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Is Gender Critical the new Pro Life?

(752 Posts)
GagaJo Fri 12-Nov-21 16:55:32

I was musing this while playing lego with DGS this afternoon.

Pro life individuals claim to be anti abortion because they want to protect the life of the unborn baby, but resent public spending on the baby once it is born. They're judgemental about single-parents. In the US, they want to deny access to free contraception to women, BUT refuse to hold men accountable for paying child support. Doesn't sound very pro anything to me.

Gender critical individuals claim to 'follow the science' but then refuse to accept any science that shows that human and animal life forms are born in categories other than just male and female. They're critical of other cultures that have accepted alternative gender expressions beyond the binary. While claiming not to be totally anti trans, they want to shut off any access to support or treatment (the hooha about the Tavistock Clinic and Kiera Bell) at a point in a young person's life where it could help them avoid developing the unwanted sexual characteristics of the gender they want to transition from. After all that, they will only accept trans individuals who are 100% post surgery, despite not wanting those individuals to be able to access surgery, hormones or treatment. They also deny the evidence and existence of these individuals historically, prefering to see the visibility of trans as a patriarchal plot to deny cis women their rights.

I'm sceptical. It is a 'damned if you do and damned if you don't' position for trans individuals within the eyes of the gender critical, in my opinion.

Let the battle commence.

Disclaimer
I am a life-long feminist.
I will not be responding to demands and insistence for answers.
I will, however, enter into polite discussion.

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:28:06

What exactly did I say that was rude?

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:28:06

GagaJo I've said the same thing.

Like you I am a lifelong feminist. I've been surprised recently that gender critical feminists have not previously come accross feminist issues I've mentioned.

It seems to me, and I am only being honest about my perceptions, that feminism becomes suddenly more important to some when trans issues are mentioned.

I have been told categorically that I cannot be a feminist for being a trans ally even though doing so exactly conforms to being a feminist.

It's a puzzle

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:30:04

How does being a trans ally conform to being a feminist.

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:31:16

What feminist issues do you think other feminists haven't encountered

GagaJo Sat 13-Nov-21 21:32:11

Agree VioletSky. Whereas, if you track the protest movements, many of the feminist arguments from the 1980s/90s seige into the early queer rights movement, which preceded / seeded the trans activism we see now.

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:32:18

GrannyMacawell

How does being a trans ally conform to being a feminist.

Because it does

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:33:05

GrannyMacawell

What feminist issues do you think other feminists haven't encountered

I don't have to relate all my conversations to you, what I said stands on its own.

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:33:22

That's a great explanation. .pathetic

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:33:49

It so doesn't

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:33:51

GagaJo

Agree VioletSky. Whereas, if you track the protest movements, many of the feminist arguments from the 1980s/90s seige into the early queer rights movement, which preceded / seeded the trans activism we see now.

Yes it's a very natural progression

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:34:32

twanw .because

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:37:31

When anyone says to me.,Because I say so. i know they basically are talking from the other side of garston

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:38:26

and good luck over there

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:40:25

reminds me of the bulletin of Liverpool

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:45:46

Feminism is about everyone having equal rights and opportunities, that includes all genders so of course feminism should protect trans people.

Galaxy Sat 13-Nov-21 21:46:06

Because I say sogrin. And what was the other one it's not based on fact. I know I am completely convinced. Yes what feminist issues do you think we dont understand. Because obviously all gender critical feminists have the same level of knowledge about everything.

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:51:07

Reminds me of that saying

"The savage is not the one who lives in the forest, the savage is the one who destroys it"

The vast majority of trans people are just out there living, they aren't harming you so why this continuous need to cut them down every time they try to grow.

Galaxy Sat 13-Nov-21 21:53:01

Could you point out where I have done that on this thread.

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:53:02

The vast majority of women are just out there living, they aren't harming you so why this continuous need to cut them down every time they try to grow.

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 21:56:51

GrannyMacawell I don't.

Trans people aren't eroding your rights, only wanting their own too.

With a little consideration you can grow many different trees in the same forest.

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 21:58:30

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Peasblossom Sat 13-Nov-21 22:12:56

Violetsky, how do you view the trans stance of gay eradication.
That gays and lesbians should be compelled to transition.

Is that not an erosion of their right to be homosexuals?

GrannyMacawell Sat 13-Nov-21 22:17:23

Are you a woman

VioletSky Sat 13-Nov-21 22:21:56

Peasblossom

Violetsky, how do you view the trans stance of gay eradication.
That gays and lesbians should be compelled to transition.

Is that not an erosion of their right to be homosexuals?

All trans people?

Come on, bit of a reach, of course I don't agree with that but the fact that I'm hearing it for the first time speaks volumes to me.

Unless a majority of the estimated between 200,000 and 500,000 trans people in the UK are saying it, in which case I'd obviously be, oi trans people! No!

If a trans person ever says that to me or I come accross them discussing it, I'll let them know what I think if that helps

ElaineI Sat 13-Nov-21 22:27:55

Clearly lego has a lot to answer to! shock