

I’m another one for talking, although to be fair, it never did us any good with extended family!

OP, your son knows you, and you ( hopefully), him. Maybe start with him, and then both together. You could just wait and see how things pan out in a few years.

So sad to hear your experiencing this. Are you on your own, or do you have a husband/ partner? Other children? Grandchildren?
I personally, would speak to my son, otherwise you could be stuck in this limbo forever. It’s been 18 months already.
You do risk the relationship worsening I know, but it’s already not good, with a great potential to get worse as it picks up speed.
If people don’t talk, nothing can get resolved. It could be your DIL thinks you’re not that bothered. I know I’m clutching at straws here, but I’m trying to give her the benefit of the doubt. I always think there has to be something,when people behave like this. Your son may not have noticed, so give him a chance.
Don’t put up with it and be ‘happy with your lot,’ without at least exploring all avenues first.
Hope it goes well.

It always saddens me when I hear of paternal GPs being treated in this manner, and being made to feel this way. We all know that DDs generally gravitate towards their own parents, and that's fine. Most of us are, after all, DiLs ourselves and have been through it all before. This is not something new to present day mums.

Unless there's been relationship issues between a DiL, and MiL, previously, I can't understand why some DiLs deliberately make their husband's parents feel this way. There's no reason for making a GP, who isn't overstepping the mark, feel that they are not welcome, or they can't even have a little playtime, or read a book with their GC. It's very upsetting for any GP to be treated this way, if there is no valid reason.

Is your son present when you visit? If not, could it be that your DiL feels a little awkward/uncomfortable having you around when he's not there? I'd also appreciate the fact that they are both working, and have less time at home together with their little one. Someone did mention that a 1.5 hour visit, on your DiLs day off, may not be something she's happy with, but she's not stopped you from visiting, and understandably the little one will be needing her regular nap at some point.

Personally, I agree with whoever said that it's best for you to have a little word with your DiL and not your son, as you quite rightly said that he will simply tell his wife, and frankly, I think that will just get her back up, and make matters worse. There's no reason to be accusatory at all. Just be nice, and casually say that you hope she doesn't feel you're overstepping the mark with your visits, as you do understand how busy they are with work, etc. You could even casually, with a little laugh, say you don't mind doing the odd bit of housework/ironing/cooking, if it would help her out at all. That would mean less time for you with your GD, but it could help to ingratiate yourself to your DiL (even if she wouldn't dream of taking you up on the offer!), and help to improve/build upon your relationship with her. She doesn't have to take the offer literally, but she'll know you're thinking of her, and she'll probably sense that you are feeling a little unwelcome. Just tread carefully.

The issue with the gifts does sound rather rude, petty and unappreciative, not to let your GD play with them (assuming they are age appropriate, and adhere to safety regulations). My son has recently mentioned that they would like me to buy more wooden/fabric toys for my little GD, but I have been guilty of buying her the odd, 'all singing, all dancing, lights flashing', toys in the past ... just because! However, I do now always ask what they would like me to for birthday/Christmas presents, as I realise that parents have their own ideas, and I prefer to buy things that they actually want her to have.

It's a shame about the situation at your son's birthday lunch, it must've made for a bit of an awkward atmosphere. It's still early days, and maybe your DiL is simply a bit over anxious. Hopefully, given time, she will relax a little, and you'll be able to enjoy the time that you do get to spend with your GD.

Don't try to rush the issue. Remain calm, casual, and polite at all times. There will no doubt be a time when they need you, and they'll let you know.

Yes I think the answer is to bide your time. She’s still a baby . Wait until she gets a little older and I’m sure lovely times will be in store for both of you. Take a step back and let them come to you.

“ No-one looked after my DD1 until she was nearly 3 and I was in labour with DD2. ”. Good heavens whyever not ?

It’s very odd that she won’t let you interact with the child. I think my MIL felt ike this with my DDs at this age but they both went through a phase of clinging to me when other people are around. DD2 still is, DD1 is 3 though and will happily now drag MIL off up to her room to play with her so it will likely change as she gets older.

As for the gifts, as long as age appropriate I really can’t understand that. But my SIL likes wooden toys for her DD, I think it’s a bit daft but try and buy her those sorts of things. MIL though (SILs mom) buys the plastic light up sort of toys (she does for my DDs as well but I don’t care) and SIL does take the piss out of it and avoids her DD playing with them. It’s ridiculous and quite snobbish really.

I don’t think not being left to look after her ‘unsupervised’ is fair to complain about though. No-one looked after my DD1 until she was nearly 3 and I was in labour with DD2. My parents now look after DDs whilst I work and I wouldn’t ask MIL to but shes very lax about safety, doesn’t really ‘get’ car seats, thinks we’re overreacting with choking hazards (lolly pops and grapes, nothing over the top!) and FIL smokes in the house as well. They’re quite dismissive of how ‘things weren’t like that when they had kids’ which makes both me and DH reluctant to leave DDs with them? Is there any chance your son or DIL may feel like that?

She does sound quite standoffish with you, how was your relationship beforehand? I would try maybe focussing on making more of an effort to talk to her and get to know her more, rather than your GD at the moment? See if that helps?

For the gifts - why not getting something from a wish list they give you?

OP

How as your relationship with dil before baby?

You have two very common issues taking place here
1. Competition and comparing yourself to the other grandparents
2. You had some expectations of what a nana would be and dont match reality

Did you talk to your son of what role they envisioned you to have as grandmother?
Your role as grandmother will be defined by what the parents of the child think, as he/she is their child first, your gc second
Parents hold the power here, not you

A visit of 1.5 hours is great!
Is your son present in these visits or your dil is hosting?

Taking the child for a walk: major no no without asking and getting both parents' approval first.
Could this be a reason why you feel so supervised by dil and son, this natural for parents to know where their kids are at all times

There has to be background for this - your son and dil have strong boundaries.
That usually happens with previous incidents

Wait until she is older and see what happens is my advice .

agnurse

Grandparenting isn't a competition or a zero sum game.

I'd suggest focusing on enjoying the time you DO get to spend with her.

My parents see our daughter much more than Hubby's parents do - because they live 4 hours' drive away, and Hubby's parents live across the pond.

TBH, whenever I hear someone comparing what they get to what the other GPs get, I am reminded of a young person saying, "But so and so gets to go/do/wear/have whatever! It's not FAIR!" What was your response when your children made such statements?

Read the post agnurse.

I was expected to watch her play with her mum, who distracted her if I tried to interact with GD

How can she enjoy her time with GD under the pressure of this type of behaviour?

Please dont treat OP's concerns as petty.

I think perhaps if you are going to discuss it with anyone it should actually be with your daughter in law rather than through your son? Pick one thing and just ask her nicely if you have done something wrong .

I agree. No point putting your son as a piggy in the middle when you are trying to build a "grown up" relationship with your dil.

agnurse there is a difference between open jealous competition between grandparents and being excluded from perfectly reasonable interaction and involvement on a visit!

And I notice you tried to take Gd for a walk- why? You don’t remove a child from their parents without their permission/encouragement. You can offer if your GD is getting wriggly and impatient and her parents are occupied. But you don’t just say ‘I’m taking the baby’ without prompting!

A visit of an hour and a half with a young child seems like more than sufficient without overstaying. Your DIL would probably like uninterrupted time with her child, and it’s far more essential that she have that with her kid than you have it with your granddaughter. At 18 months old, she’s just really starting to understand her world and the players in it. I’m sure she knows who you are- my kids saw their grandparents very infrequently due to distance for their first several years of life but certainly knew who they were! Let go of the expectations you might have had- they aren’t your dils or gc’s job to fulfill. Let your ds send invitations- but it sounds like you absolutely are included and as long as you don’t complain and make things uncomfortable for DIL- I’m sure in time she’ll gain more confidence in your relationship. The response to someone being guarded with you isn’t to be more demanding.

Has anything happened?
I'm sorry if that comes across rude but what was your relationship like before your DIL had that baby?
Has it always been frosty?

And wheres your son when your are visiting?

Twinestar just another angle. Do you think dil might feel threatened by you or even scared? Please don’t think I am accusing you. With her own mum she can say or do things and be more relaxed.

This is going to be very difficult to overcome. Rather than buy gd things ask dil if there is anything she would like you get. You say you ask to visit. Perhaps this seems pushy when dil has a busy life but she does fit you in nonetheless. How often do you ask? Maybe wait to be invited? Then when you get there you want to play with gd which could make dil feel excluded, that you only come to see gd. Perhaps you could offer to do the ironing or something, rather than as one post suggests her doing the ironing whilst playing with gd.

I may have got it all wrong but just want to give you a different perspective.

If I was working I would not be prioritising doing ironing. I'd be making the most of the time I do have with my child.

OP, my MIL would probably have felt very similarly to you. I was never shutting her out though. I'd be happy to discuss further if you want to over PM.

I think the point twinstar is making is that she isn’t allowed to interact with her granddaughter such as playing with her or reading her a story. If I was working I would gladly use the time to do the ironing or whatever whilst grandparent was entertaining the child. This would allow family time at the weekend.

Everyone seems to be missing the point that the daughter in law works 3 days a week !!!!
If I was in this situation the last thing I’d want would be Mother in law ( and I loved both of mine) coming round for I don’t know how long when I had enough to do on those 2 days.
Leaving the weekend free to do family stuff.

I feel sad for you twinstar and also for your grand daughter who is being deprived of a relationship with you. I can’t offer any advice other than to continue seeing your granddaughter as you do now. Hopefully things might change in the future. I feel that your daughter in law is being unkind but sadly it is often the case that the parents of a son are treated in this way.

Twinstar, I understand you feel sidelined . It is so sad because you do understand that your DIL's mum will come first with her. However it is very distressing for you to feel that when you are with them your DIL distracts the child away from you. agnurse I think you are being a little harsh! Of course grandparenting is not a competition. All twinstar wants is to not be ignored when she visits and to be allowed to build a relationship with her grandchild. Surely that is not too much to ask?

My dil suffers from anxiety and perhaps my advice from my therapist might help as my relationship with dil has improved in leaps and bounds.

With your dil’s relationship with her own family, it is easier for her to be upfront about her needs/wants. She will be more comfortable with them to communicate what she likes/doesn’t like.

With you she can’t be frank, or impolite so she will always be more comfortable with her own family. Perhaps start in small baby steps. You said that she doesn’t accept or use your gifts, young mothers are given very strong advice/pressure these
days about everything including toys. My dil only has wooden toys, fabric or bpa free plastic toys. Perhaps ask her to send you a link to something she would like for dgc?
Have a chat with your son. Explain you understand why she is more comfortable with her parents babysitting as you can always be more honest with your own parents, but that you are happy to try supervised until she is comfortable and work towards that goal without pressure.